![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 487 to 511 of 948. Go back in thread:
Posted by fluffy on August 31, 2003, at 13:43:52
In reply to Lamictal Survey, posted by Ima on August 31, 2003, at 12:50:17
Hi Ima--
> For those who have reported sucess
> taking lamictal,
> are you still on it----I had partial success with Lamictal (no success on other AD's) I'm currently on 200mg and trying augmentation with Li b/c of prevalence of soft/rapid cycling on Lamictal only. So far, so good.
> and for how long?
-----7 months--
(it took a month or so to take effect & titrate up to therapeutic amt.
>
> I go to new pdoc this week
> and want to have some ideas worked out.
>
----GOOD LUCK Miss Ima!
Are you currently taking any other drugs? I'm guessing you are BP?
Posted by BarbaraCat on August 31, 2003, at 14:05:46
In reply to Re: Lamictal Survey, posted by fluffy on August 31, 2003, at 13:43:52
Hi All,
I think there was a Lamictal survey earlier. Inquiring minds want to know about all this stuff, however, please don't forget my Lithium survey. I'd appreciate hearing your thoughts on lithium rather than lamictal, primarily those who decided against Li and opted for another mood stablzr, like depakote, or are just plain hesitant to take it. Why? What are your thoughts/fears on this? I listed mine earlier, but want to hear yours.Part two of the survey is if you then went to Lithium after being on another MS and what were your experiences? Not that it's going to make one whit of difference for me cause I'm sold on lithium. I just think it would be helpful for others who are struggling with these questions, and besides it would be interesting for me. Thanks. Barbara
Posted by Ponder on August 31, 2003, at 14:08:56
In reply to Lamictal Survey, posted by Ima on August 31, 2003, at 12:50:17
Ima,
I started on Lamictal during the summer of 2001. At that time I was in a protracted hypersomnulent, overwhelmed-with-fatigue kind of depression. After years of med trials, Lamictal was the first one that really seemed to work. It did not make me symptom free (well, actually, for a few days at a time, it would) so Wellbutrin was added. The last few years have been a hellish climb out of the worst of that depression and I would not have made it without Lamictal.Now to answer your question more directly. How long did it work for me? I'd say quite well for over a year at a relatively low dose (150 mg/day.) I had break-through symptoms, but nothing like the zombie-ness of before. Recently I raised the dose to 200/day. In the last six months I've had some scary suicidal ideation, huge anxiety problems, etc. My p-doc has wanted to add or change things, but I cling to my Lam/WB combo with what is probably irrational loyalty and eschew other meds. Oddly, when you finally find something that works, you are reluctant to give it up even when it's not working very well anymore. At least, that's my reaction.
The other consideration for me was side effects over the long haul. I had gained weight on other drugs which brought on all kinds of other problems associated with being fat--arthritic pain, high BP, stress incontinance (this may not be a problem for younger women.) So weight gain was something I was determined to avoid. I've lost 50 pounds (that I had gained on Effexor)while being on the Lam/WB combo. Part of that is because the drugs are sufficiently activating to make me want to keep going all day and I've added very regular exercise to my daily therapeutic efforts.
So, it's been a mixed bag, I guess. But for now, I'm still on it. I recently had my first full-blown panic attack (situational? drugs too activating? emergence of yet another comorbidity?--who knows?) and my care providers are pretty hot to put me on an SSRI. Me, I've just become a damned scaredy-cat about med trials and wd prefer to just take Ativan as needed.
My med choices may not be the most rational, but there they are, for what it's worth.
Posted by BarbaraCat on August 31, 2003, at 14:20:11
In reply to Re: Barb-cat --quick Lithium question--THANKS!, posted by fluffy on August 31, 2003, at 13:32:02
You go, Girl!! It took me 3 days on 600mg lithium to notice a major shift. Although most side fx took 3 weeks to settle in so that they didn't worry me, I too felt that centered quality you spoke of. There's no better way to describe it. It's like, instead of all the scattered discordant energies and thoughts being on the periphery, ready to fly off into space, they're instead gathered in and aligned to a central steady core. For me, it was like taking the blinders off that wonderful warm centered glow inside that comes from that centerpoint, which is always there, but we don't always believe it is. It will continue to work and get better for you, I'm sure, because it sounds like you hit the magic transition point very quickly. To me, this indicates something in you lapped it right up. It is a natural element, after all, so who knows, we might have a deficit, like some other mineral or vitamin?
You'll have setbacks. I REPEAT!!! YOU WILL HAVE SETBACKS where you'll think it's not working, but it takes time for the internal mechanisms of our neurons to stabilize, so have faith that it's only for a short time. Even if lithium isn't the final answer, it will make everything else you take so much more efficient.
