Posted by Impermanence on March 9, 2005, at 19:04:51
In reply to Re: Why death is an option for me » Impermanence, posted by Shy_Girl on March 9, 2005, at 15:40:12
>> Well...all I can really say is that suicide can be inherently selfish. In the egocentric view, the world ceases to exist when one perishes.
Yes suicide is selfish, which is why I'm probably still here as I could never intentionally put my mother through that kind of pain, but thats also a form of selfishness masquerading as charity. Thinking I'm still here because I love my mother and would not want to hurt her, "I'm so great for sticking it out for somebody else", the ego is always there like a dark shadow. Every act is selfish if you get to the root of it. True selfless charity is virtually nonexistent. Even saints worked with a goal of heaven in mind lol, I'm such a cynic!!Something pulled me back from the brink of madness four times, love, fear, panic? who knows, I was drunk. Suicide attempts 90% of the time are a cry for help, it's unconsciously selfish. It's also a road to recovery, it's the end of the line and time to get off and try something different like accept help and let everybody know how bad you're feeling. But is suicide, when the indivudal with nobody left to take responsibility for selfish? Maybe, well it is thinking of yourself, you could be out helping others!! If the observer believes a certain moral is absolute and the indivudal does not have the right to end his or her own life on their own terms then the observer is too being selfish, subjecting the indivudal to his or her own dogma!!!! It's also selfish for a family member or friend to try to stop someone committing suicide, why should they have to suffer life to keep others happy?? The realm of selfishness goes on and on. Maybe selfishness is an illusion? after all it's all in our heads, a chemical reaction??
The idea of the world ceasing to exist after I went never entered my mind. It was I who would cease to exist.
>> I agree, but I do think that what society chooses to be right or wrong is not simply the result of whim and fancy. There must be inherent advantages for humans of all different cultures to develop similar beliefs about right and wrong. Now, whether or not these tendancies to conform are 'good' or 'bad' may depend on the particular environment at a particular time. The core beliefs about right and wrong seem consistent and longlasting, so perhaps they have been advantageous in the past...it remains to be seen whether or not they will in the future.Of course, for we all want an easy life at the end of the day. Nobody (well most) don't want to see children being hacked up for dog food like cattle now do they?? But is it right to hack up cattle?? Well I for one don't get emotionally attached to many cattle and I've been programmed to believe it's natural, so I have no problem eating steak and feeding them to my dog. Eating my dog is a disturbing thought to me but I'm sure they would have no problem sticking him in the wok in China. And try finding a burger in India LOL. Morals are relative to the minds and cultures that thought them up to make life eaiser for themselves but they are not absoulute. A suicide bomber in Palestine is a martyr, but in israel is an evil terrorist!!
>> I'm sorry you had to go through so much. Four attempts...that's rough. The game of life...I know what you mean...it seems meaningless at times. From the outside, everyone and everything seems the same...people living to work and working to live...choosing to conform because that is what is comforable. I think this is a misconception though, because we are too egocentric. If I could somehow walk in another person's shoes, I think I would find most people have wonderfully detailed and intricate live...truly unique.
We all carry the ego around. "Ego is a need, it's a social need, a social by-product. You have two centers. One center you come with, which is given by existence itself. That is the self. And the other center, which is created by the society, is the ego. It is a false thing and a very great trick. Through the ego society is controlling you. You have to behave in a certain way, because only then does the society appreciate you. You have to walk in a certain way, you have to laugh in a certain way, you have to follow certain manners, a morality, a code. Only then will the society appreciate you, and if it doesn't, your ego will be shaken. And when the ego is shaken, you don't know where you are, who you are.
The ego is not individual. Ego is a social phenomenon, it is society, its not you. But it gives you a function in the society, a hierarchy in the society. And if you remain satisfied with it, you will miss the whole opportunity of finding the self."
And that's why we are all so miserable and afrid. A world full of fear, and all negative emotion stems from fear. The ego comes continuously in conflict with others because every ego is so unconfident about itself. It has to be, its a false thing. Its ways are so subtle and cunning, you have to be very, very alert, only then will you see it. Don't try to be humble. Just try to see that all misery, all anguish comes through it. Meditation is a great aid to seeing through the illusions of the ego, it's not an easy job but when you start deprogramming your brain life just gets easier and easier. Thats why I feel like an outcast at times, I don't want to be part of the silly game. Push a button - get a reaction!!! It's so trivial. I like to just observe, let the chaos unfold before me while I smoke a spliff lol. When it comes to politics, war and capitalism gone insane though I tend to get heated!!!
>> I recently got into astronomy (sorry, no astrology for me!). I've always been interested in learning about the cosmos. Camping out in dark skies, checking out telescopes and gagets, looking at galaxies, star clusters, nebulas and meteors, wondering about superstring theory...it's awe inspiring.Wooops LOL, *ment astronomy*, thanks for pointing that out for me. I have a telescope, the creators on the moon look amazing. Its very hard to observe anything else with it, everythings just so far away lol. I'm fascinated with the universe. Did you ever see the movie K-Pax, Well Kevin Spacey's character has a theroy that the universe has been exploding and imploding on itself infinitely, I believe this to be true, which in turn supports the theory of the big bang. It makes a lot of sense when you think about. If super strings go beyond our universe and continue infinitly it would explain why the universe might strech out like a balloon and then is forced back on itself on the path to another big bang and on and on. Just like the breath of life inflating - deflating / exploding - imploding to a single point of enegery so powerful it has the force to give us the universe we know of. Maybe our whole universe is the size of a to particle, a quark inside an atom inside another universe. No matter how far out or in we look we find no end!!!! I believe there are hundreds of billions of universes never mind stars... It blows my mind sometimes thinking about it all, it can leave you feeling like a meaningless blip in a sea of neverending chaos but then why do I have a universe in my mind?? Perhaps there is an infinite plane of consciousness, our low level mutant brains somehow developed the ability to trap it and build an ego around it?? Maybe we are the universe evolving to observe itself??
>> It's difficult for me to grasp the whole spirituality concept. The universe is seemingly wonderfully complex, but for me it is enough to be able to explain parts of it. Meditation and stuff is good because it calms one down.Thats the beauty of spirituality, it's about unlearning, deprogramming your mind of all it's ever been programmed to believe. Going back to nothingness, your true self, perfection.
>> Time is relative. I don't think it matters whether or not I'm young or not. I'm just going to do whatever feels good at the moment. It is however, highly unlikely I'm going to end my life at this time because I live with my parents and I cannot get together my plans for a peaceful death.
Time is relative yes, but so is your anxiety and your pain and suffering and loneliness. Everything is always changing, as my name says; Impermanence!!! Nothing lasts, in two years you may be the happiest girl on the planet. I think it does matter that you're young, you will grow to appreacate the wonder that is life as you grow older. The things that bother you now could be like a minor inconvenience in a years time. Life may mean more to you in the future, you may make somebody happy, save a life. Bring more people into the world, discover a cure for aids. The possibilities are endless. You always have the option of suicide and death is inevitable so maybe hang on for a few more years. Why waste such a beautiful intelligent mind, you are one in 6.2 billion.
Anyway who am I to talk. Sorry about the long pointless rant lol!!!xxx
poster:Impermanence
thread:468490
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/social/20050305/msgs/468914.html