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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 17 of 17. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by linkadge on July 31, 2004, at 9:34:00
Does anyone know this ??
Linkadge
Posted by Larry Hoover on July 31, 2004, at 10:57:43
In reply to is ginkgo neurotrophic ???, posted by linkadge on July 31, 2004, at 9:34:00
> Does anyone know this ??
>
> LinkadgeYes.
Acta Pharmacol Sin. 2000 Feb;21(2):151-5.
Bilobalide promotes expression of glial cell line-derived neurotrophic factor and vascular endothelial growth factor in rat astrocytes.
Zheng SX, Zhou LJ, Chen ZL, Yin ML, Zhu XZ.
Shanghai Institute of Materia Medica, Chinese Academy of Sciences, Shanghai 200031, China.
AIM: To study the effects of bilobalide on the expression of glial cell line-derived neurotrophic factor (GDNF) and vascular endothelial growth factor (VEGF) in rat astrocytes in vitro. METHODS: Semiquantification polymerase chain reaction (SQ-PCR) was used to investigate GDNF and VEGF mRNA expression in the astrocytes after bilobalide (5, 15, 50, 100 mumol.L-1) treatment. Immunohistochemistry method was used to detect GDNF and VEGF protein expression in cells treated with bilobalide 50 mumol.L-1 for 24 h. RESULTS: GDNF and VEGF mRNA increased markedly after astrocytes were treated with bilobalide 50 mumol.L-1 for 12 h. GDNF and VEGF protein were detected in the cytoplasm of astrocytes after the cells were treated with bilobalide 50 mumol.L-1 for 24 h. CONCLUSION: Bilobalide induced GDNF and VEGF expression in the cultured astrocytes.
Posted by linkadge on July 31, 2004, at 11:09:52
In reply to Re: is ginkgo neurotrophic ??? » linkadge, posted by Larry Hoover on July 31, 2004, at 10:57:43
Thanks a lot.
Linkadge
Posted by SLS on July 31, 2004, at 11:37:45
In reply to Re: good to know, posted by linkadge on July 31, 2004, at 11:09:52
People often forget about those cute little glial cells. They only outnumber neurons by a factor of 9 to 1! Now, I understand that they are capable of not only modulating the excitability of neurons, but also of sending each other messages using calcium and ATP. Just when you think you've got it all figured out...
- Scott
Posted by Larry Hoover on July 31, 2004, at 11:57:56
In reply to Re: good to know, posted by SLS on July 31, 2004, at 11:37:45
> People often forget about those cute little glial cells. They only outnumber neurons by a factor of 9 to 1! Now, I understand that they are capable of not only modulating the excitability of neurons, but also of sending each other messages using calcium and ATP. Just when you think you've got it all figured out...
>
>
> - ScottYa, glial cells are the worker bees of the brain.
Also, there's more to ginkgo than that, vis a vis stress and mood.
Cell Mol Biol (Noisy-le-grand). 2002 Sep;48(6):633-9.
Use of ginkgolide B and a ginkgolide-activated response element to control gene transcription: example of the adrenocortical peripheral-type benzodiazepine receptor.
Amri H, Drieu K, Papadopoulos V.
Department of Cell Biology, Georgetown University Medical Center, Washington, DC, USA.
Identification of the molecular switch controlling glucocorticoid synthesis might facilitate the development of pharmacological tools to control circulating cortisol levels. The transport of cholesterol from intracellular sources to the inner mitochondrial membrane represents the rate-determining step in the cascade of reactions leading to cortisol synthesis. A key element in this step is the peripheral-type benzodiazepine receptor (PBR). Several studies have indicated the beneficial effects of Ginkgo biloba on memory and stress control. Using pharmacological, biochemical and proteomic methods, we demonstrated that the standardized Ginkgo biloba extract EGb 761 and its isolated component ginkgolide B (GKB) inhibit PBR ligand binding and protein expression, resulting in decreased serum corticosterone levels. We further demonstrated that EGb 761- and GKB-induced inhibition of PBR protein is preceded by a decrease in mRNA-levels due to transcriptional suppression of PBR gene expression. Further studies indicated that the action of GKB is mediated by a transcription factor binding to the PBR gene promoter, thereby regulating PBR gene expression. These data indicate that EGb 761-induced inhibition of glucocorticoid production is due to specific transcriptional suppression of the adrenal PBR gene by GKB, and suggest that EGb 761 and GKB might serve as pharmacological tools to control excess glucocorticoid
formation.
Int Immunopharmacol. 2003 Jan;3(1):75-80.Effect of Ginkgo biloba extract, EGb 761, on the cellular immune response in a hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis activation model in the rat.