I'm so happy for you, girlfriend. Hopefully, a dark cloud has lifted in your life, like it did for me. And believe me, I was the 'F**cked-up' poster child of the last century!!!! - Barbara
I'm so glad the side effects fade over time. I can honestly say that on 600mg, for only 3 days, the side effects are almost zilch!!! YEAHHH!!!
>
> It's good to hear others' personal experiences with Lithium b/c it seems there's only really dry clinical stuff in the books that makes the stuff seem so scary!
>
> Now I have to watch my mood chart and see what it does in that respect. But I feel pretty centered today. I am so glad, b/c I had that visit in my studio today with the museum big-wig. It went well. (turns out she's not really a big-wig--about my age, but leaving an important institution to pursue her own curatorial projects). THANK GOD I didn't feel like I did over the last couple of days!! I couldn't see, speak, or think correctly (let alone talk abstractly about concepts surrounding my artwork). WHEW!
>
> Thanks again!
>
> Katy
Posted by BarbaraCat on August 31, 2003, at 14:53:27
In reply to Lamictal Survey, posted by Ima on August 31, 2003, at 12:50:17
Ima,
I consider myself a success story. Please take my success and experience as my own, and not necessarily one that will apply to you. If your chemistry and wiring is similar to mine, it will probably work, but it's really still a crap shoot as to what will eventually work and stick. If you don't get a really good response in about 3 weeks at about 50mg, consider supplementing with another mood stabiliser (lithium worked for me). Lamictal on it's own is usually not a good idea for BP's and there might be something going on instead of or in addition to BP. I'm probably not saying anything you don't already know in your sleep, but it's still important to remember.I started Lam 1.5 years ago, about the same time as I started Lithium. I'd heard about this powerful combo in for treatment resistant depression. I turned out to have all signs of BP-I mixed states, but had been treated as having major depression and treated with SSRI's for 20 years, I was increasingly and more rapidly going insane and majorly hit the wall on two occasions requiring hospitalizations which were a joke (I should have had ECT instead of 'a newer and better SSRI - (drum roll) - Celexa! and of course, Craft Hour!). I started feeling amazingly better on this combo. Not to say that I didn't have major setbacks and terrible depressions, but I've never since had another mixed state depression and for that I fall on my knees and give thanks.
I'm current taking 125mg lamicatal, recently up from 75 where I'd been for almost a year, doing reasonably well. I have to take it along with lithium because one doesn't work without the other for controlling my dark despairing agitated depressions. I increased from 75mg, slowly aiming for 150mg because I heard that 150-200 was a good dose for optimum AD response and being under extremely severe stresses with deaths, illnesses, losses and felt I needed extra help causing I was falling into the hole again. I got a little agitation with each weekly 12.5mg increase, but had been through that before and knew it passed.
However, when I got to 150mg I was feeling really zippy and speedy which was OK except for the infernal horrible itch I got that I didn't at first associated with Lamictal until I researched it on the web. I knew about 'the rash' but not the itch. So I backed down to 125mg and have been very stable along with 600mg lithium. Except for an intense hopelessness blip a while back (again, I had huge losses and stresses I was dealing with and wasn't sleeping - terrible for me) I'm feeling pretty darn good. My BS meter is super sensitive these days and my temper sometimes gets the better of me, but after cowering and doubting my feelings for so long, I'm rather happy with this turn of events. Too much crap in this world. Too much rolling over and putting up with it. FOOEY ON THAT! But even with all my meditating and yoga and such, I can be a RAVING BITCH and need to channel it some way.
I'm also seriously pursuing a health regimen with my naturopath and think it's very important to my overall health and sanity to cover all basis - body, mind, spirit. Good luck. - BarbaraCat
> For those who have reported sucess
> taking lamictal,
> are you still on it
> and for how long?
>
> I go to new pdoc this week
> and want to have some ideas worked out.
>
> Thanx
>
>
Posted by Ima on August 31, 2003, at 14:54:46
In reply to Re: Lamictal Survey, posted by fluffy on August 31, 2003, at 13:43:52
>> Are you currently taking any other drugs? I'm guessing you are BP?
We'll both have to speculate for now. But Im open to speculators (benign ones anyway:)I was recently misdiognosed, two different docs.
One put me on ultram which is increasing my mania.
The next put me on Neurontin to help with insomnia and fibro pain. And zoloft for "depression".
I ended up with serotonin syndrome (hyper stimualation of the brain stem) and didnt sleep for three days. When the tremors started I checked the drug interaction myself and found it to be major. SSRI's and pain meds. dont mix.
