![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 16 to 40 of 41. Go back in thread:
Posted by alexandra_k on May 30, 2005, at 18:28:36
In reply to Re: I just want to cry, posted by sleepygirl on May 29, 2005, at 23:32:09
Thanks everyone.
Sorry I've been a bit slack with the thread.
Just trying to avoid that feeling...
Keep going...
Two weeks to go...I just get frustrated that I can't work at a 'standard' or 'reliable' pace. I guess thats a major part of whats wrong with me.
It is hard when you have to compete to try and get selected for stuff... And so always put your best foot foward and minimise / neglect your limitations.
Then to see that the reality would be something that would disqualify you...
I'm not making much sense...
Two weeks.
Just worry about that.
Posted by alexandra_k on May 30, 2005, at 18:30:15
In reply to Re: I just want to cry » alexandra_k, posted by Damos on May 29, 2005, at 17:53:30
Damos.
(((Damos)))
Yeah, we should meet one day :-)
If all goes well for me I might be moving to Australia early next year.
I'll have to go via Sydney.
And then I won't be all that far away.:-)
Posted by alexandra_k on June 2, 2005, at 3:20:26
In reply to I just want to cry, posted by alexandra_k on May 27, 2005, at 2:35:56
...and there it is again.
Though really, I don't think it went away
But its back again most definately now.
Maybe I'm depressed.
Hmm.
I don't know how that is supposed to help.
I feel all sad inside.
Strangely enough...
Its not so bad.
I know I used to get into these real bad places where I felt so very intensely bad. That doesn't really seem to happen anymore.
Sadness.
Well.
Its okay compared to that.
I let myself cry
When nobodies looking.
I don't know that I feel better for it
But I think it needs to come out.
Its just hard sometimes
The thoughts
Hard not to get mad
Hard not to get mad at people.
But I don't want to feel mad
Sads okay
Mads not so nice
I don't like feeling angry.
And I'm rambling.
The boards have been really quiet today.
Hope everyone had a nice day
Im going to go to bed and cry...
one week to goAnd what is it???
What is wrong???
Hmm.
I remember how I felt when I was a kid
And I feel sad now.
I see that I'm pretty much a loner
That I prefer things that way
That I actively avoid people
And don't go to social stuff that I could / should
And that thats what I choose to do
But that I feel lonely an awful lot too
And its probably something to do with that.
That I don't have a therapist.
That I'll probably never have a therapist.
That they never did send me the letter to tell me that.
That I did get dumped
I did get dumped from the service
All I got was an assessment
A bit fat sh*t of a pre-existing condition
Termination.
How did he help me again?
I just don't see it.
But I really shouldn't think those thoughts.
Sads ok
Its not that bad
But I do seem to spend an awful lot of my life crying.
I think I am depressed
But there isn't anything to be done..
Posted by alexandra_k on June 2, 2005, at 3:25:13
In reply to Re: I just want to cry, posted by alexandra_k on June 2, 2005, at 3:20:26
And one week to go till what?????
Till next weeks marking.
Then I have 2 weeks to write a seminar
Then a couple months to write my thesis
To write an application
To buy myself 3 years to write another thesis.
What happened to holiday??????
Oh yeah. I'll get a couple months off...
I'll go on the dole and have a break.I'm not sure
I'm not so sure...
That I want to be writing anymore.
I don't know sh*t about anything.
There is still so much I want to know
I want to learn
I don't feel ready to go out there on my own and write...
I don't feel that I want to do it anymore.
I'm not ready.
I miss being an undergrad.
I miss coursework.
Mulit-guess quizes
A fixed body of stuff to learn
To remember
An essay or two
Where the question
Where the problem
Is clearly defined.I have decided...
I don't care so much if I don't get in.
I think...
I might like to start again.
Maybe it is time to do a BSc.
Biology...
Something
Anything
But this...
Posted by alexandra_k on June 2, 2005, at 5:02:37
In reply to Re: I just want to cry, posted by alexandra_k on June 2, 2005, at 3:25:13
And theres nothing I can do.
I think about it a lot
A great deal
My 'options'
What I could do...- I could try ringing the lady who made the funding decision. Tell her that I haven't recieved formal notification of the funding decision. I suppose I could go off at her, but that wouldn't help... I suppose I could say... Being very careful here... But I could ask whether she realises that if the funding decision is 'no' then I will fight that and there will be an inquirey into her decision. And that the lawyer thought I had a good case and so that would look bad for her. But I don't think that is a good way of going about it. She will probably take it as a threat. By default. So there it is.
- I could send p-doc an email. Go off at him. But that won't help. Ask him where I'm at on the wait list. He said he had put in a referral for me to see another p-doc. But he probably just said that, like he does. Trying to prevent a scene incase I decide to start writhing on the floor and saying I'm pregnant... Or something... Something... Anything to keep the peace so that I will go away and not make a scene.. Even if he did put me on the wait list nobody will take me on most likely. I have probably been taken off already because nobody wants to work with me. Nobody wants to see me. And they can 'justify' that by saying that they aren't willing to see someone with that dx because there isn't anything they can do.
