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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 8 of 8. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by JLx on September 5, 2007, at 15:32:15
Eleanor Roosevelt famously said, "No one can make you feel inferior without your consent". I know this is true, but find it hard not to consent to feeling inferior while being fat. Why is it so difficult?
I recall a concept from a long-ago sociology class called "the looking glass self": that we look to others to try to see ourselves as they see us and this image in some part becomes us. When we see love and acceptance mirrored by people who love us we view ourselves to be lovable and acceptable. Now consider the mirror that society reflects to the overweight. No need to spell that out is there?
So how do we feel good about ourselves "as is" when we are fat? If you haven't already seen this on YouTube, check out Joy Nash's "Fat Rant": http://www.youtube.com/user/joynash1 There are a lot of good thoughts in there, and isn't she splendid? :)
Or how about the video for Mika's "Big Girl, You Are Beautiful"? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcRiXOONqf0 Try watching that without smiling and tapping your toe!
In a live performance in a TV studio, one of the "talent" can't say the title without a nervous chuckle and then said something about Mika singing it to someone, and was quick to say "but nobody here", nervous chuckle, chuckle. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ew59jlj4ZVg&mode=related&search= No, Goddess forbid, there should be an on-camera fat person working at a television studio! Of course, if Mika wasn't a thin cutie himself, forget the TV appearance for him too.
We spend 35 BILLION $$$ on the weight loss industry each year, yet we get fatter. We seem to hate and fear fat and fat people as a society, yet we collectively get fatter.
There is no motivator like judgment and self-loathing of our fat selves....to stay or get fatter. If society wants us to get thinner, for our health and those health care COSTS, dontcha know, then it should try giving us one great big hug and loving reflection of okayness as human being, and worthiness to simply be alive. But that's not likely to happen any time soon on a grand scale. No pun intended! ;)
So we have to do it. We absolutely need to internalize that we are okay and worthy of the best in life ourselves even if fat.
Lately I have been reading fat acceptance blogs. I find they help balance all the fat-trashing we receive from the mass media. Joy Nash has one: http://fatrantblog.wordpress.com/ I cracked up when she referred to "coming out" as a fat person. But I'd actually started doing this the last few years - just matter of factly referring to myself as fat. And I never run myself down either publicly or in my own head with fat-crap talk, e.g. "I'm so fat, I'm horrible".
It was on a blog that I saw this slogan:
We're here, we're sphere, get used to it. :)
How do you deal with self-esteem issues related to fat?
JL
Posted by zenhussy on September 6, 2007, at 4:38:21
In reply to Self-esteem and FAT, posted by JLx on September 5, 2007, at 15:32:15
Posted by ClearSkies on September 6, 2007, at 7:04:01
In reply to Self-esteem and FAT, posted by JLx on September 5, 2007, at 15:32:15
>
>
> So how do we feel good about ourselves "as is" when we are fat? If you haven't already seen this on YouTube, check out Joy Nash's "Fat Rant": http://www.youtube.com/user/joynash1 There are a lot of good thoughts in there, and isn't she splendid? :)It sure is a good video, and I laughed and smiled at a lot of it.
>
> So we have to do it. We absolutely need to internalize that we are okay and worthy of the best in life ourselves even if fat.
>Yikes. I just can't get past this. I've put on weight with the Remeron I'm on - inevitable, and uncomfortable. I don't *feel* very healthy like this.
> Lately I have been reading fat acceptance blogs. I find they help balance all the fat-trashing we receive from the mass media. Joy Nash has one: http://fatrantblog.wordpress.com/ I cracked up when she referred to "coming out" as a fat person. But I'd actually started doing this the last few years - just matter of factly referring to myself as fat. And I never run myself down either publicly or in my own head with fat-crap talk, e.g. "I'm so fat, I'm horrible".
>
> It was on a blog that I saw this slogan:
>
> We're here, we're sphere, get used to it. :)
>
> How do you deal with self-esteem issues related to fat?
>
> JL
>
>
I'm trying to deal with the self esteem issues that are cropping up by doing some yoga, which I had dropped this summer. So far I've gotten as far as dragging my mat out of the closet and following along on a TV broadcast. I'm working up to getting back to joining a yoga studio, but I want to walk in there with my self acceptance strong and intact. At the moment I'm not feeling the least bit secure about my steadiness on my feet. Like my centre of balance has shifted too quickly. More yoga, more yoga.CS
Posted by JLx on September 6, 2007, at 20:20:36
In reply to Re: Self-esteem and FAT » JLx, posted by ClearSkies on September 6, 2007, at 7:04:01
> > So we have to do it. We absolutely need to internalize that we are okay and worthy of the best in life ourselves even if fat.