I decided to try another pdoc this week. When I complained of the mental fog and utter morose feeling Im having with the Neurontin, I was told by last pdoc, that was just me (me in a depressed state). Its not me! Ive lived with my depression for 35 plus years. I KNOW what my depression feels like. I felt I was litlerally dragging my face around.
(maybe Im missing something here, but docs who dont listen, or at least pretend to listen, i give no quarter to)
MY depressions are filled angst one minute and numbness the next. The worse it gets the more detached I feel, until someone bumps my shell and I come out long enough to scream them into submission and then I retreat until the next bump. Bumps can be anything, (I liked the "you breathe, you die" scenario y'all:), people eating dinner, someone looking at me, someone walking by the same pair of shoes in the middle of my way, 50 times a day and not picking them up!!! NOT my shoes of course.
My highs dont last that long (my poor family) and are usually marked with irritabilty. I never sleep deeply. But when Im manic 4-5 hours does it. (Some nights I dont sleep at all)
When Im depresed 12 hrs. sleep is not enough.
I ranting.
Yea, I think Im BP.
Thanx for the good wishes, Miss Fluffy ;)
Posted by fluffy on August 31, 2003, at 15:45:35
In reply to Re: Lamictal Survey, posted by Ima on August 31, 2003, at 14:54:46
Hey Ima--
From what you describe, it sounds like BPII (my formal diagnosis). And it also sounds like you have the agitated depressions---if severe, called mixed states (esp. if there is suicidal ideation). But "normal" depressions can be marked with irritability as well.
I'm quite certain that my dad is also BP. He exhibits a terrible temper--snapping at people for nothing, is physically abusive, camps out in his room for days at a time sleeping, and at other times is jolly. I unfortunately have inherited his wiring--something I've always been afraid of. My grandmother has been hospitalized for as long as I can remember for some unknown psychotic state. My aunt on the same side of the family has suffered from "psychotic" depressions, and had to be hospitalized b/c she was seeing things in the wake of my uncle's death. (this is all only on my dad's side of the family--my mom was adopted, so who knows what's lurking there).
Do you have any family history? It may help you to confirm your diagnosis. As painful as it was for me, it helped me (my mom and dad are TOTALLY in denial)
And you are absolutely correct in getting another psychiatrist. Psychiatrists can be arrogant, stupid, insensitive and misinformed just like other people. I sincerely hope that the new pdoc works out, and works WITH you until you feel you've gotten closer to answers regarding your current situation. If you feel like reading my full story (meds, some personal history, but MAINLY my really insensitive psychiatrist!!) here is the url from earlier in the thread:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20030828/msgs/255630.htmlKeep in touch and take care,
Katy
Posted by katia on August 31, 2003, at 15:49:44
In reply to Snores and such » katia, posted by BarbaraCat on August 31, 2003, at 12:34:55
> Heh, Heh. Can really relate to the honkin breathers. I also have an overpowering urge to emerge from my samadhi and go over and deck the creep. I've pounded my poor long suffering husband on the back - really pounded - and yelled "YOU INSENSTIVE A**HOLE, YOUR F**ING SNORING WOKE ME UP!!!!" snarl, slobber, growl. I'm very sensitive to noise and can't sleep if there's the faintest sound of a TV far away. Have always been this way as far back as I remember.
>
> So, I always have a spare of earplugs in my purse wherever I go. Just knowing they're there helps me get through alot of situations. I ALWAYS use them for savasana. - BarbaraHi Barb,
Wow. There's another one like me out there! I had one boyfriend who said that my demon comes out at night when I'm sleeping. Little did he know I WASN"T SLEEPING BECAUSE HE WAS SNORING! and the whack he got on the head and kick in the leg was VERY intentional.I HATE the sound of the TV. My parent's finally bought me a white noise machine when I was 12 or 13 to give me some sanity from it when I was trying to sleep. I react violently to noise. Snoring/heavy breathing most of all. I remember being on family vacations all of us sleeping in one room and Dad SNORING the night away. Me, on the verge of suicide, sleeping in the bathtub, hating him, hating life, hating myself most of all. What is it about nose noises that drive me insane? I cannot and willNOT have a boyfriend if he snores. That eliminates about80% of them? Even foot noises drive me around the bend. Every morning I'm sleeping and my housemate gets up sooooo early and walks sooooo heavyfooted that I'm on the verge of homicide/suicide every morning. That's no way to wake up. I even sleep with a white noise AND earplugs!!!! I haven't tried the earplugs in Savasana yet. Good idea. Some people have no clue or perception of how LOUD they are!
