Posted by Impermanence on March 11, 2005, at 3:18:14
In reply to Re: Civility and a question... » Impermanence, posted by 10derHeart on March 11, 2005, at 1:06:51
>>> You are certainly entitled to your opinion, and I don’t intend to infringe on your right to free speech. But when I read this, I felt a little demeaned just for not holding the same view as you. My question would be, are you saying that someone who *doesn’t* think moral and religious issues are, "nothing more than man made philosophies," is unintelligent and irrational?Why would you feel demeaned over a strangers "opinion"? If your faith was strong enough woulden't you think I was the fool. I'm certainly NOT saying people who hold religious beliefs are unintelligent and irrational, thats called twisting words, and I hope you're not looking for a message board argument because I don't intend to have one. I did say "any intelligent rational people understand are nothing more than man made philosophies" and people who do think this way are usually intelligent rational people which is what I was saying. Thats not to say someone who holds a religious belief system is not intelligent. In my own personal life experence I have found that the type of person who questions things and walks through the fear into the unknown and decides not to comform to a train of thought is usually intelligent, logical, scientific and in many cases full of wisdom. But I don't have an opinion on those that decide to follow religion and I diden't say anything about anybody who did. I envy them getting comfort in a place "I feel" is an illusion. And I respect their choice. If I'm "certainly entitled to my opinion" as you said, and it was a post addressed to Shy_Girl, and I never said anything about people who hold religious beliefs then whats the problem. Why probe the mind of somebody who obviously has chosen Science and awareness over the bible for an opinion on people who comform to religion?? I don't need an opinion, I have better things to think about. Everybodys equal to me, I'm an *ss, you're an *ss, we are all a bunch of *sses just trying to figure things out in the best way we know how.
>>> I have also become spiritually aware. In my case, it is in the context of a certain religious tradition. Therefore, I did feel put down when you described religion as "crap." To be blunt, this statement personally offended me. Perhaps you could have just said something like, "I’ve become very spiritually aware, but I don’t mean by following any particular religion or belief system, as none of those work for me." Or something clearer - that was just my clumsy attempt. Strong language, as long as it expresses your opinion without a sense of scorn, or "name-calling" that comes with a phrase like, "…I have no time for that crap," I think would be still be fine.
Again MY OPINION, religion to me means nothing, to hold that idea is my prerogative and it should not offend you for it had no offencive remark towards you. Again I think you're looking for an argument and not truly offended. How could me saying "I" have no time for that crap be offencive to anybody. I'm not saying I have no time for any people or race. I just have no time for an idea, a philosophy. I never even named a religion.
>>> Wording things carefully here at Babble, especially when it comes to deeply personal issues such as religious beliefs, should allow everyone to have a voice without causing each other distress. Or at least minimize it as much as possible. Does that make sense?Reading things carefully helps too.
>>> No offense taken here, I just had questions. Since you told Shy Girl you think it’s "crazy" to commit suicide "so early in your life," at what point would it be okay? Is there a certain age, or maturity level, or something else, that makes it more acceptable to you?
Yes there is actually and I think you understood perfectly clear what I ment. I believe people should strive to a certen point of enlightenment or wisdom before they do anything drastic, if they get there they most likely won't want to end there own life anymore. It could take 30 years or a lifetime, some wake up by a few pages of a book, but I think it's important to see the bigger picture and understand your inner self better before you make a decision you can't go back on. As I also said "Don't make a decision with your EGO mind you can't go back on that your true self would never conceive of". Make an effort to let go of the ego and see with a clensed mind. If you still feel you want to end your life with a more aware mind then so be it. Thats the choice of the individual. I also think it's important to explore every avenue of treatment, and try it again and again. There are some people who never feel good, even with a mind full of wisdom, nobody left to take responsibility for and all treatments exhausted, in this case I believe it's O.K. to take your own life.
>>> I posted in the spirit of trying to help us all stay within the civility guidelines. I expect the same scrutiny from you and everyone else. Including anything in this post, of course, that I wrote that may be a problem. I just think it's really important to keep trying, bit by bit, to understand each other better. Sometimes for me, that means speaking up when it's uncomfortable to do so. Respectfully, 10derHeartI diden't say anything offensive about anybody and I won't apologize for anything I did say apart from using the word crap. I should have said I have no time for that train of thought. So for that I'm sorry. I mearly expressed how "I" feel about an idea. I think you should start taking life with a pinch of salt and maybe finding something to keep you busy would help you not to get so easily offended.
Respectfully,
Impermanence
poster:Impermanence
thread:468490
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/social/20050305/msgs/469577.html