Puebla-Perez AM, Lozoya X, Villasenor-Garcia MM.
Laboratorio de Inmunofarmacologia de Productos Naturales, Centro de Investigacion Biomedica de Occidente, Mexico. ampuebla@cencar.udg.mx
We evaluated the effects of Ginkgo biloba extract (EGb 761) on the cellular immune response of rats with immunosuppression induced by activation of the hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal (HPA) axis. Groups of five rats were subjected to chronic stress by the application of daily electric shocks (ES) over 7 days. This stress produced a significant decrement in the delayed-type hypersensitivity response (DTH) to dinitrofluorobenzene (DNFB), and a decrease in the proliferation index of splenocytes. Treatment with oral doses of the phytopharmaceutical EGb 761 (100 mg/kg per day over 7 days) restored both the DTH response to DNFB and the proliferation index. EGb 761 has stress-alleviating properties through its moderation of corticosterone levels. It also possesses antioxidant activity that may contribute to its effects on the immune response. Our observations indicate that the phytopharmaceutical EGb 761 possesses immunostimulatory properties.
Posted by linkadge on July 31, 2004, at 12:48:50
In reply to Re: good to know » SLS, posted by Larry Hoover on July 31, 2004, at 11:57:56
I know this discusion has been raised many times before so I only want to touch on in breifly.
other than ginkgo, vitamin C, B6 etc. Can you think of any other supplements that have appreciable immune regulating properpties.
I understand that the tryciclics have somewhat more potential for this action than the SSRI's
Linkadge
Posted by mcp on July 31, 2004, at 13:07:08
In reply to is ginkgo neurotrophic ???, posted by linkadge on July 31, 2004, at 9:34:00
As I said in an above post, Gingko Biloba has made a huge difference for me. I was really having a rough time with withdrawals from Lexapro. Gingko has really done the job on the headaches and the dizziness. I know it is the Gingko because I tried many other things and I didn't feel better until right after I started taking the Ginko. I am so glad I found it.
Posted by Larry Hoover on July 31, 2004, at 13:19:09
In reply to Re: good to know, posted by linkadge on July 31, 2004, at 12:48:50
> I know this discusion has been raised many times before so I only want to touch on in breifly.
>
> other than ginkgo, vitamin C, B6 etc. Can you think of any other supplements that have appreciable immune regulating properpties.
>
> I understand that the tryciclics have somewhat more potential for this action than the SSRI's
>
>
> LinkadgeFish oil suppresses immune reactivity. So does taurine.
Neurochem Res. 2004 Jan;29(1):117-26.
Taurine and its chloramine: modulators of immunity.
Schuller-Levis GB, Park E.
Immunology Department, New York State Institute for Basic Research in Developmental Disabilities, Staten Island, New York, New York 10314, USA. georgial_levis@yahoo.com
Taurine is a semiessential amino acid that is not incorporated into proteins. In mammalian tissues, taurine is ubiquitous and is the most abundant free amino acid in the heart, retina, skeletal muscle, and leukocytes. Taurine reaches up to 50 mM concentration in leukocytes. Taurine has been shown to be tissue-protective in many models of oxidant-induced injury. One possibility is that taurine reacts with HOCl, produced by the myeloperoxidase (MPO) pathway, to produce the more stable but less toxic taurine chloramine (Tau-Cl). However, data from several laboratories demonstrate that Tau-Cl is a powerful regulator of the immune system. Specifically, Tau-Cl has been shown to downregulate the production of proinflammatory mediators in both rodent and human leukocytes. Recent molecular studies on the function of taurine provide evidence that taurine is a constituent of biological macromolecules. Specifically, two novel taurine-containing modified uridines have been found in both human and bovine mitrochondria. In studies on mechanism of action, Tau-Cl inhibits the activation of NFkappaB, a potent signal transducer for inflammatory cytokines, by oxidation of IkappaB alpha at methionine45. Taurine transporter knockout mice show reduced taurine, reduced fertility, and loss of vision resulting from severe retinal degeneration, which was found to be due to apoptosis. Apoptosis induced by amino chloramines is a current and important finding because oxidants derived from leukocytes play a key role in killing pathogens. The fundamental importance of taurine in adaptive and acquired immunity will be revealed using genetic manipulation.
Posted by SLS on July 31, 2004, at 13:47:32
In reply to Re: good to know » linkadge, posted by Larry Hoover on July 31, 2004, at 13:19:09
Would taurine be helpful when dealing with an autoimmune disease?