It's a feeling of being trapped/caged and highly insulted/offended all at the same time. Yes, probably childhood stuff. But at the same time, even when those horrible ADs weren't helping me in any way except making me worse; I find my obsessions more tolerable when I was on them. Or I was more tolerant I wonder if this is yet another chemical thing?I just feel extremely sensitive and neurotic and sooo many little things drive me mad. like I'm encased in a hell within my mind and no where to go. trapped.
Oh, and another big one for me since grade school, is wiggling feet or jumpy legs. When people are sitting and they just can't sit still - all this shaking of the legs drives me mad. I know - I'm insane! I think that one is a stimulation thing probably related to BP? It gets me hyped up to see someone else unable to sit still. It's tough to be so sensitive!It's interesting....
BTW, it was me who couldn't afford the XR tablets of Depakote. I don't think it was Katy with Li.
Katia
Posted by fluffy on August 31, 2003, at 15:54:09
In reply to Lithium Survey again, posted by BarbaraCat on August 31, 2003, at 14:05:46
Hey Barb-cat--
You may already know this stuff. But I was steered AWAY from Li by my past pdoc. He told me that it caused organ damage and made a crinkled up face, nodding his head "no". So here are my reasons in order of importance.
I resisted Li because:
1) fear of my "fire" being put out (thanks Kay Jamison!)
2) fear of organ damage
3) doctors seemed set on prescribing anti-convulsants first
4) mixed states supposedly respond better to anti-convulsants
5) family history of BP was not CONFIRMED
6) stigma
7) Li seems to have a history of bad compliance, therefore, I thought I might not tolerate it eitherI'd like to add that I think these reasons are a bunch of hooey now.
Posted by katia on August 31, 2003, at 15:55:13
In reply to Re: Lamictal Survey, posted by SUMMER2002 on August 31, 2003, at 13:42:46
See, I know we have to reduce stress in our lives; but I'm already living like a hermit. I want medication so that I CAN live a "normal" life with job, kids, family, activities etc. I want help to be able to live a normal life. I'm already avoiding stresses and it's NO life.
It's confusing and complicated and exhausting!
Katia> Lamictal survey - I've been on lamicatal 250 mg for close to two months. I stopped charting because I finally leveled off. I'm only taking flurazapam to sleep at night. I was on abilify prior to this and it didn't work for me at all - no ups just huge downs. Prior to that I was on zyprexa for a short while and tegretol w/ wellbutrin. Part of the changing in meds was due to me switching from pdoc to pdoc. I couldn't find one I liked. Anyway, at first the lamicatal worked great- helped with the depression and I got some of the highs back. It was great. Lately though I've been in a slump and can't shake it. I have four kids and work so I have to do the day to day routine but it is becoming harder and harder. No more highs. I have many outside stressors. My pdoc, who I really respect, says I have to reduce the outside stressors. That it is not the meds. I like him becasue he's the first to say I am not my diagnosis. He also said many bps are stupid (yep that is what he said) because we don't reduce the stressors in our life. I suppose he's right. But hard to reduce stress in my life but don't want to over medicate when I have some control over my feelings. Or at least I think I do. Bit overwhelming and a bit confused. He seems to think that my behavior as of late is because of the problems I'm having with husband and juggling work/kids etc. I don't know - but in conclusion lamactil did and does work. I'm not fuzzy in the brain like I was with abilify. Sorry about the ramblings - hope this helps.
>
> Patricia
Posted by fluffy on August 31, 2003, at 16:03:54
In reply to Lithium Survey again, posted by BarbaraCat on August 31, 2003, at 14:05:46
Posted by katia on August 31, 2003, at 16:14:48
In reply to Re: Lamictal Survey, posted by fluffy on August 31, 2003, at 15:45:35
Hi Fluffers,
I am in the same frustrating boat as you. I want to do a family "mental illness" tree; but no one is talking! That's why it took me ages to figure it out in myself because of the denial(unaware denial) and because of the developed cognitive and behavioral aspects of the family. that it seems "this is the way life just is" - full of chaos and suffering. I'm the first one to wake up to it. But looking closely I can definitely see stuff going on ON BOTH sides of the family.
It's so hard to figure out all alone - the lone ranger. It's important knowledge to have as well - the family history. How has your family coped with you "coming out of the closet" so to speak?
Katia
Posted by katia on August 31, 2003, at 16:36:22
In reply to Lithium Survey again, posted by BarbaraCat on August 31, 2003, at 14:05:46
Hi Barbara,
In the range of MS, my pdoc wanted to start me on Depakote first. I wanted Lamictal b/c of the AD qualities. He was wary b/c of the rash and wanted to at least try one of the "tried and true" other MSs first, knowing, as I, that it's probably going to be a long process of trial and error.
