![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 6 of 6. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by tealady on November 4, 2004, at 5:04:24
Well as I mentioned B4 to ya I'm lost with this sulphate thing.
I figure as my body LOVES all glutathione foods I need NAC (haven't got as yet but can get some from a compounding pharmacist). I'm a great believer that if your body letting you know what it needs to an extent...except say with sugar(or choc)..but even with sugar its telling you you are low on glucose(usually as your body has overreacted and pumped out too much insulin). Or I guess it could be telling ya your carb/protein ratio is too low as your body needs carbs to help with thyroid hormones and too high protein can probably alter genes etc in cells too (post transcriptional alterations I think)..
I guess this could happen for all foods..body overreacting, or desensitising receptors etc, but I don't think so in general :)
Anyway, I gues I'm just saying if your body says it wants it..its probably for a reason. Why can't I write consisely, sigh.Back to sulphonating etc. lost with all the terms.
I know the Epsom salt baths relax me..Lar says that's probably the magnesium..but magnesium citrate doesn't have that much of an effect taken internally..I guess I could try a tiny bit of Epsom salts in water.
Jlx or anyone..how much did you take?I understand this does not give you sulphur like say TMG.?
Now how does TMG give you sulfur? ..the methyl bit I presume. So how is the methyl? and sulfur linked?
Would l-methioine be any good..
http://www.naturalcity.com.au/ViewProductsports.aspx?ID=96
or even l-arginine? How is that liked in. Sorry for all these questions. I'm sure everyone knows I never expect answers but happy if I get any:)I felt great this morning for the first time in ages, and for some reason my skin is not so dehydrated..can pinch it and it goes back..also I seem to be retaining water better!! yah! hope it lasts! Actually slept thru last night for the first time in decades maybe!
All I've done different is mainly the Coenzyme B's I mentioned I recently started in a previous thread..
also about the same time soy lecithin,,for choline?? Is that what lecithin does?
and also a couple of weeks ago I added linseed meal (flaxseed meal)?
and that's the only changes..
maybe it was needing the coenzyme B2? I can't quite follow that. I know these coenzymated B's make my urine a little yellow but not nearly so yellow as a normal multiB..so maybe I'm actually using the B2 now??
If that's the case, what is it I lack if I need the coenzyme form?well I just hope whatever keeps working!
..and thanks if it does for the coenzyme B2 lead.back to this sulphur stuff..
Ray you said you like NAG but not the glucosamine straight. Was that the glucosamine chloride? or glucosamine sulphate? or l-glucosamine?
I bought some MSM Joint Formula today ..but won't take until I see if impreovement is more than one day wonder
http://www.epharmacy.com.au/product.asp?id=46729 Glucosamine sulphate, Chondroitin sulphate,MSM, Ester C (Calcium ascorbate), Citrus Bioflavonoids, Manganse sulphate, Zinc oxide and Copper sulphate..says potassium too in product breakdown but not in ingredient list..strange.Can't get NAG by itself anyway so farover here, but if this doesn't work I may add to my "to buy from o'seas list" together with the TMG and P5P and probably coenzyme B if it keep working or a Coenzymated form of B2 at least.
Oh and also maybe magnesium citrate, zinc citrate as I've run out of my supplies I bought in the UK(:.
Jlx..on magnesium..what IS your favourite brand . I guess it's magnesium taurate? Can you post me a link to your favourite ones? I'm sensitive to lots of fillers so I need to read fie print or email etc for ingredient details, sigh...or buy straight powders or caps from good suppliers like Thorne research etc.
( I figure if I list lots of different brands and sites I can't be said to be promoting any of them :))Ray, I get lost with some of your supps so if you ever have links can you post them?.. if its allowed?
They are mainly stuff I have never heard of as they are not available over here I guess. Over here its just straight vits, minerals or aminos (some real strange mixes usually) ....no coenzymated forms n-actyl forms etc...no taurates, not many citrates either etc :) Getting lots of ideas. I'll have to reread some of your posts ..I've a poor memory.Thanks for any help with this ..like to discuss what supps with sulphur giving properties anyone has really liked! I know TMG for Lar and Ray..