- I could email the t that was recomended. Tell her the funding didn't come through. What good would that do??? Well... I suppose there could be a chance that she would agree to see me for free. But I won't do that. I won't do that. It isn't fair to do that. What would I be trying to do? Make her feel guilty and take me on out of pity. Nope. Thats no good.there isn't anything to be done.
and i just keep going round and round and round this sh*t night after night.
One week
One week
and all that f*cking marking
then i do believe im allowed to have a breakdown...
:-(
maybe i need to take the pills
i don't feel so good
Posted by alexandra_k on June 2, 2005, at 5:13:15
In reply to Re: I just want to cry, posted by alexandra_k on June 2, 2005, at 5:02:37
and i just wish it would stop
and i could forget about it
BECAUSE THERE ISN"T ANYTHING I CAN DO
and because nothing is going to happen
and i just need to accept that.
and sometimes it isn't so bad and i just feel sad
but then sometimes i feel really bad
and sometimes im so f*cking mad i wont say what im tempted to do...
and i just want to forget all about this
forget it ever happened
forget that some peoples lives are different
and i just want this to go away.
and i don't understand that if that is supposed to be my coping strategy
to just give things a little push and then out of my mind they go...
if that is supposed to be my coping strategy then why doesn't it work like that and why doesn't this go away and why cant i just forget all about this???i feel really scaired because i don't know what is to become of me.
and i understand when people say that they are tempted to do something drastic so that something happens something changes because people just seem to need a wake up call that i am not alright and i need some help.
(not people here and i will be okay but this is what i think sometimes)...
and i can feel myself getting low again...
but I know i just have to get through one more week
and do the marking
cause I've had too much time off this semester already.
but then when the pressure is off i think i probably will lose it or collapse or something
and i have no earthly reason to believe that things are going to get any better for me in the near future. and so in a way i am pretty crazy for thinking about going somewhere to study. to try and make a committment to that. because it is so very f*cking likely that i'll have a breakdown or something and make an *ss of myself and not even complete it. and so what the hell am i doing?????maybe it is time to have a holiday properly.
go on the sickness benefit
and just potter around uni attending whatever...
get that formal letter out of them,
and get the process rolling along...
if all goes well i could get to see someone...
if the inquirey goes in my favour.
two years for the inquirey...
then treatment for how long???
we only asked for one year.And then what?
I don't know
I have no idea
I odn't think i want to be doing this anymore
it is too hard
and i feel sad
Posted by Susan47 on June 2, 2005, at 9:17:14
In reply to Re: I just want to cry, posted by alexandra_k on June 2, 2005, at 5:02:37
This is ridiculous. You can see how perverted this is, can't you? Physicians, people who call themselves healers, refusing to heal. "Afraid" of their clients. Rejecting those who need them most.
How sick.
Do you believe this is true, Alex?
Really? Is this really what is happening?
What are your meds?
Are you taking them?
Are they enough?
You shouldn't be feeling this sadness, not if your medication is working. Frustrated, angered by the system, okay .. but able to fight, able to stand.
You must stand up for what you believe to be right, Alex. But you need to be lucid and strong. Don't crumble. I feel you crumbling, yet again. Remember the strength you felt when you came out of hospital last time. Remember the kindness there, and the caring. Who will help you at this time? There must be someone. And again, are you taking your meds???
Posted by sleepygirl on June 2, 2005, at 19:20:01
In reply to Re: I just want to cry, posted by alexandra_k on June 2, 2005, at 5:13:15
Hey alexandra,
You're sadness is coming through loud and clear. I'm thinking as I read your post that you feel terribly alone, very low on hope, and feel like you have been summarily dismissed with a message that you can't be helped. Well you most certainly can be. But I don't suppose that reminding you of the limitations that others can have in that understanding or in their availability would be of any benefit here. I think you will find a relationship that can help you. Fundamentally, what people need is acceptance through it all. I think you might be feeling terribly rejected, and you might be accepting that perception as fact. Sometimes it does feel like you have be screaming for anyone to notice. You're feelings though, directly stated in your posts, don't need to scream to me. I see it, and I think it must feel terrible inside for you right now. Feels like you've taken a terrible blow, and it's feeling pretty hard to walk right now. It doesn't help that you appear to be overloaded with work right now. Try to do one thing at a time, and not think too far ahead. There's a whole bunch of things that could happen in the not too distant future. I don't quite understand all the particulars of what you need to do to obtain proper mental health care, sounds maybe complicated/frustrating? Anyway, hang in there philosopher, it's hard, but possibilities always abound. Yeah, and I hope you are taking meds. I know I'd be in bad shape without mine, although that of course is not all of the story.
-Peace
Posted by alexandra_k on June 2, 2005, at 20:31:28
In reply to Re: I just want to cry » alexandra_k, posted by Susan47 on June 2, 2005, at 9:17:14
> Do you believe this is true, Alex?
> Really? Is this really what is happening????
Is what true???
It is true that nobody will treat me. Nobody in psychology anyway. Basically... There are three teams and two psychologists to each team. That makes 6 of them. You are supposed to stay within your team but it isn't to hard to change... But it can be hard because when they say 'there isn't anybody to treat you' you have to ask 'in my team or in the whole service???' But it turns out... It is the whole service. I've seen both psychologists from my team. One met me once and recomended nobody work with me. The other one saw me for maybe 3 months and then terminated me (she said she didn't know what to do with me and she got sick worrying about it). I have worked with one of another team and she recomended nobody work with me. I have met the other one off the same team and she won't work with me. I have met another one off the last team and she won't work with me and I don't know who the other person is but I think it is fair to assume that they don't want to work with me either. CBT is silent on my dx and they don't know what to do with me.P-docs are medication prescribers but they have a fair bit of leeway to do what they want. Most of them won't work with me. But they come and go a fair bit. Most of them don't want to do anything other than prescribe medication. Most of them are busy enough just doing that.
