Posted by muffled on July 2, 2007, at 12:28:16
In reply to Re: blocks, options, and prevention, posted by Dr. Bob on July 2, 2007, at 11:41:53
> That's an interesting suggestion, thanks. What do you think would be a reasonable value of r in that formula?
*I love the look of the numbers and all, but am unable to figger it exactly...
> > ---a.. No banning for over a month (or maybe six weeks) at a time.
*THIS I agree with. Unless a person is *ongoingly* being disruptive, then maybe 6 mo.
> >
> > ---b. If a long time passes– say six months– after a month ban, reduce to a week for next ban* YES YES YES!!!
> >
> > this introduces greater incentives for good behavior.*hmmm. Incentives? or mebbe a better way to say it would be not so much incentives, but *repercussions* for bad behaviour. I do not feel rewarded for not being blocked, but I DO feel punished when I am...
As for incentives, meaning your blocks go away for good behaviour, again, I don't think I'd feel rewarded, so much as *releived* of some of my fear...So IMHO theres not incentives, but just the looming possibility of punishment...> I suppose a case could be made for a lower cap for impersonal incivility. Keeping the same 2:3 ratio would mean 35 weeks?
*sigh, numbers aside, impersonal civility is less bad I guess......
>
> IMO, it makes sense for the personal and impersonal systems not to be separate.*its a little subjective at times....I forsee many arguments....
>
> Thinking of blocks in terms of incentives is tricky, since the longer the blocks, the greater the incentives...*again NOT an incentive to me. Longer blocks are not more incentive, just more hurt, more fear. If I screw up and uncivil its most likely I will have done so in the heat of the moment, and 'incentives' mean absolutely nothing to me at that point, all that would happen is I would be blocked and further hurt. When/if I came back, I would just be fearful and quite possibly angry and resentful(depending on the block...). But for me to get a block, for a moment of upset, ESP if it weren't all that bad....well, I not saying it well, just we DEALING WITH PEOPLE HERE, not machines....we DO screw up, but the punishment IMHO often FAR outstrips the crime....:-(
>
> Also, I still like the idea of a mandatory civility buddy option:*potentially useful...very challenging....
>
> > The thread had already escalated quite a bit.
>
> It would've been nice if all these blocks could've been prevented in the first place...*if you read the thread Bob, you *will* notice that others DID try.Doesn't always work.Esp if you got strong feelings bout it...
Also on a diff thread it *was* successful, and deputy said thanks for apologies, and it was good. So mebbe we need to do more of that...
But really, oftimes all thats needed is a breather......
NOT BANISHMENT and SHAME.
I think thats mebbe another thing you don't fully understand Bob, is the shame component...
One day, when my brain is working good(it DOES sometimes...) I will take the time and write a dissertation explaining the interpersonal stuff and the shame and the deterrence, time factors of relevancy, etc of blocks...
For now I am tired.
I still beleive VERY strongly that you NEED to revisit Z block above.
IT IS JUST WRONG.
Respectfully,
M
poster:muffled
thread:762973
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20070702/msgs/767172.html