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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by crazychickuk on July 1, 2004, at 4:29:58
I need some help and advice plse, i am currently deressed with severe anxiety and panick attacks i currently take 30mg remeron which i want to come off of as it aint helping me, and i am having bouts of depression severe depression with all the neg thoughts etc, i wanna try a herb any reccomendations plse? st johns wart? wat you think? any negs? pos?
#thanks
Posted by Larry Hoover on July 3, 2004, at 9:57:47
In reply to ANY HERBALISTS I NEED ADVICE PLSE-sjw?, posted by crazychickuk on July 1, 2004, at 4:29:58
> I need some help and advice plse, i am currently deressed with severe anxiety and panick attacks i currently take 30mg remeron which i want to come off of as it aint helping me, and i am having bouts of depression severe depression with all the neg thoughts etc, i wanna try a herb any reccomendations plse? st johns wart? wat you think? any negs? pos?
>
> #thanksCC, I've been aware of your struggle for some time, and before we get into specifics, I want to say that you're unlikely to find any treatment that helps you feel absolutely comfortable, right away. If you think back, I'm sure you'll see that it took some time for your symptoms to rise to their current level. It's going to take some time, and some luck, to reverse that trend.
There are a number of herbs you might consider. Some of them should not be taken with Remeron (e.g. SJW), because there is a risk of serious interaction. But there are other herbs, falling in the category of adaptogen (a Russian term), which may be useful and safe with Remeron. Still, you will have to introduce new herbs (they are drugs) slowly, and pay attention for adverse events.
Two herbs which you might consider are Siberian Ginseng (Eleuthera), or roseroot (Rhodiola rosea). Both can have calming properties. Take the lowest daily dose possible, of one or the other (not both), and just see if you tolerate it. That's one place to start.
I'm going to offer some advice in the other thread you started, and it may be difficult to keep two distinct concepts separate. When you change a bunch of things at the same time, you don't know which effects come from which changes. I would rather you started with nutrional supplements, than with herbs, but the choice is up to you.
Lar
Posted by KaraS on July 12, 2004, at 0:17:25
In reply to Re: ANY HERBALISTS I NEED ADVICE PLSE-sjw? » crazychickuk, posted by Larry Hoover on July 3, 2004, at 9:57:47
> > I need some help and advice plse, i am currently deressed with severe anxiety and panick attacks i currently take 30mg remeron which i want to come off of as it aint helping me, and i am having bouts of depression severe depression with all the neg thoughts etc, i wanna try a herb any reccomendations plse? st johns wart? wat you think? any negs? pos?
> >
> > #thanks
>
> CC, I've been aware of your struggle for some time, and before we get into specifics, I want to say that you're unlikely to find any treatment that helps you feel absolutely comfortable, right away. If you think back, I'm sure you'll see that it took some time for your symptoms to rise to their current level. It's going to take some time, and some luck, to reverse that trend.
>
> There are a number of herbs you might consider. Some of them should not be taken with Remeron (e.g. SJW), because there is a risk of serious interaction. But there are other herbs, falling in the category of adaptogen (a Russian term), which may be useful and safe with Remeron. Still, you will have to introduce new herbs (they are drugs) slowly, and pay attention for adverse events.
>
> Two herbs which you might consider are Siberian Ginseng (Eleuthera), or roseroot (Rhodiola rosea). Both can have calming properties. Take the lowest daily dose possible, of one or the other (not both), and just see if you tolerate it. That's one place to start.
>
> I'm going to offer some advice in the other thread you started, and it may be difficult to keep two distinct concepts separate. When you change a bunch of things at the same time, you don't know which effects come from which changes. I would rather you started with nutrional supplements, than with herbs, but the choice is up to you.
>
> Lar
>
>Larry, For what it's worth - I used to have panic disorder with agoraphobia many years ago. Although Rhodiola and Ginseng have sedative properties underneath, they also are quite stimulating for most people. I definitely couldn't have tolerated the Ginseng and I'm not sure yet about the Rhodiola.
I wonder if crazychick was using the term "herbs" to include nutrients and nutraceuticals which would open up so many other options like picamilon, l-theonine, taurine and all of those other things that you know more about than I do.
Hope you don't mind me adding my two cents.
Kara
Posted by Larry Hoover on July 14, 2004, at 8:24:05
In reply to Re: ANY HERBALISTS I NEED ADVICE PLSE-sjw?, posted by KaraS on July 12, 2004, at 0:17:25
> Larry, For what it's worth - I used to have panic disorder with agoraphobia many years ago. Although Rhodiola and Ginseng have sedative properties underneath, they also are quite stimulating for most people. I definitely couldn't have tolerated the Ginseng and I'm not sure yet about the Rhodiola.I've only ever had two panic attacks, and they were many years ago. I certainly never had to deal with them over a period of time. Perhaps, then, Withania somnifera (the Ayurvedic Ashwaghanda), might be a better choice.
> I wonder if crazychick was using the term "herbs" to include nutrients and nutraceuticals which would open up so many other options like picamilon, l-theonine, taurine and all of those other things that you know more about than I do.That's why I tried to direct her to nutrients first. I think that's the place to start. I wonder how she is/where she went?
> Hope you don't mind me adding my two cents.
> KaraI never mind. I learn nothing if I'm never wrong.