So there it is.
Nobody will treat me in community mental health.> What are your meds?
> Are you taking them?Effexor and Seroquel.
Nope.
They don't help.> You shouldn't be feeling this sadness, not if your medication is working.
i don't think any medication really helps. That is the problem...
>Frustrated, angered by the system, okay .. but able to fight, able to stand.
> You must stand up for what you believe to be right, Alex. But you need to be lucid and strong. Don't crumble. I feel you crumbling, yet again. Remember the strength you felt when you came out of hospital last time. Remember the kindness there, and the caring. Who will help you at this time? There must be someone. And again, are you taking your meds???I think...
I think Ive hit the end of the line with community mental health.
The time has come to accept it.
I did fight
For a number of years
I fought hard as I could
But there is nothing left to be done.
Posted by alexandra_k on June 2, 2005, at 20:59:03
In reply to Re: I just want to cry, posted by sleepygirl on June 2, 2005, at 19:20:01
Hey there.
Thanks so much for your post
:-)
I'm sure I'll be okay.
I just find it hard to reconcile them knowing that I need help with their refusal to help me.
But it is a hard one I guess...
I mean, think of all the starving children.
They need out help
But no particular person is responsible for helping them.Yuk.
I hate to make such a comparison.
THanks.
I do need to work on accepting it.
There isn't another way.
Posted by Damos on June 2, 2005, at 23:19:11
In reply to Re: I just want to cry, posted by alexandra_k on June 2, 2005, at 20:59:03
You're in my heart Alex and I'm sorry that I haven't been around much or had enough time to respond properly.
Seeing you hurting like this just breaks my heart. You know I'm not a platitudinous person so I'm not gonna give you a pep talk. Just want you to know that you're very special to me and constantly in my thoughts. Puppy often asks how her auntie Alex is, and gives the biggest dog tail wags when I say you send her your love. And know I'll do what ever I can to help you get through this.
((((((((((Alex))))))))))
Posted by alexandra_k on June 3, 2005, at 5:23:07
In reply to Re: I just want to cry » alexandra_k, posted by Damos on June 2, 2005, at 23:19:11
Thank you.
Posted by alexandra_k on June 4, 2005, at 2:43:31
In reply to Re: (((Damos))), posted by alexandra_k on June 3, 2005, at 5:23:07
I think my moods are quite related to my period. I started my period when I was in hospital last time. And I've just started today - and the last few days have been hard.
Maybe things seem worse round about those times...
Maybe I should give the evening primrose oil another try...
Or something.
i dunno.Sorry I've been a real sad sack lately.
When i get down I get really really egocentric.
All there is is me and my pain and my problems.
Need to get out of my head.
Sorry folks :-(
Posted by Damos on June 5, 2005, at 17:50:24
In reply to Re: (((Damos))), posted by alexandra_k on June 4, 2005, at 2:43:31
Aw Alex, that makes so much sense, can't believe it didn't occur to me before, especially since a friend of mine was only saying to me a couple of weeks ago that for a week or so leading up to her period she gets really dark and brooding - yeh that's the word she used. Grizzly and whingy were other words she used.
It makes so much sense that a surge of hormones would further upset the delicate balance you're trying to maintain.
I read your post over on Psych and think that maybe you should write your counsellor a letter or better still send her a 'Thank You' card. Sending thank you cards is a practice I've only taken up recently to help me not take the kindness of others for granted. If I had addresses for all my babble friends I'd be well and truly broke by now because I have so much to thank them all for. And you my dear would have a wall full of them, for simply being you.
Sorry I didn't get online much on the weekend. The trackball on the machine at the mall was stuffed and I only managed to read/reply to a couple of posts, and then I went over to my old folks and their connection dropped out every couple of minutes. GRRRRRR!!!!!!
Damn, just remembered that the health fund haven't called back, I'll have to chase them up. Haven't checked the lottery ticket yet either. I heard late on Friday that they've decided to tell us our fate prior to the long weekend, so sometime this week - maybe. Then maybe, just maybe I can be a better friend allround and we can really talk about all the things that have been coming up for you lately.
BTW, I know what you mean about getting out of your head. I once descibed my life to someone as like watching television and that it was like my whole life took place inside my head. And you're way more cerebral than me so I can imagine how hard it is to get outside your head. Sometimes I wonder if I'm a myth of my own creation and that I don't actually really exist outside my mind. My thinking gets really twisted sometimes.
Sorry, I've gotten all of track and rambling again.
Sending you lots od love and hugs.
Posted by alexandra_k on June 5, 2005, at 22:51:57
In reply to Re: (((Alex))), posted by Damos on June 5, 2005, at 17:50:24
I'm feeling much much much better today :-)
I took yesterday off.