Posted by raybakes on November 4, 2004, at 6:31:33
In reply to methylation supps/ sulphonating? ..Jlx, Lar, RAY, posted by tealady on November 4, 2004, at 5:04:24
Hi Jan,
can't reply to everything at the minute - I'm at work!! But the TMG doesn't contain sulphur, but it helps recirculate the sulphur containing amino acid homocysteine to another sulphur amino, methionine, by adding a methyl group. Homocysteine can convert into cysteine (the 'C' in NAC) and taurine, and also, via sulphite oxidase to sulphate. Found that autoimmune problems tend to inhibit our sulphate production from homocysteine, and sulphites trigger the breakdown of NADPH to produce superoxide (sent you a link about that in the acetylcholine/vasopressin thread) - so inhibition of sulphite production might protect us in some way?
The B2 is important in folate reductase(and glutathione), along with NADPH to activate folate...wonder if that's helping?
Sorry, if it's a bit confusing - ask me for specific links if you need them...hopefully larry will be able to clear things up a bit as well!
Ray
Posted by Larry Hoover on November 4, 2004, at 10:32:59
In reply to methylation supps/ sulphonating? ..Jlx, Lar, RAY, posted by tealady on November 4, 2004, at 5:04:24
> Ray, I get lost with some of your supps so if you ever have links can you post them?.. if its allowed?
> They are mainly stuff I have never heard of as they are not available over here I guess. Over here its just straight vits, minerals or aminos (some real strange mixes usually) ....no coenzymated forms n-actyl forms etc...no taurates, not many citrates either etc :) Getting lots of ideas. I'll have to reread some of your posts ..I've a poor memory.It all gets very confusing. Sometimes to the point where names get mixed up, and so on. At those times, it's essential to have a decent reference guide, especially one that is not too geeky. Here is a good list.
Iherb resources:
http://www.iherb.com/health.htmlGeneral Alternative Resources (from above):
http://healthinfo.healthgate.com/GetContent.aspx?token=e0498803-7f62-4563-8d47-5fe33da65dd4Herbs and Supplements Guide (from above resource):
http://healthinfo.healthgate.com/GetContent.aspx?token=e0498803-7f62-4563-8d47-5fe33da65dd4&chunkiid=33802Lar
Posted by JLx on November 4, 2004, at 11:16:06
In reply to methylation supps/ sulphonating? ..Jlx, Lar, RAY, posted by tealady on November 4, 2004, at 5:04:24
> I know the Epsom salt baths relax me..Lar says that's probably the magnesium..but magnesium citrate doesn't have that much of an effect taken internally..I guess I could try a tiny bit of Epsom salts in water.
> Jlx or anyone..how much did you take?
> I understand this does not give you sulphur like say TMG.?I think that is what Larry said just recently. When I took magnesium via Epsom salts, I followed George Eby's recommendation as to dose:
"The crystals are 10 percent pure magnesium, and a rounded 1/2 tablespoon (7.2 milliliter) yields 1 gram of magnesium. It is one of the most highly absorbed magnesium compounds known (easily absorbed through the skin or digestive tract)." http://www.coldcure.com/html/dep.html#economy
I used to put it in a gallon of water with lemon juice and stevia (because it tastes terrible) and drink it throughout the day. A half cup at a time with at least an hour or two between dose, was about right, meaning no diarrhea.
> Now how does TMG give you sulfur? ..the methyl bit I presume. So how is the methyl? and sulfur linked?
> Would l-methioine be any good..There was a long thread about TMG and methionine (among other things) last year, starting here: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/alter/20031104/msgs/278139.html http://www.naturalcity.com.au/ViewProductsports.aspx?ID=96 I was just looking for that recently because I can't remember how much TMG I used to take as I am taking it again.
Have you ever taken SAMe?
> or even l-arginine? How is that liked in. Sorry for all these questions. I'm sure everyone knows I never expect answers but happy if I get any:)
I hope someone answers that because I had thought of taking that once and then decided it was contraindicated for me, but I don't remember now why!