He never really mentioned Lithium except to say that that is normally for the classic BPI. But the more and more my lenses come off my blinding vision over the years, the more I am SO waking up to the fact that I'm BP. And I'm wondering if not BPI, due to my "mixed" states and due to a very odd but wonderful time I had for a brief period when I was 17/18. I always just regarded that time as a time when I was just with it and up and tuned in to the beauty and thrill of life. I never slept; and could never understand why people slept so much. I was always raring to go. It felt like I was constantly on some euphoric drug making me inhale deeply life's richness and beauty and feel giddy and exhilarated just to be alive. I was wild to say the least - wild. My senior suplerative was "the wildest student". I was so confident, NOTHING or NO ONE could have told me differently. Just now, in the past few months, looking back, I think I was manic. Because soon after in the autumn after a wonderful summer meeting first boyfriend and living at a beach, changing job per week and house per week, I started college. And somewhere I began crashing hard. terribly hard. I lost tons of weight and only ate rice and a glass of milk. Woke up at 6 every morning staring off outside, afraid, nervous, wondering what went wrong in my mind. I had it all together; life was good - great! I wanted that back. What do I do wrong? etc...Since that time, I've experienced more the tired but wired, irritability - more dysphoric/mixed with underlying chronic depression throughout. I got a few moments of wonderful goodness though!
So that's why I'm thinking that I may even be BPI. who knows! who really cares???? just give me something that works!I had another TERRIBLE TERRIBLE night last night - no alcohol involved. A cloud was following me all day and I kept trying to avoid it with yoga and then a movie, but by 9:30 it caught up to me and I tumbled. I was sobbing and in agony. you know the agony and sobbing that you feel you're almost regurgitating from the center of your soul? And every movement is painful? I felt soo alone and felt NO ONE loved me and that if my family weren't alive, I'd kill myself. The tornado came and the tornado left again. I went to bed and slept for 11 hours. (BTW, this is the first night I've taken all of my depakote 500mg at night). I couldn't wake up 'til past noon. It's ridiculous.
So we'll see how the Depakote works. If we abandon it, I'm insisting on Lamictal to start and then adding Li. if needed.
So there you go! BTW, give me an example of a classic BarbCat mixed state.
Katia
Posted by katia on August 31, 2003, at 16:37:48
In reply to family denial » fluffy, posted by katia on August 31, 2003, at 16:14:48
BTW Katy,
It's great about your mood!!!!!
What kind of artwork do you do?
Katia
Posted by Ima on August 31, 2003, at 16:41:38
In reply to Re: Lamictal Survey, posted by fluffy on August 31, 2003, at 15:45:35
Boy am I glad people are more togeather today than I am. I just reposted you because I forgot to include your name in my last response. Thanks for catching it
> From what you describe, it sounds like BPII (my formal diagnosis). And it also sounds like you have the agitated depressions---if severe, called mixed states (esp. if there is suicidal ideation). But "normal" depressions can be marked with irritability as well.I dont really have suicidal ideas much any more. Some of that might be from a desire to prevent my kids from going through anything like the trauma I went through. Love does sometimes find a way. And I love those sweeties a bunch. So much that even if it comes up on the radar (which as I said very rare for me now days) it gets shot right down. My heart goes out to people who feel more alone in their struggle. I feel the lonliness at times, long stretches of it, but I homechool and I dont get as much time to dwell on it. Something very immediate about kids.
Now my poor hubby, that relationship provokes my destructive thinking sometimes. I truly know we are from different planets. He has been in enough denal about my illness for both of us. When Im drowning in the void, and really taking it out on him, the more I try to communicate it to him, the more screwed up it gets and I feel really tempted to go over the edge and not come back.My mom is probably classically depressed,(Ive never known her to be manic except maybe when she married my father) and I learned from her the tedency I have to just keep going.
My dad left when I was 3 and he might be BP. He was the radical, the black sheep.
>
> I'm quite certain that my dad is also BP. He exhibits a terrible temper--snapping at people for nothing, is physically abusive, camps out in his room for days at a time sleeping, and at other times is jolly.Forgive me if I sound insensitive but I hope im not as bad as your Dad. I know there are times my kids feel Im off my rocker about little things. Wanting to make even those times abate is a motivating force for me to get help. And of course it is not so easy for moms to lock themselves in their room. I cant even go to the bathroom with out interruption!
> And you are absolutely correct in getting another psychiatrist.
Do you mean am I set on this? Yeah, i feel like even without the oversights the last one just wanted to give me the newest med comimng down the pipe.