Went round to my mates
Got high
Went grocery shopping and got all sorts of necessities like chocolate and ice-cream
Got some new sneakers (my old ones were so worn down at the heel that they were leaking)
Got high
:-)
And then I felt better.
Wrote loads of meaningless drivel on my thesis
(which means I'm rediscovering an interest)
And am diligently doing my marking today
(But with lots of necessary Babble breaks)
I do think that the depth of my mood was period related.
Hmm.
I feel yet another self-dx coming on ;-)
But: I should try and remember this for next month.
Next time I start to lose it...
I should wonder if it is about that time.
Just knowing that might make it more manageable.
Like how its easier to cope with panic attacks etc if one remembers 'it is just the LSD I'll be ok in a bit'.Yes. You are right about what I should do about the councellor situation. I was in a very black mood indeed when I wrote that I'd just stop going. Because I do want help more than anything (hence the factitious disorder guestimate)...
So... Some serious repair relationship stuff is in order... Not just a card, because I'll never be able to figure out something decent to say.. I have an idea. I do.
The one t who I got on really well with was my DTB therapist for 8 months. I told her a little bit about the voices - but not much. I was scaired that they would think I was psychotic and that I'd get kicked out of DBT.When she left she gave me this little wooden box. With a coloured bead, a little piece of crystal, a little piece of turquoise, and a little cone shaped shell inside. She said that it was a mindfulness exercise. I don't know how she meant it... But I kind of thought each bit was supposed to be one of the voices. A little bit of me. They sort of 'claimed' one each. But there was another one I never told her about. So I guess I'm the box, if that makes any sense.
Anyhow. I thought it might be nice to start doing mindfulness exercises with my new t. Just 5 minutes at the start of the session so I can try and orient myself to being THERE with HER with all my attention. And so I thought I could loan her the box to look after. She could look after it for me, and when we aren't going to work with each other then I'll get it back. But I will make sure that I say to her that if something happens and her office burns down or someone breaks in or whatever then I won't be upset with her. I'll promise that. Because I don't want to ruin it by having her worry that I'll spew at her if something happens and she loses it or whatever.
And a card. A card, of course.
Does that sound nice?????
I really don't know whether I can tell her that I am having a hard time appreciating her....
But... Maybe it isn't essential so long as I put some thought into doing some serious repair work and start appreciating her more from this point on.
Posted by damos on June 6, 2005, at 1:59:05
In reply to Re: (((Damos))), posted by alexandra_k on June 5, 2005, at 22:51:57
> I'm feeling much much much better today :-)
Well I am very glad to hear it :-)> I took yesterday off.
Given that it was Sunday, that seems a fair thing to have done.> Went round to my mates
> Got high
Never done that. Afraid it would push me over the edge or unleash something evil and horrible.> Went grocery shopping and got all sorts of necessities like chocolate and ice-cream
Absolute necessities =0)> Got some new sneakers (my old ones were so worn down at the heel that they were leaking)
Musta been the weekend for it, mine disintegrated too. Didn't get new ones though, hate shoe shopping> Got high
> :-)
> And then I felt better.
YAY!!!!!!!!> Wrote loads of meaningless drivel on my thesis
> (which means I'm rediscovering an interest)
Well that's gotta be good hasn't it????> And am diligently doing my marking today
Ah yes diligence. Heard of it, never actually experienced it though :-)
> (But with lots of necessary Babble breaks)
But of course.> But: I should try and remember this for next month.
> Next time I start to lose it...
> I should wonder if it is about that time.
> Just knowing that might make it more manageable.
> Like how its easier to cope with panic attacks etc if one remembers 'it is just the LSD I'll be ok in a bit'.
It just might you know. It just might. I'll have to take your word for the LSD thing ;-)
> So... Some serious repair relationship stuff is in order... Not just a card, because I'll never be able to figure out something decent to say.. I have an idea. I do.
Sorry and thank you are surprisingly often enough.
> The one t who I got on really well with was my DTB therapist for 8 months. I told her a little bit about the voices - but not much. I was scaired that they would think I was psychotic and that I'd get kicked out of DBT.
DTB/DBT, sorry Alex I don't know these guys being a therapy/therapist free zone.
> When she left she gave me this little wooden box. With a coloured bead, a little piece of crystal, a little piece of turquoise, and a little cone shaped shell inside. She said that it was a mindfulness exercise. I don't know how she meant it... But I kind of thought each bit was supposed to be one of the voices. A little bit of me. They sort of 'claimed' one each. But there was another one I never told her about. So I guess I'm the box, if that makes any sense.Yeah it does. That was a really nice thing for her to do. An explanation would have been nice but you seem to have worked it out.
> Does that sound nice?????
Yeah it does, it really does.I think whatever you do to mend the relationship will be appreciated. And that finding a way for you both to be 'there' when you're together is a good thing to try.
Take sweet girl, talk soon. Puppy sends her love
Posted by alexandra_k on June 6, 2005, at 2:53:32
In reply to Re: (((Alex))), posted by damos on June 6, 2005, at 1:59:05
> > I'm feeling much much much better today :-)
> Well I am very glad to hear it :-)
:-) me to.
> > I took yesterday off.
> Given that it was Sunday, that seems a fair thing to have done.
Yeeeeeeeees.
I very rarely have a whole day off.