- Scott
Posted by SLS on July 31, 2004, at 13:57:55
In reply to Re: good to know » SLS, posted by Larry Hoover on July 31, 2004, at 11:57:56
I'm have trouble understanding this stuff. Is PBR acting as a carrier for cholesterol?
- Scott
> Use of ginkgolide B and a ginkgolide-activated response element to control gene transcription: example of the adrenocortical peripheral-type benzodiazepine receptor.
>
> Amri H, Drieu K, Papadopoulos V.
>
> Department of Cell Biology, Georgetown University Medical Center, Washington, DC, USA.
>
> Identification of the molecular switch controlling glucocorticoid synthesis might facilitate the development of pharmacological tools to control circulating cortisol levels. The transport of cholesterol from intracellular sources to the inner mitochondrial membrane represents the rate-determining step in the cascade of reactions leading to cortisol synthesis. A key element in this step is the peripheral-type benzodiazepine receptor (PBR). Several studies have indicated the beneficial effects of Ginkgo biloba on memory and stress control. Using pharmacological, biochemical and proteomic methods, we demonstrated that the standardized Ginkgo biloba extract EGb 761 and its isolated component ginkgolide B (GKB) inhibit PBR ligand binding and protein expression, resulting in decreased serum corticosterone levels. We further demonstrated that EGb 761- and GKB-induced inhibition of PBR protein is preceded by a decrease in mRNA-levels due to transcriptional suppression of PBR gene expression. Further studies indicated that the action of GKB is mediated by a transcription factor binding to the PBR gene promoter, thereby regulating PBR gene expression. These data indicate that EGb 761-induced inhibition of glucocorticoid production is due to specific transcriptional suppression of the adrenal PBR gene by GKB, and suggest that EGb 761 and GKB might serve as pharmacological tools to control excess glucocorticoid
> formation.
>
>
> Int Immunopharmacol. 2003 Jan;3(1):75-80.
>
> Effect of Ginkgo biloba extract, EGb 761, on the cellular immune response in a hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis activation model in the rat.
>
> Puebla-Perez AM, Lozoya X, Villasenor-Garcia MM.
>
> Laboratorio de Inmunofarmacologia de Productos Naturales, Centro de Investigacion Biomedica de Occidente, Mexico. ampuebla@cencar.udg.mx
>
> We evaluated the effects of Ginkgo biloba extract (EGb 761) on the cellular immune response of rats with immunosuppression induced by activation of the hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal (HPA) axis. Groups of five rats were subjected to chronic stress by the application of daily electric shocks (ES) over 7 days. This stress produced a significant decrement in the delayed-type hypersensitivity response (DTH) to dinitrofluorobenzene (DNFB), and a decrease in the proliferation index of splenocytes. Treatment with oral doses of the phytopharmaceutical EGb 761 (100 mg/kg per day over 7 days) restored both the DTH response to DNFB and the proliferation index. EGb 761 has stress-alleviating properties through its moderation of corticosterone levels. It also possesses antioxidant activity that may contribute to its effects on the immune response. Our observations indicate that the phytopharmaceutical EGb 761 possesses immunostimulatory properties.
>
>
>
Posted by Larry Hoover on July 31, 2004, at 13:58:10
In reply to Re: good to know, posted by SLS on July 31, 2004, at 13:47:32
> Would taurine be helpful when dealing with an autoimmune disease?
>
>
> - ScottThat's a pretty broad question. Maybe you might want to skim through this thread, and see if something pops out at you?
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/alter/20040613/msgs/365023.html
Lar
Posted by Larry Hoover on July 31, 2004, at 14:15:44
In reply to Re: good to know, posted by SLS on July 31, 2004, at 13:57:55
> I'm have trouble understanding this stuff. Is PBR acting as a carrier for cholesterol?
>
>
> - ScottI did the update for Internet Explorer today, and it isn't working right. I've lost two posts already. Ragga-fragga frigga Bill Gates.
I shall try again.
The peripheral-type benzodiazepine receptor regulates the uptake of cholesterol from blood by e.g. the adrenals and the testes. Cholesterol serves as the raw material for the various steroids. Suppression of that uptake will suppress e.g. glucocorticoid synthesis in the adrenals. Gingko also suppresses the genetic expression of the PBR receptor, leading to general downregulation. So, ginkgo suppresses existing cholesterol uptake capacity, and downregulates potential uptake down the road. This leads to reduced cortisol levels immediately, and over time.
Testosterone synthesis is more complexly regulated, and I know of no link to testosterone suppression via gingko. It's possible, though.