Psychiatrists can be arrogant, stupid, insensitive and misinformed just like other people.No, I think their worse;) (except for you dr. bob:)The next will have to have at least a better sense of humor. To pdocs have a sense of humor?
I sincerely hope that the new pdoc works out, and works WITH you until you feel you've gotten closer to answers regarding your current situation.
Lots of hugs and thank you, thank you
If you feel like reading my full story (meds, some personal history, but MAINLY my really insensitive psychiatrist!!) here is the url from earlier in the thread:
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20030828/msgs/255630.html
>
>
I will check it out.
Thanx Katy
peace
Ima
Posted by Ima on August 31, 2003, at 16:50:33
In reply to Re: Lamictal Survey » Ima, posted by Ponder on August 31, 2003, at 14:08:56
Thanks for patiently answering me.
Have you been diognosed bipolar?
Good luck
peace
Ima
Posted by Ima on August 31, 2003, at 16:59:01
In reply to Re: Lamictal Survey » Ima, posted by BarbaraCat on August 31, 2003, at 14:53:27
My BS meter is super sensitive these days and my temper sometimes gets the better of me, but after cowering and doubting my feelings for so long, I'm rather happy with this turn of events. Too much crap in this world. Too much rolling over and putting up with it. FOOEY ON THAT! But even with all my meditating and yoga and such, I can be a RAVING BITCH and need to channel it some way.
>
> I'm also seriously pursuing a health regimen with my naturopath and think it's very important to my overall health and sanity to cover all basis - body, mind, spirit. Good luck. - BarbaraCat
Thanks Barbcat,I think Im still in the cowering stage and hopfully heading for the FOOHEY ON THAT stage.
The worst of it is I seem slide back and forth from one to the other.I love craft hour!
and the way you write!
peace
ima
Posted by fluffy on August 31, 2003, at 17:46:53
In reply to family denial » fluffy, posted by katia on August 31, 2003, at 16:14:48
How has your family coped with you "coming out of the closet" so to speak?
> KatiaWell, they haven't been completely in denial--but they never ask how I'm feeling (mentally). My mom is super pragmatic about it--she just thinks--hey--just take a pill, and it will go away (which is somewhat true, albeit much more complicated). She does not dare to address the family tree thing b/c of my dad. He's been terribly abusive to her, too. When I asked my dad about our family tree in despiration (and fear) and told him what was going on with me and my new BP diagnosis--he just started sobbing and crying. He said he feels the same way as me most of the time. I do feel for him. But for jesus sake!! He beat on my brother and I (and yelled horrible things at us) throughout my whole childhood--even into college! He would NEVER NEVER see a psychiatrist! He's probably frozen in fear due to his mom being committed (and never cured of her illness). In that sense, I can't blame him for being scared out of his wits.
Ima--if you're reading this--I hope you didn't infer that I was comparing you to my dad--I was comparing MYSELF to my dad. If I had kids, I'm seriously afraid of how I might have treated them--I have a horrible, agitated temper. I've ALWAYS been afraid of having kids b/c I've thought I might be abusive. It sounds as though you keep yourself pretty composed, even though you are hurting inside. It's really difficult to do.
Anyway--again I've become long winded. I can't help it. This is such a good group!! You guys are my support group!!!
Thank you so much everyone!!
Katy
Posted by fluffy on August 31, 2003, at 18:16:07
In reply to Re: family denial » katia, posted by katia on August 31, 2003, at 16:37:48
> BTW Katy,
> It's great about your mood!!!!!
> What kind of artwork do you do?
> KatiaHey Katia--
I wish I could just post a link...
But I make sculpture with cloth and lumber. It is large scale and kind of dramatic. I make forms (like cushions) with different cloths--usually nylon. They get stuffed with sand, polyester, or sawdust. There are lumber pieces that provide "support" for the softer forms...the soft forms coddle the heavy lumber pieces. (does any of this make sense??)AAARGGHH! Dr. Bob's gonna re-direct me! I just know it.
But I think that craft hour provides mood stability just like daily exercise!hugs,
Katy
Posted by Ima on August 31, 2003, at 20:33:04
In reply to Re: family denial, posted by fluffy on August 31, 2003, at 17:46:53
> How has your family coped with you "coming out of the closet" so to speak?