Lar
Posted by KaraS on July 14, 2004, at 12:42:34
In reply to Re: ANY HERBALISTS I NEED ADVICE PLSE-sjw? » KaraS, posted by Larry Hoover on July 14, 2004, at 8:24:05
>
> > Larry, For what it's worth - I used to have panic disorder with agoraphobia many years ago. Although Rhodiola and Ginseng have sedative properties underneath, they also are quite stimulating for most people. I definitely couldn't have tolerated the Ginseng and I'm not sure yet about the Rhodiola.
>
> I've only ever had two panic attacks, and they were many years ago. I certainly never had to deal with them over a period of time. Perhaps, then, Withania somnifera (the Ayurvedic Ashwaghanda), might be a better choice.
>IMHO that sounds like a good suggestion.
> > I wonder if crazychick was using the term "herbs" to include nutrients and nutraceuticals which would open up so many other options like picamilon, l-theonine, taurine and all of those other things that you know more about than I do.
>
> That's why I tried to direct her to nutrients first. I think that's the place to start. I wonder how she is/where she went?
>Oh, I didn't realize or remember that.
> > Hope you don't mind me adding my two cents.
> > Kara
>
> I never mind. I learn nothing if I'm never wrong.
Good. Thanks.
-K-
>
> Lar
>
Posted by gabbix2 on July 14, 2004, at 14:19:19
In reply to Re: ANY HERBALISTS I NEED ADVICE PLSE-sjw?, posted by KaraS on July 14, 2004, at 12:42:34
> >
> > > Larry, For what it's worth - I used to have >panic disorder with agoraphobia many years ago. >Although Rhodiola and Ginseng have sedative >properties underneath, they also are quite >stimulating for most people.Eleuthro is not a true Ginseng, and not stimulanting like the other Ginsengs can be. As Larry mentioned it's an adaptogen
and is almost always included in the most effective herbal calming blends for panic and stress.
Posted by KaraS on July 14, 2004, at 15:12:05
In reply to Re: ANY HERBALISTS I NEED ADVICE PLSE-sjw?, posted by gabbix2 on July 14, 2004, at 14:19:19
> > >
> > > > Larry, For what it's worth - I used to have >panic disorder with agoraphobia many years ago. >Although Rhodiola and Ginseng have sedative >properties underneath, they also are quite >stimulating for most people.
>
> Eleuthro is not a true Ginseng, and not stimulanting like the other Ginsengs can be. As Larry mentioned it's an adaptogen
> and is almost always included in the most effective herbal calming blends for panic and stress.
>Yes, Eleuthro (formerly known as Siberian Ginseng) is supposed to be less stimulating than the true Ginsengs. I had a bad experience with it though. Maybe it was just me but it made me quite wired. I felt like an electric current was being run through my body. It was an awful feeling. Maybe it will work for crazychick though.
Posted by gabbix2 on July 14, 2004, at 17:21:46
In reply to Re: ANY HERBALISTS I NEED ADVICE PLSE-sjw?, posted by KaraS on July 14, 2004, at 15:12:05
Oh that's too bad. I just hate it when things that are "miracles" for other people don't work for me. I'm very sensitive to stimulants and had no problem with Eleuthero, but it's all so personal. I've heard of people having paradoxical effects to Valerian also.
Posted by KaraS on July 14, 2004, at 17:41:40
In reply to Re: ANY HERBALISTS I NEED ADVICE PLSE-sjw? » KaraS, posted by gabbix2 on July 14, 2004, at 17:21:46
> Oh that's too bad. I just hate it when things that are "miracles" for other people don't work for me. I'm very sensitive to stimulants and had no problem with Eleuthero, but it's all so personal. I've heard of people having paradoxical effects to Valerian also.
>Funny you should mention Valerian...
I hope I'm not one of those people who reacts that way to it because it's on my list to try soon as a sleep aid.
Posted by Larry Hoover on July 14, 2004, at 18:02:31
In reply to Re: ANY HERBALISTS I NEED ADVICE PLSE-sjw? » KaraS, posted by gabbix2 on July 14, 2004, at 17:21:46
> Oh that's too bad. I just hate it when things that are "miracles" for other people don't work for me. I'm very sensitive to stimulants and had no problem with Eleuthero, but it's all so personal. I've heard of people having paradoxical effects to Valerian also.
Oh, yes, paradoxical effects to stinky-sox valerian. Like drinking a pot of coffee. Didn't sleep a wink.
Lar
Posted by gabbix2 on July 14, 2004, at 19:22:09
In reply to Re: ANY HERBALISTS I NEED ADVICE PLSE-sjw? » gabbix2, posted by Larry Hoover on July 14, 2004, at 18:02:31
>Oh, yes, paradoxical effects to stinky-sox >valerian. Like drinking a pot of coffee. Didn't >sleep a wink.
>Lar
And a pot of coffee would make me sleepy..
It just goes on and onAnd boy, can I derail a thread.
Shame on me.
I should be punished.
Posted by liberty jones on July 16, 2004, at 15:34:47
In reply to Re: ANY HERBALISTS I NEED ADVICE PLSE-sjw?, posted by gabbix2 on July 14, 2004, at 19:22:09
Shame on me.
I should be punished.
:)
Posted by gabbix2 on July 16, 2004, at 20:17:30
In reply to Re: ANY HERBALISTS I NEED ADVICE PLSE-sjw? » gabbix2, posted by liberty jones on July 16, 2004, at 15:34:47
; )
This is the end of the thread.
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