> I felt great this morning for the first time in ages, and for some reason my skin is not so dehydrated..can pinch it and it goes back..also I seem to be retaining water better!! yah! hope it lasts! Actually slept thru last night for the first time in decades maybe!Hey, that's GREAT! :) There's nothing like sleeping well when you haven't been.
> Jlx..on magnesium..what IS your favourite brand . I guess it's magnesium taurate? Can you post me a link to your favourite ones? I'm sensitive to lots of fillers so I need to read fie print or email etc for ingredient details, sigh...or buy straight powders or caps from good suppliers like Thorne research etc.
I haven't tried mg taurate yet. If I'd known the price went down so much, I would have bought some recently instead of mg glycinate. I mix up my brands of mg. I bought some bulk from Beyond a Century, of both mg malate and mg glycinae.(They don't ship overseas.) Otherwise I take mg malate, NOW brand and mg glycinate, Carlson brand. http://www.carlsonlabs.com/ Cardiovascular Research is the brand for mg taurate I've seen. Maybe it's the only one. You can get that at Vitamin Shoppe and also through Amazon.
> Ray, I get lost with some of your supps so if you ever have links can you post them?.. if its allowed?
> Thanks for any help with this ..like to discuss what supps with sulphur giving properties anyone has really liked! I know TMG for Lar and Ray..
I'm not sure what MSM does in terms of sulfur, but I've been taking it for a while. I think that's why I don't notice much effect now from TMG. MSM helps my sore gums and teeth a lot. I have that in bulk too, but also was taking Source Naturals MSM. It also has Vit. C and molybdenum. I was thinking that I liked that brand better than my bulk powder, so maybe there's some advantage in them all being together like that. I think I'll get some more.
It's too bad you have to pay so much for shipping on these things.
JL
Posted by raybakes on November 4, 2004, at 13:51:23
In reply to Re: methylation supps/ sulphonating? ..Jlx, Lar, RAY, posted by JLx on November 4, 2004, at 11:16:06
>
> > or even l-arginine? How is that liked in. Sorry for all these questions. I'm sure everyone knows I never expect answers but happy if I get any:)
>
>arginine is the amino acid that donates nitric oxide, the gas/neurotransmitter that dilates blood vessels, but also is a free radical induced by the immune system to destroy pathogens. Think it's also involved in memory, and erection for men
- viagra helps preserve nitric oxide! If nitric oxide combines with superoxide, it becomes the potent free radical, peroxynitrite.arginine is part of the urea cycle in the kidney, to safely remove ammonia from protein metabolism.
One article said 40% of our daily intake of arginine is used to produce creatine, essential for ATP production and pH balance in cells.
arginine and lysine are methylated within the DNA to regulate gene expression - particularly important in the expression of immune cells - not sure what's best for autoimmune disease, but naturopaths talk about avoiding arginine with the herpes virus - any truth in that, does anyone know?
Ray
Posted by Larry Hoover on November 4, 2004, at 14:43:54
In reply to Re: methylation supps/ sulphonating? ..Jlx, Lar, RAY » JLx, posted by raybakes on November 4, 2004, at 13:51:23
> - viagra helps preserve nitric oxide! If nitric oxide combines with superoxide, it becomes the potent free radical, peroxynitrite.
Right. And I wonder if erectile dysfunction isn't part of a feedback loop suppressing nitric oxide synthase, because of concentrations of peroxynitrite passing a critical level.
> arginine is part of the urea cycle in the kidney, to safely remove ammonia from protein metabolism.
More interesting to me is the role of inosine, as a precursor to uric acid. Apparently uric acid mops up peroxynitrite but leaves NO alone. This would have the effect of shutting down the feedback loop to NO, without affecting normal NO activity.....or so it seems to me.
Inosine is a prescription substance in Canada, but is freely available, over the counter, in the U.S. Aaaackkk! I ordered some anyway. Worth the risk of seizure.
Lar
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Alternative | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.