> > Katia
>
> Well, they haven't been completely in denial--but they never ask how I'm feeling (mentally). My mom is super pragmatic about it--she just thinks--hey--just take a pill, and it will go away (which is somewhat true, albeit much more complicated). She does not dare to address the family tree thing b/c of my dad. He's been terribly abusive to her, too. When I asked my dad about our family tree in despiration (and fear) and told him what was going on with me and my new BP diagnosis--he just started sobbing and crying. He said he feels the same way as me most of the time. I do feel for him. But for jesus sake!! He beat on my brother and I (and yelled horrible things at us) throughout my whole childhood--even into college! He would NEVER NEVER see a psychiatrist! He's probably frozen in fear due to his mom being committed (and never cured of her illness). In that sense, I can't blame him for being scared out of his wits.
>
> Ima--if you're reading this--I hope you didn't infer that I was comparing you to my dad--I was comparing MYSELF to my dad. If I had kids, I'm seriously afraid of how I might have treated them--I have a horrible, agitated temper. I've ALWAYS been afraid of having kids b/c I've thought I might be abusive. It sounds as though you keep yourself pretty composed, even though you are hurting inside. It's really difficult to do.
>
> Anyway--again I've become long winded. I can't help it. This is such a good group!! You guys are my support group!!!
>
> Thank you so much everyone!!
> Katy
How old are you Katy (if you dont mind my asking)
I was 31 When I had my first so I had some of my stuff sorted out.
I was married three yrs. bfore my first preg. Thank God she didnt come then. We had a lot of junk to sort and not kill each other over. Things were better by the time I finally got preg.It hasnt always been rosie. Im a firm believer in the value of an apology. Something I never got from my parents, ever.
Yelling, I cant help sometimes,
but saying I was wrong I can.
I think they understand.
Its not a cake walk,
but I think they feel loved.
THAT's THE MOST IMPORTANT PART!!!
Dont give up the idea
because you may not be a perfect parent.
There arent any.Thanks for sharing. Its hard to be transparent about painful family stuff.
peace
ImaPS..Craft hour definately rules !.. Winston Churchill took up watercolor and layed three hundred bricks a day to keep the "black dog" at bay. (he also drank three bottles of liquor a day, but hey? ;)
Posted by SUMMER2002 on August 31, 2003, at 20:34:13
In reply to Re: Lamictal Survey » fluffy, posted by Ima on August 31, 2003, at 16:41:38
Ima
How do you do it with kids and homeschool? I agree they keep me so busy that I don't have time to think about it but on bad days like today I don't want to do anything, plan anything or be Mom. Of course I do - at least the basics - make dinner, read a book, play scrabble. But every chance I get I go out driving and smoking. I know both are bad - What I really want to do is go find a hole and climb into it when these down moods hit. I'm only on lamictal - I wonder if adding wellbutrin would help. I mentioned it to my pdoc because of the smoking but he said he didn't want to mess with my meds since the lamictal appeared to be working.
Oh well
Tomorrow is another day.
Patricia
Posted by BarbaraCat on August 31, 2003, at 21:23:30
In reply to Re: family denial, posted by fluffy on August 31, 2003, at 17:46:53
Hey Ya'll!
This thread has been going on a long time, do you realize that? We've all become so close, we know how inexplicable it is what we have to our 'normal' relations, but we know each other very well, we understand each other. We have buddies here that hold us through the hellish times and say "Yes! I know what you're going through! You're not alone!".There's a mystery and a special magic in what we have. You know what I mean. We're blessed, but we don't know how to use or creatively channel our energy and power. Don't forget that magic, and try to find evidence of it everywhere, no matter how raw and turbulent it's untutored form is.
We're blessed and we'll find the way if we continue to just ASK! We'll find the outlet for our gifts if we refuse to give into FEAR. What's there instead of FEAR? You know deep inside. The goal of meds is to help us calm down enough to find what that answer is. We live in strange times and everyone is feeling it, not just US.
What we bipolars, as raw pilgrims on this journey have, is acute sensitivity and razor's edge instincts. This ain't a bad thing at all. It WILL get better and it WILL make more sense. It really is all coming together for me, just recently, and it's pretty amazing, this wild journey I'm on.
But you have to go through your own journey in your own way. Nothing I say will sink in now, but it might arise when needed. Anyhow, I hope it will. I thank the Great Mystery for Lithium, at least for me. I keep thinking that Spirit made and put Lithium in my path and I said 'Gee, thanks, I'll try f**cking anything!'. Now I can get on with Life and it's My Time, My Life and if it's taken 52 years to get here, then so be it. I look good, I'm feeling better with each day, and shoot, it's only gonna get better.
Just think of someone who never experienced the Full Monty of Life! The anguish, the bite of pain, the poignant ecstasy of hope. Would you want to hang out with such a pallid personality? Not me! I'll take my anguish any day because I know that there's a higher order looking out for me. You too!