> > Went round to my mates
> > Got high
> Never done that. Afraid it would push me over the edge or unleash something evil and horrible.
Hmm. I don't figure that part of me needs to be unleashed. Getting stoned actually mellows me out.
> > Went grocery shopping and got all sorts of necessities like chocolate and ice-cream
> Absolute necessities =0)
Absolutely! I discovered this really wicked brand of ice-cream. God bless America for Oreo cookies!!! Really. And this icecream is extra creamy and has big chunks of oreo-like cookies in it. Yum.
> > Got some new sneakers (my old ones were so worn down at the heel that they were leaking)
> Musta been the weekend for it, mine disintegrated too. Didn't get new ones though, hate shoe shopping
:-( Aw. I love shopping. Sort of... Shoes are fun. I wish I could come to Sydney, I'd drag you round the shoe shops :-)
> > Got high
> > :-)
> > And then I felt better.
> YAY!!!!!!!!
:-)
> > Wrote loads of meaningless drivel on my thesis
> > (which means I'm rediscovering an interest)
> Well that's gotta be good hasn't it????
Yup. Shame I wasn't productive but thats the cost of getting high...
> > And am diligently doing my marking today
> Ah yes diligence. Heard of it, never actually experienced it though :-)
Hmm. I am trying I am trying.
If another person tries to tell me that ideas are valid / invalid and arguments are true / false one more time..... The trouble with me is that I want to give helpful feedback which seems to involve my writing each person an essay in return. Thats why it takes me longer than everyone else. The other markers joke that it makes them look bad. But I have never had anybody query their mark because I told them what they would have needed to do to get a better one. I should write the 'standard comments' on a sheet and staple it though. It would save me the time of writing the same fr*gging speel on many different essays... Trouble is that you don't know you will be doing that the first time you offer the speel... What really pisses me off is when the students don't even bother to collect their assignment. Grr. Marking is every bit as XXX (insert the appropriate word here) as actually writing an assignment.
> > (But with lots of necessary Babble breaks)
> But of course.
> > But: I should try and remember this for next month.
> > Next time I start to lose it...
> > I should wonder if it is about that time.
> > Just knowing that might make it more manageable.
> > Like how its easier to cope with panic attacks etc if one remembers 'it is just the LSD I'll be ok in a bit'.
> It just might you know. It just might. I'll have to take your word for the LSD thing ;-)
Ok. Mushies are the same too :-)
> > So... Some serious repair relationship stuff is in order... Not just a card, because I'll never be able to figure out something decent to say.. I have an idea. I do.
> Sorry and thank you are surprisingly often enough.
Yeah. THough I think I've said them a fair few times already. Thats why it is time to move onto something else. Something that hopefully will alter my behaviour so I stop with the depreciatory comments etc. I have said sorry before then continued on my merry way so I don't think a sorry will be worth very much at this point.
> > The one t who I got on really well with was my DTB therapist for 8 months. I told her a little bit about the voices - but not much. I was scaired that they would think I was psychotic and that I'd get kicked out of DBT.
> DTB/DBT, sorry Alex I don't know these guys being a therapy/therapist free zone.
Whopsie. That should have read DBT both times (DTB was a typo). It is 'Dialectical Cognitive Behaviour Therapy' which is a varient of Cognitive Behaviour THerapy for peoples with a dx of Borderline Personality Disorder. But I'm cured of that now, aparantly ;-)
> > When she left she gave me this little wooden box. With a coloured bead, a little piece of crystal, a little piece of turquoise, and a little cone shaped shell inside. She said that it was a mindfulness exercise. I don't know how she meant it... But I kind of thought each bit was supposed to be one of the voices. A little bit of me. They sort of 'claimed' one each. But there was another one I never told her about. So I guess I'm the box, if that makes any sense.
> Yeah it does. That was a really nice thing for her to do. An explanation would have been nice but you seem to have worked it out.
Yeah. I think the 'real' explanation was that it was just a mindfulness exercise. But I read a little more into it... I took out the turquoise and asked her 'do you know what it is called?' And she looked at me very strangely. And said 'turquoise' and then I think the alternative explanation occured to the both of us about the same time.
She thought there were three voices and me. So there were four things.
But when she left I found Katie. The kid. So then there were five and now I guess I'll have to be the box.
> > Does that sound nice?????
> Yeah it does, it really does.
:-)
> I think whatever you do to mend the relationship will be appreciated. And that finding a way for you both to be 'there' when you're together is a good thing to try.
:-)
Give Sarah a hug.
Posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 21:58:08
In reply to Re: (((Damos))) » damos, posted by alexandra_k on June 6, 2005, at 2:53:32
Now see, here's part of the build up of pressure problem. Whole days off are absolutely vital or burnout is absolutely inevitable. It comes quickly enough even with days off if you're under the sorts on internal and external pressures you are. You need time to just spin your wheels.
Odd isn't it, I wouldn't mind at all being dragged around shoe shopping. It's something to do with doing it for myself that's the problem. Hmmm that icecream sounds rather yummy.
See, your marking style is one of those things that makes you special. You may joke about it but it's no joke to you. You go the extra mile, because someone doing that would mean a lot to you.
Funny isn't it that ticks or crosses in different boxes can instantly cure you of one thing but give you another.