> >
>
> Yikes. I just can't get past this. I've put on weight with the Remeron I'm on - inevitable, and uncomfortable. I don't *feel* very healthy like this.Feeling physically uncomfortable or that we're not as healthy as we'd like is one thing and internalizing fat shame messages is another, imo. If someone beloved to you gained as much weight as you have would that alter your estimation of them? Would they become less okay? Would you no longer wish the best that life has to offer for them? I'm guessing not. Yet that is the societal message we get when fat: that we're wrong, that we don't deserve the gifts of life, as if we should be punished.
It's been years since I read it, but I try to at least recall the title from time to time, "How To Be Your Own Best Friend" and consider myself if I were being a best friend to me.
And I know from long experience that the more I hate myself, my "as is" state of fat, the less I will actually do something about it because shame and shoulds are just not motivating. Negative thoughts do not result in positive action.
> I'm trying to deal with the self esteem issues that are cropping up by doing some yoga, which I had dropped this summer. So far I've gotten as far as dragging my mat out of the closet and following along on a TV broadcast. I'm working up to getting back to joining a yoga studio, but I want to walk in there with my self acceptance strong and intact. At the moment I'm not feeling the least bit secure about my steadiness on my feet. Like my centre of balance has shifted too quickly. More yoga, more yoga.
>
> CSThat sounds like a pretty big step to me. I've been trying to motivate myself to do strength training -- I have the book and the weights -- but so far have not done so. I don't want to tell you just how LONG I've had the book and the weights! ;)
"When you're ready, you'll do it", my therapist used to say. And not a minute before ! :)
Btw, what's the reason for weight gain from Remeron, do they know? A change in metabolism or something? I used to feel very sluggish on SSRIs, and all I wanted to eat was carbs and anything sugary.
JL
Posted by ClearSkies on September 6, 2007, at 20:50:58
In reply to Re: Self-esteem and FAT » ClearSkies, posted by JLx on September 6, 2007, at 20:20:36
>
> Btw, what's the reason for weight gain from Remeron, do they know? A change in metabolism or something? I used to feel very sluggish on SSRIs, and all I wanted to eat was carbs and anything sugary.
>
> JL
>
>As far as I know, the exact reason and action is not known, but Remeron is notorious for causing weight gain. It feels like my "I feel full" switch isn't working properly in my brain :-( and I'm still really sugar-happy. Carbs, not so much. Combined with the lethargy I felt with the start up on this medication, I spent a lot of time napping in the afternoon, going to bed early, and sleeping in. I think I might have been able to move quickly only if I'd been in physical danger. It has been such a godsend for my depression, though, that the flubberiness seems like a small price to pay at this point. I'd like to feel more sure-footed and comfortable overall.
I gotta get myself out to a yoga studio. Doing the TV shows has been horrible - all the commercials are for diet pills!!! How dare they!CS
Posted by JLx on September 11, 2007, at 23:09:24
In reply to Re: Self-esteem and FAT, posted by ClearSkies on September 6, 2007, at 20:50:58
> It feels like my "I feel full" switch isn't working properly in my brain :-( and I'm still really sugar-happy. > CSI know that feeling without the med. Sometimes more than others, which makes me wonder what is going on there.
Glutamine works for sugar cravings, in my experience, as long as I only take 500 mg. Perhaps 1000 mg. But I know that 1500 mg (in a day) gives me a bad reaction. Something to do with glutamine converting to glutamate and becoming excitotoxic. Calcium in high doses does the same thing to me. I used to feel that way all the time, before I figured this out.
I have been eating no sugar and no grains for about two weeks now. I guess it's a good sign that I'm no longer counting exactly how many days it's been! The glutamine really got me over the hump one day when I had strong sugar cravings.
I feel so much better when I don't eat sugar and grains, both physically and mentally/emotionally not being on that insulin spike/let down roller coaster, it's bewildering to me that I ever go back to it. Well, I usually do when in a self-destructive state of "Who cares?"
Self-care (and self-esteem) are such a challenge sometimes.
I'm a little surprised that there hasn't been more interest in this topic. I can't help but wonder if I had posted about how much I hate myself being fat, how ugly I feel with all this fat, how I look in the mirror and see my fat face and want to puke, etc. if I would have received more response.
I've learned though that while these feelings and thoughts may sometimes arise, I need to allow them and let go of them; not feed them. Or I just sink and wallow in self-loathing.
That's why fat acceptance is important to me. I think I'll title a new post on that, maybe it will generate some more interest. Tomorrow. I'm already up to late.