So give thanks for your extremes of experiencing Life. When you're older, you'll be grateful it wasn't a zombie life. You felt deeply! You're Red and not Grey in your 'take' on life. Right??!!! Remember, 'No Fascinating Women in History was ever a Good Girl!' (Bumper Sticker that changed my life!) This applies to guys as well, by the way.
We're friends, dammit, and I am so grateful you're all are in my life. I can express ME in all my honesty without someone going "Whooo, someone get our the white coats. She's WEIRD!" Sorry, but there are no orderlies with white coats in Our Cyber-World! Love to all and thanks, Barbara
Posted by Ima on August 31, 2003, at 22:07:58
In reply to Re: Lamictal Survey, posted by SUMMER2002 on August 31, 2003, at 20:34:13
> Ima
>
> How do you do it with kids and homeschool? I agree they keep me so busy that I don't have time to think about it but on bad days like today I don't want to do anything, plan anything or be Mom. Of course I do - at least the basics - make dinner, read a book, play scrabble. But every chance I get I go out driving and smoking. I know both are bad - What I really want to do is go find a hole and climb into it when these down moods hit. I'm only on lamictal - I wonder if adding wellbutrin would help. I mentioned it to my pdoc because of the smoking but he said he didn't want to mess with my meds since the lamictal appeared to be working.
>
> Oh well
>
> Tomorrow is another day.
>
> Patricia
Hey Patricia you sound like a great mom.
I mean it. All you can do is all you can do. Some days I cant plan any hting either. But It doesnt mean I dont love them. As often as you do the right thing for them they must know you really love them. If they believe you love them, and, it will cover a multitude of sins.My Mom never did cr*p with us. I love her and Im over it, but I felt like we were an after thought. Messy critters in her other wise clean world.
She gave what she got, which was less than that. Her mom made her get a job at 10 yrs. to pay her own way.In my moms high school yr. book, her goals were, convertable, secretary job and nice clothes. I read that entry at least a dozen times, and I felt it was true. We werent one of her goals.
I, being the tenacious brat I was set out to be the opposite of my mother. It was in my nature.Im more like my rebel father she reminded me on many occasions, who left us when I was 3.
I once heard you have two chances to have a happy childhood, yours and your kids. I think its true.
Part of the homeschool philosophy weve ascribed to (and there are many) is to raise them to be self learners.(this was no doubt self defense on my part)
There have been days when Ive said, Mom needs to have some time, and I close my bedroom door. They know if they really need me ( the house is on fire or someone is bleeding) they can disturb me. They do live up to our expectations. They do the work they need to do for the day.
I read, pray, call a friend, what ever it takes get my head togeather, and like you, I have simple priorities, dinner. Some days laundry.When Im okay, like you, I play scrabble.
Friends with children have been a great help. Tues. we went to the park togeather. Kids play, Moms comiserate. I couldnt have survived the early years with out female support.
They are 12 and 14 now. They direct their own days and touch base with me for guidance when needed.
It is actually harder for me now they are more independant.Bps really benifit from regular sleep and routine. I got more of that when they were little and looked more to me to provide structure.
With mid life and menapause setting in Im unmoored more than Ive been in a long time.
But I think it is mid life that finally breaks through our ability to disasociate and gives us a chance to deepen the healing we've put on the back burner while raising our kids.
My poor hubby, one menapausal woman and two pre menstral teens and just him :) It will be an interesting new time for us all!
Im definately worse now. I feel a certain grace attended my determination to give my children, more than I was given.
There notheing wrong with getting away to smoke a cig. You still love them. you just have to survive, in order to keep loving them.Obviously the lamictal by itself is not working.
If your Bp you probably need something else. There are lots of people on this site more knowledgebale about meds than myslef. But I love to talk about my family. Any more specific encouragemanet I can give in that dept, Id be glad to give.
Dont worry about the smoking. Just your sanity okay. Tell him you want to do more with meds or find a better doc.
Im just starting to feel like its my turn. By Gods grace Ive been able to hang on this long. But each persons path is unique. Dont beat yourself up by comparisons, okay. We're all in it togeather! Go girl!
peace
Ima
Posted by Ima on August 31, 2003, at 22:13:01
In reply to Friends, finally friends that understand!, posted by BarbaraCat on August 31, 2003, at 21:23:30
Posted by katia on September 1, 2003, at 2:36:34
In reply to craft hour rules!!, posted by fluffy on August 31, 2003, at 18:16:07
You know we could exchange email addresses....
it may take away from this group thing, but then we could say what we like?
again, if we do get redirected and the email exchange is out, just follow the link it's quite easy.
katia
Go forward in thread:
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.