I have a question. If each of them has claimed and is happy with their object is there something you could add to the box that would be you?? You don't have to answer. Gonna have to order the Dissociative Indentity Disorder Sourcebook cause I just don't know or understand enough about DID. Or you could just talk to me about stuff that has happened or just occurs to you.
Take good care my dear, dear friend. I'll be sure to give puppy her hug.
Posted by alexandra_k on June 6, 2005, at 23:18:11
In reply to Re: (((Alex))), posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 21:58:08
> Now see, here's part of the build up of pressure problem. Whole days off are absolutely vital or burnout is absolutely inevitable. It comes quickly enough even with days off if you're under the sorts on internal and external pressures you are. You need time to just spin your wheels.
Hmm. Yeah.
Not till the end of August though :-(
The difference for me is whether work feels like something I HAVE to do or something I WANT to do. Sometimes I really enjoy it and in a way doing it just IS 'spinning my wheels'. But yeah, I really should get out more ;-)
> Odd isn't it, I wouldn't mind at all being dragged around shoe shopping. It's something to do with doing it for myself that's the problem. Hmmm that icecream sounds rather yummy.Yeah. I get what you mean. I went shoe shopping with one of my mates. I have been on the lookout for some all year but haven't managed to find anything I liked. I can be mega fussy sometimes... We were going for coffee really, but he didn't mind going into one shop with me. I didn't see anything but then he said 'what about these?' And so I tried them on and really liked them. I guess thats whats fun about shopping with someone else. They pick out stuff that just passes you by, and then you look properly and can't believe you missed it. I hate shopping by myself. And I especially hate trying to get stuff that fits me. I always end up buying stuff either too big or too small. Because I don't really know or have an image of how big I am. It is a bit strange...
> See, your marking style is one of those things that makes you special. You may joke about it but it's no joke to you. You go the extra mile, because someone doing that would mean a lot to you.Yeah. I guess. I guess it is worth it for the students who it means something to. Not so stoked about the ones who don't give a sh*t. Thats what I really don't like about undergrads. There is such a mix. I'll willingly go the extra yard for people who have a genuine interest but can be fairly intolerant with people who waste my time with excuses. I have my own work, I have better things to do than care about them when they can't be bothered to do their readings and study and put some time and mental effort into it.
> Funny isn't it that ticks or crosses in different boxes can instantly cure you of one thing but give you another.It is because of the overlap in symptoms for different dx's. Because there is such an overlap of symptoms there is the problem of someone meeting the criteria for loads of different disorders. There are arbitrary criteria for excluding certain dx if they meet the criteria for another (that is supposed to take priority) and so forth... More people meet NOS (Not otherwise specified) dx than any of the specified dx. It shows that the DSM needs work. Lots of work. Mental illnesses aren't natural kinds the way that medical / biological illnesses / kinds are. Work needs to be done :-)
> I have a question. If each of them has claimed and is happy with their object is there something you could add to the box that would be you??Hmm. I thought about it a bit.
But... Na. I don't want to add anything myself.
I'll be the box.
I like to be the box.
I like to think I'll get better at closing the lid on them ;-)
Which is precicely the wrong attitude apparantly.
Sigh.> Gonna have to order the Dissociative Indentity Disorder Sourcebook cause I just don't know or understand enough about DID.
Its probably wrong anyways. Factitious disorder with psychological symptoms is my current guestimate ;-)
And because dx is largely a matter of self-report I can fairly much have whatever I want.
Yay.
Sorry, I'm in a bit of a irratible mood with the DSM and dx criteria etc.>Or you could just talk to me about stuff that has happened or just occurs to you.
:-)
That sounds better.
> Take good care my dear, dear friend. I'll be sure to give puppy her hug.:-)
Good.
You have one to.
Posted by Damos on June 9, 2005, at 18:44:58
In reply to Re: (((Damos))), posted by alexandra_k on June 6, 2005, at 23:18:11
Wow, not till August that's a while yet. Yeah I kinda know what you mean about how the stuff you need to do can be "spinning you wheels". Sometimes you just get in the zone and it's a really good feeling (he says like he's know a really good feeling if he tripped over one). Think you know what I mean though, that it's not just about getting out more, but about giving yourself permission to just do stuff cause you feel like it or want to that's just about and for you, and not about anything you have or need to do.
You...mega fussy....now that's hard to imagine ;-) I'll consider myself kicked in the shins. Got to admit that I've become so isolated (babble apart) that I've nearly forgotten what it's like ot just hang out. Not that I ever really knew I guess.
Know what you mean about the undergrads. It's the same here with people who just piss you about and waste your time.
I absolutely agree with what you said about the DSM etc, it seems that the more you read the more confused you get and the more things you can convince yourself you could have becaus there is so much that is similar or common to so many of the disorders and the means of differentiating and prioritising them seems so vague and hit-and-miss.
I just knew you'd choose to be the box. It's what I would have chosen too. And just how exactly is that precisely the wrong attitude. It's nice to be completely ignorant stuff, the questions don;t seem nearly as dumb then.
Ah yes your self diagnosis of Factitious Disorder this has me intrigued. Don't worry about being irritable, I don't mind, you just feel free to be as irritable as you like.
Big hugs right back at ya.
