Posted by tom_traubert on November 28, 2004, at 21:51:33
In reply to Re: Meds for Obsessional Thoughts, posted by TommyIsland on November 28, 2004, at 20:13:51
> Thanks so much Tom for this excellent information you are providing. It is actually very comforting to know that other people out there such as yourself experience similiar Obsessive thought patterns like the one's I am battling internally and I'm not an isolated case. It really is very difficult to describe the thought processes........even to a psychiatrist or psychologist. I have tried a few times in the past and they seem to dismiss them quickly and move on to more general ways of coping with my depression, etc. I don't understand why I can't just find a doctor who understands that he has to listen to me EXACTLY and work from there. It is the Obsessions that need to be addressed because I truly feel that they are the cause of Depression. Do you agree? Do you feel that much of your depression and anxiety are a direct result of the Obsessions? I mean what came first the chicken or the egg? Do u feel that your mental state of mind improves dramatically if u learn how to deal with the Obsessions and regain control? Where does this science seem to think this problem originates? Is it a learned way of thinking or a genetic response or is it brought on by environmental stress from childhood or is it a possible combo all of them? From the first onset ever of depression I can remember when I was 15 years old, I can remember the Obsessive thoughts. ALWAYS! I was always stuck in my mind analyzing and obsessing. I can truly say that the Obsessions were there from the very beginning of all my mental hardships. With them came depression, anxiety, paranoia and whatever other trait I could have inspired to jump on board. How long have u been dealing with this if u don't mind and how has your progress been? Do u feel that books and self educating has helped u the most or CBT with a therapist has given u your greatest breakthroughs of success? Thanks again Tom and I hope to hear from u soon!
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>I don't blame your therapist for trying to attack the depression head on and find coping skills, for after all, you have to get on with your life. Sometimes, you need to reach a place with enough strength to do the work you feel you need to do. You don't have to figure out the obsessions, you have to eat sleep and work and not want to die. And after that, you still don't need to figure out the obsessions. You asked if I thought the obsessions are the cause of depression and anxiety, and my answer is not really. It is obsessive thinking, the pattern, that is the culprit. Anything with some shred of truth can turn into an obsession. The pattern, the obsessional ocd, the way your mind works, not what it produces, not the symptoms, this is what you really need to understand. Once this happens, once you know how it works, only then can you really examine the obsessions and come to a conclusion that will stick. You have to recognize the pattern when it hits, and then you can recognize the obsession as a false irrational unnecessary belief.
Also, yes, I think your state of mind improves dramatically once you understand the illness better. Becuase the depression comes when you lose control or you feel humiliated by the inability to stop the thoughts. You can limit this, you really can. You stop hating yourself for having the thought and actually start to show yourself some compassion and even be proud of yourself for having the courage to learn, having the courage to refrain from responding to the thoughts. It's not easy but it's not too hard either.
I've experienced some form of obsessional thinking and anxiety all my life, but stress and life brought it to a pitch, made it a real problem. Stress will always worsen ocd symptoms. There are many varying opinions as to the biological component of the illness, and I'm not one to argue, because it doesn't really get you anywhere. It's as if someone tells you it's not biological that you have a better chance of eliminating it. Forget it, don't waste your time. Know that you can reduce it, know you can get past it. Just know it. Theorizing about its origin is time wasted that could be spent on dealing with it now.
The books I told you about were lifesavers, and a source of inspiration, confidence, much needed validation and information, but I would not have kept up or practiced the recommendations put forth in those books without a therapist. They are equally important, but it is more important in my opinion to find a therapist and not just a pdoc who's handing out meds. I did that for 6 years and that was fine with me because I was too scared to do the work, to look at the pattern and then really examine the thoughts. You have to reduce the anxiety a bit before tackling the thoughts because it's hard to be objective when you're on the verge of panicking. You also have to be real generous with yourself, give yourself lots of time and not set unrealistic goals of needing to be better by a certain time etc etc.
One more thing-- I haven't taken any meds for over 5 years. It hasn't been easy. I share this NOT because I think you should get off drugs. Let me say that again: I do NOT think you should stop taking meds. I took myself off once without tapering and the withdrawal was absolute hell. It was horrible, I was lucky to live through it, and I gladly and thankfully went back on meds. I stopped when I was ready to try to stop, with gradual tapering, with the help of my doctor. It was difficult and extremely rewarding. It's a lot of work. It hasn't been easy for me but it hasn't been hell either. I still give myself the option of going back on if I need to, if it gets too much. So far, it hasn't. I tell you this in hopes that you will trust me when I tell you that CBT, books, self-education, and above all patience and non-engagment of obsessive thoughts, that all these things can improve your life. That if you take your time and really learn about the illness, you can then dismantle the thoughts that have such a strong hold on you. There is no foward progress as long as you're trying to figure out the obsessive thoughts. There is no healing as long as you're responding to the thoughts.
Get the books, get help, stop fighting the thoughts, get on with your life. You can do it.
tt
poster:tom_traubert
thread:420388
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20041128/msgs/421612.html