JL
Posted by ClearSkies on September 12, 2007, at 13:45:37
In reply to Re: Self-esteem and FAT » ClearSkies, posted by JLx on September 11, 2007, at 23:09:24
> I'm a little surprised that there hasn't been more interest in this topic. I can't help but wonder if I had posted about how much I hate myself being fat, how ugly I feel with all this fat, how I look in the mirror and see my fat face and want to puke, etc. if I would have received more response.
>I've been noticing that the "outlying" boards have been so very slow in traffic lately - it's really discouraging. I don't think it's a matter of what the type of post, really I don't! Just take a look at the Relationships and Substances boards... people just AREN'T posting there. I say, Keep It Up.
My therapist, who has been helping me get to my 2 year point in sobriety, has been helping me plan the next steps for me. Getting myself more active - I am the original role model for the couch potato, and I come from a fine family of couch potatoes - is critical in my mental health, yet it's a place where I keep falling down.
> I've learned though that while these feelings and thoughts may sometimes arise, I need to allow them and let go of them; not feed them. Or I just sink and wallow in self-loathing.
>
> That's why fat acceptance is important to me. I think I'll title a new post on that, maybe it will generate some more interest. Tomorrow. I'm already up to late.
>
> JL
>
>I don't want to wallow in anything - I want to be accepting of myself at any size. I can romanticize about how lovely I looked at a slender 21 years of age, but the truth was that I was terribly depressed and a very ill young woman then. I don't really want to go back, and I don't want to rose tint the image I have of myself, 24 years younger and 20 lbs lighter.
ClearSkies
Posted by JLx on September 12, 2007, at 21:31:28
In reply to Re: Self-esteem and FAT » JLx, posted by ClearSkies on September 12, 2007, at 13:45:37
> I've been noticing that the "outlying" boards have been so very slow in traffic lately - it's really discouraging. I don't think it's a matter of what the type of post, really I don't! Just take a look at the Relationships and Substances boards... people just AREN'T posting there. I say, Keep It Up.I usually primarily post on Alternative and poke my head in once in a while on the others to see what's up. Alternative hasn't had so many posts lately either compared with times past. There was a computer prob there for a bit wasn't there, where we had to change passwords. Perhaps that scared some people off or something.
> My therapist, who has been helping me get to my 2 year point in sobriety, has been helping me plan the next steps for me. Getting myself more active - I am the original role model for the couch potato, and I come from a fine family of couch potatoes - is critical in my mental health, yet it's a place where I keep falling down.
Well, I know what you mean. I have had a strength training book and all the weights for, um, I guess it's at least two years now, but have yet to muster the will to do it. (The iron dumbbells came in handy one winter when I had no power for three days though. I heated them in my gas oven and put them in my bed to warm it!)
I have been walking regularly for 20 some years now. It helps to have a dog as motivator there. When my dog got old and then died, I really slacked off for a few months. Then I got a new dog and he was killed by a car too, so I slacked off again for a few months. Big mistake. I felt really out of shape when I began again. And this is just walking.
Now I have a golden retriever who needs lots of exercise. It's been too hot all summer to do as much as I'd like, but now it's cool and it feels good to get out. I'm trying to walk a little faster and longer than before. I have two nice places to walk, a paved bike trail that goes along a river for nearly two miles and nearly 7 miles on a mountain bike trail in a little wooded park. I usually takes the woods walk so the pooch can be his wild and free self.
Exercise really helps my depression and overall sense of well being. I have a treadmill too but rarely use it as it doesn't get my dog out. I know somebody who puts her dog on her treadmill, but I don't know about that! Treadmills can be cool when you're first getting in the walking habit since you can just jump on it when you get a spare 10-15 minutes to start with.
> >
> >
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> I don't want to wallow in anything - I want to be accepting of myself at any size. I can romanticize about how lovely I looked at a slender 21 years of age, but the truth was that I was terribly depressed and a very ill young woman then. I don't really want to go back, and I don't want to rose tint the image I have of myself, 24 years younger and 20 lbs lighter.> ClearSkies
Yeah, I was pretty messed up when I was younger too.
I have no illusions now about how I'm going to look so great if I lose a significant amount of weight, as I'd like, because I know everything is just going to sag more. What I am seeking now instead is to feel better physically, have more energy, feel lighter moving around. I feel better already since I quit the sugar and grains, and I've lost 8 pounds. Not a lot in the grand scheme of things, but still it's that much less I'm dragging around. When my dog got old she used to raise her paw sometimes when we walked in the winter, like it got a cramp or something from the cold. So I'd pick her up and hold her close to my body to warm her and keep walking. She weighed 20 pounds and it was amazing how much I felt that extra 20 pounds when I was carrying her. You don't feel it when you lose it gradually so I'm going to try to remember that when I lose 20 pounds here. Which will be just around the corner. ;)
JL
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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