Posted by alexandra_k on June 9, 2005, at 22:23:17
In reply to Re: (((Alex))), posted by Damos on June 9, 2005, at 18:44:58
> Wow, not till August that's a while yet.
Yeah. Thank god its a while yet. I have a thesis to write.
>Think you know what I mean though, that it's not just about getting out more, but about giving yourself permission to just do stuff cause you feel like it or want to that's just about and for you, and not about anything you have or need to do.
Yeah. Trouble with me is that I get into my black moods and can't face doing any work at all. Then I really have to pull finger to catch up. That doesn't really leave me with a lot of time to spin my wheels... If I could work dilligently with the time I do have... Do a few hours solid work per day then I could take whole days off to do something fun (though I'd have trouble figuring out what to do). But as things stand I brood for days and then become obsessed for a day or so. So I guess I do have days off. But they are days in bed where I am in a very black place indeed... Doesn't really count as a holiday or rest - but it does get me behind. I don't know. I think that if I go easier on myself then the black patches should get better. But I just don't have the time to go too easy...
> Got to admit that I've become so isolated (babble apart) that I've nearly forgotten what it's like ot just hang out. Not that I ever really knew I guess.Yeah. I hang out and get high.
Thats all though.
Druggie mates.
Yay.
> I absolutely agree with what you said about the DSM etc, it seems that the more you read the more confused you get and the more things you can convince yourself you could have becaus there is so much that is similar or common to so many of the disorders and the means of differentiating and prioritising them seems so vague and hit-and-miss.Mmm. There are what Bentall calls 'arbitrary exclusion criteria' which seem to be precisely that. Someone gets dx y unless they also meet criteria for dx z and dx z takes priority so they don't get to be dx'd with dx y. Otherwise people would have too many dx's and the whole thing would start to look like a crock.
Grr.
> I just knew you'd choose to be the box. It's what I would have chosen too. And just how exactly is that precisely the wrong attitude.Hmm.
Yeah.> Ah yes your self diagnosis of Factitious Disorder this has me intrigued. Don't worry about being irritable, I don't mind, you just feel free to be as irritable as you like.
Hmm... I think... I think the situation is that if I really decide that I have it... then I have it. If for not other reason than that I'm determined I have it but I actually don't. Being determined to have it means that one gets to have it. It is self-confirming kind of like the cogito. I think therefore I am. I think I have fictitious disorder therefore I have it. Interesting...
:-(
And that is precisely the attitude that has people concluding that I might be 'playing games' and so they have no sympathy and they don't want to waste their time with me.
:-(
It is just that... People won't work with me because of my dx. But to be fair all of the 'related' dx that I could probably equally well be dx'd with don't exactly make them want to work with me either. Most clincians get that they are a related constellation of symptoms and so... well... it is just that the DSM needs to be improved. that is all. it doesn't help me. it doesn't help people want to help me.and to be fair... psychiatry isn't supposed to be about this sh*t anyway. im neurotic. thats my problem. traditional interventions seem to make me worse :-( maybe therapy just is a luxury for the rich. maybe thats what it should be. i mean... there isn't much indication that it helps all that much. just that people say that they wouldn't do without their t's. but that doesn't mean that their t's are actually helping. just that people think they are. but then if something happens to their t or whatever then they could end up worse off than they would be if they never had a t in the first place.
so...
i don't know
i dont
> Big hugs right back at ya.:-)
Posted by Damos on June 11, 2005, at 23:59:49
In reply to Re: (((Damos))), posted by alexandra_k on June 9, 2005, at 22:23:17
Ah yes the thesis :-(
I know what you mean. I don't so much have black moods as days where there's just this all pervading disinterest and inability to make myself do anything or move forward in any way. And then there's the mad panic to get all stuff done that has not been touched for days on end. Still get the black moods too like Friday arvo and yesterday where I just fell into a hole. Listened to the same Nick Cave CD over and over all of yesterday - not a good sign. I know exactly what you mean though, he bad days where nothing gets done but are still hard rob you of the chance to have any easy ones.
Druggie mates are better than no mates I guess and if you enjoy hangingnout with 'em and gettin high, that's gotta be better than sitin around feeling miserable...surely
Yeah, I've read about those exclusion criteria and honestly it is a crock, pure and simple.
Love the concept of self diagnosing Factitious Disorder..love it. It's intriguing and incredibly interesting. I'm not yet convinced that you have it but am happy for you to try and prove me wrong.
Honestly Alex, it matters not to me what you have or don't have or how anyone else labels you. All that matters is who you are to me, and that is someone very special and worth getting to know better little by little over a very long time.
You see they are missing the point. They are trying to treat and processes you according to what it says in the book. but you're a person who isn't just black and white, you're all the colours of the rainbow and a million more. What you need is continuation of care, genuine love and affection - not treatment.
Love ya kid.
Posted by alexandra_k on June 13, 2005, at 5:19:40
In reply to Re: (((Alex))), posted by Damos on June 11, 2005, at 23:59:49
I don't know about my druggie mates...
Sometimes I really think that they help me out. When I'm in a really bad place then sometimes getting high is enough to snap me out of it.
But othertimes I can be doing alright and then after hanging around with them for a bit I get a downer coming down for a couple days afterwards.