Lar
Posted by mcp on August 1, 2004, at 21:51:56
In reply to Re: good to know » SLS, posted by Larry Hoover on July 31, 2004, at 14:15:44
Larry, is this a good or bad thing. Seeing that I am taking Gingko for SSRI withdrawals and I plan on taking it after, I would appreciate if you would put this in laymen's terms. Thanks
> > I'm have trouble understanding this stuff. Is PBR acting as a carrier for cholesterol?
> >
> >
> > - Scott
>
> I did the update for Internet Explorer today, and it isn't working right. I've lost two posts already. Ragga-fragga frigga Bill Gates.
>
> I shall try again.
>
> The peripheral-type benzodiazepine receptor regulates the uptake of cholesterol from blood by e.g. the adrenals and the testes. Cholesterol serves as the raw material for the various steroids. Suppression of that uptake will suppress e.g. glucocorticoid synthesis in the adrenals. Gingko also suppresses the genetic expression of the PBR receptor, leading to general downregulation. So, ginkgo suppresses existing cholesterol uptake capacity, and downregulates potential uptake down the road. This leads to reduced cortisol levels immediately, and over time.
>
> Testosterone synthesis is more complexly regulated, and I know of no link to testosterone suppression via gingko. It's possible, though.
>
> Lar
Posted by linkadge on August 2, 2004, at 8:45:34
In reply to Larry, translation please!, posted by mcp on August 1, 2004, at 21:51:56
Posted by Larry Hoover on August 2, 2004, at 10:10:47
In reply to Larry, translation please!, posted by mcp on August 1, 2004, at 21:51:56
> Larry, is this a good or bad thing. Seeing that I am taking Gingko for SSRI withdrawals and I plan on taking it after, I would appreciate if you would put this in laymen's terms. Thanks
A translation of my translation? No problemo. No point spouting words that don't get caught on the other end, eh?
One of the effects of SSRI meds is to reduce the intensity of stress responses. Cortisol, the adrenal hormone, is a key player in stress responsivity. It's not exactly clear where the SSRIs have their effect on stress, but everything's kind of all connected together in such a way that the end result is that you release less cortisol when you use an SSRI. SSRIs help take the load off.
Now, as a simile, then. If your legs are tired, you might sit in a chair. SSRIs are like the chair for your tired stressed self. And, just like the literal chair, you kind of quickly get used to having the SSRI there, propping you up. Withdrawing from an SSRI suddenly is like having the chair break, or being pulled out from under you. It's not that you can't support your weight. You weren't ready to do it.
Taking Ginkgo helps replace the cortisol suppressing activity of the SSRI while you are withdrawing from the latter. It does so by a different mechanism, but so what. It helps support you while the other support is weakened.
That was a gross simplification, and may not apply to all people (adrenal (dys)function with depression can take many forms). I think the simplification applies to you, though.
Lar
P.S. I'm gone for a couple weeks of R and R.
Posted by Larry Hoover on August 2, 2004, at 10:18:58
In reply to would a low cholesterol diet reduce cortisol ?? (nm), posted by linkadge on August 2, 2004, at 8:45:34
Contrary to popular belief, very little of the cholesterol which circulates in your blood originates from diet. The range might be that 3 to 15% is of dietary origin (barring specific disease states). The rest is all synthesized by your own liver.
There are specific genes which tell the liver how much to make, how to sense what is in the blood, and so on. Dietary factors influence those regulatory parameters. Your genes determine the upper and lower bounds of blood cholesterol. Your diet determines where in those bounds the actual values will lie. Trans fats, for example, mess with the sensory part of cholesterol regulation (as far as I can tell), so your liver thinks there's less than there really is, and you pump out more. Restricting cholesterol intake is really not an effective method of regulating total cholesterol.
Cholesterol is an essential component of things like neuronal membranes, and assists neurotransmitter receptor function. It's more than just a raw material for cortisol synthesis. You need to target cortisol directly, or you'll mess up other stuff that really matters.
Lar
Posted by KaraS on August 10, 2004, at 2:38:04
In reply to My two cents on Gingko and SSRI withdrawals, posted by mcp on July 31, 2004, at 13:07:08
> As I said in an above post, Gingko Biloba has made a huge difference for me. I was really having a rough time with withdrawals from Lexapro. Gingko has really done the job on the headaches and the dizziness. I know it is the Gingko because I tried many other things and I didn't feel better until right after I started taking the Ginko. I am so glad I found it.
How much did you take and what brand? I'm trying to get off of Effexor right now. I'm down to a small amount but am now having some nausea, headaches and dizziness. I haven't had much of a problem until I cut down a little bit more last night. Now I'm really feeling it. I have to function tomorrow so tonight I just went back up to the previous dosage.(I wonder why Gingko works for this...)
Thanks for your two cents.
-K
This is the end of the thread.
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