And sometimes it sets me into a bit of a ruminative mood and I can't get anything done because I write druggie ramblings and need to throw it all out later.So I don't know. Mixed blessing, I guess.
> Yeah, I've read about those exclusion criteria and honestly it is a crock, pure and simple.
:-)
They are aiming for another edition of the DSM in... 2011 I think I heard.. I'm not sure on the dates. The DSM has been categorical up to this point. There are different kinds of dx with different names, major depressive episode, bi-polar etc. They are considering changing from categorical dx's to a symptom approach. On the symptom approach the dx is made on the basis of the number and severity of symptoms that the subject exhibits. It is thought that this latter approach will avoid some of the problems of categorical dx (such as needing to have arbitrary exclusion criteria). It will also reflect the notion that mental illness is a matter of degree not kind and that many of the symptoms of mental illness are found in a lesser form in rest of the population. Major overhaul. It might be able to help with respect to better prognosis of illness too... Especially if the categories are too hetergenious at present. I think heterogenious is the word and it means that there is more variation of symptoms exhibited by patients within a dx category than between categories. So it is hard to track prognosis when research typically uses the dx category as a element instead of symptoms.Thats why people have recently taken to studying symptoms (eg delusions, hallucinations)
instead of dxIt is just hard when they won't help me.
Nobody from community mental health will work with me
:-(
:-(
:-(
And this has been going on a while. So I have to start thinking that it must be something about me. Something about me because they work with me for a little bit but then move on :-( I don't know whats wrong with me. Why they won't work with me. Why they keep dx me with stuff so that nobody will want to work with me :-(
Posted by Damos on June 13, 2005, at 17:25:21
In reply to Re: (((Damos))), posted by alexandra_k on June 13, 2005, at 5:19:40
Well the changes you describe to the DSM have got to be an improvement.
What about the therapist that the P-doc was going to refer you to based on the DID dx? I know that would be outside the system but did you ever actually meet her and if so did she seem like someone you could work with?
Please don't be sad Alex. You know if they tell you you're impossible to work with often enough and you're teminated often enough and you don;t feel like you're getting anywhere, of course you're going to start blaming yourself. Just because you take them out of their comfort zone is no reason for them to disgard you. This "I don't do BPD or DID or I just want to push pills" is just a cop out. It doesn't sound like anyone has ever just let you be with them long enough without trying to fix you for you to even begin to feel comfortable working with them. It's that security thing we share. It takes people like us a long time to really open up to anyone about anything. Surely there is a need to build a relationship where you feel safe, supported, validated and comfortable before anything else. That's why loosing these people I've worked with for so long is hitting home hard. My safety net is being pulled away and it scares me.
If you want to see that therapist or someone else or whatever, I'll give you whatever support and help I can. If you want to be your own therapist and just use me to bounce stuff off that's okay too. All I can promise is to be honest with you and to respond based on what I feel and believe and to be your friend first and foremost.
Posted by alexandra_k on June 14, 2005, at 3:02:03
In reply to Re: (((Alex))), posted by Damos on June 13, 2005, at 17:25:21
> What about the therapist that the P-doc was going to refer you to based on the DID dx? I know that would be outside the system but did you ever actually meet her and if so did she seem like someone you could work with?
:-(
The funding didn't come through so I can't see her.
My memory of meeting her is a bit confused.
It went...
It was pretty horid.
She made a big performance of phoning ACC to ask them for a sensitive claims form to fill in for someone who hadn't been sexually abused.
They said that she had better not fill in a sensitive claims form for me if I hadn't been sexually abused.
I had to sit there while she was on hold with them etc for a good 20minutes. And I'm sitting there squirming seeing just how much easier it would be to say that I had been. Sigh. I can't believe the system is still set up that way...
Anyway... It got a bit much for me (I knew the whole thing was a waste of time) so I just got up and left and she started screaming at me about taking one of her cards. Basically... It didn't go well.I was going to pay her.
But p-doc talked to her before I went
And so she had a different conception of why I was there rather than asking me why I had made an appointment.:-(
> Please don't be sad Alex.
I'll try.
>You know if they tell you you're impossible to work with often enough and you're teminated often enough and you don;t feel like you're getting anywhere, of course you're going to start blaming yourself.
Yeah. But it has to be something about me. I'm just trying to work out what. And why they say that I don't work in therapy etc. There must be something to it or they wouldn't say it all the time.
>It doesn't sound like anyone has ever just let you be with them long enough without trying to fix you for you to even begin to feel comfortable working with them. It's that security thing we share. It takes people like us a long time to really open up to anyone about anything. Surely there is a need to build a relationship where you feel safe, supported, validated and comfortable before anything else.
Yeah. I think thats it too. But they disagree...
>That's why loosing these people I've worked with for so long is hitting home hard. My safety net is being pulled away and it scares me.
(((Damos))) Yeah. Thats got to be hard :-( Something like that gets ya all shaken up. Nasty.
> If you want to see that therapist or someone else or whatever, I'll give you whatever support and help I can.Thanks. But no.
>If you want to be your own therapist and just use me to bounce stuff off that's okay too. All I can promise is to be honest with you and to respond based on what I feel and believe and to be your friend first and foremost.
:-)
Thanks.
I'll get there.
I have to.
But it won't be so bad.
Not with all the wonderful Babblers in the world :-)
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