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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 11 of 11. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by paxvox on August 6, 2003, at 15:29:11
OK, fine, I quit this thread. I see that it is leading nowhere, and is just becoming a pi**ing contest. I'm not going to play along. Larry, say what you wish about me, I will consider it moot. Ame san..whatever. I don't have to defend myself, as doing so will only provoke Dr. Bob to see me as being uncivil. So, I take my leave from this discussion. Ya'll have fun with it though, please feel free to carry on.
PAX
Posted by zenhussy on August 6, 2003, at 18:47:36
In reply to I QUIT!, posted by paxvox on August 6, 2003, at 15:29:11
> OK, fine, I quit this thread. I see that it is leading nowhere, and is just becoming a pi**ing contest. I'm not going to play along. Larry, say what you wish about me, I will consider it moot. Ame san..whatever. I don't have to defend myself, as doing so will only provoke Dr. Bob to see me as being uncivil. So, I take my leave from this discussion. Ya'll have fun with it though, please feel free to carry on.
>
> PAXPax,
I for one will be quite sad to see these board without your contributions but understand and respcct your reasons for leaving. You are joining a number of posters driven from the boards for reasons obvious only to them.
I sadly say goodbye.
zenhussy
Posted by Larry Hoover on August 7, 2003, at 6:46:54
In reply to I QUIT!, posted by paxvox on August 6, 2003, at 15:29:11
> OK, fine, I quit this thread. I see that it is leading nowhere, and is just becoming a pi**ing contest. I'm not going to play along. Larry, say what you wish about me, I will consider it moot.
I wasn't talking about you.....I was talking about the values you expressed. I believe that distintion was apparent to others, but I can easily see why that was hard for you. I'm sorry for your taking offense.
>Ame san..whatever. I don't have to defend myself, as doing so will only provoke Dr. Bob to see me as being uncivil.
That's certainly a risk, given the anger you've retained overnight.
>So, I take my leave from this discussion.
I was hoping to have a discussion, but there hasn't been one yet. All I've heard in reply from you is anger, so there's nothing more to discuss.
> Ya'll have fun with it though, please feel free to carry on.
> PAXI'm a victim of violence, both verbal and physical. Although those events happened decades ago, their impact is with me still. It may be permanent. I remain highly tuned to some of the marker characteristics. If I've got you wrong, explain to me just how I've got you wrong.
My emotional reaction to your posting was quite powerful. To paraphrase, the idea that you wished to have some freedom to be more "verbally liberated", while those offended or hurt could always just walk away (as if), or that the hurt was trivial anyway, really didn't sit well with me. And, it doesn't matter what benefit you bring to the group, mixed in with the negatives. The whole issue *is* the negatives.
I fully accept the possibility that I have misunderstood you, but that was *my* understanding of what you said, and my motive.
Lar
Posted by shar on August 7, 2003, at 13:52:18
In reply to I QUIT!, posted by paxvox on August 6, 2003, at 15:29:11
Pax,
I'm glad you are quitting the thread and not the Babbles. Quitting a thread is often the best approach, imo, washing your hands of it and moving on, but still being around to post in other threads and on different boards.You were absent for quite a while once, and I missed you. I'd hate to see that happen again.
Shar
Posted by Dr. Bob on August 7, 2003, at 20:49:04
In reply to Re: I QUIT! » paxvox, posted by Larry Hoover on August 7, 2003, at 6:46:54
> I was hoping to have a discussion, but there hasn't been one yet. All I've heard in reply from you is anger
>
> it doesn't matter what benefit you bring to the group...It's perfectly understandable that people will sometimes have strong reactions here, but still the idea is not to post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down. Keeping that in mind, could you please rephrase the above? Thanks,
Bob
Posted by Zo on August 8, 2003, at 0:54:42
In reply to Re: I QUIT! » paxvox, posted by Larry Hoover on August 7, 2003, at 6:46:54
See, Lar, Pax never offended anybody in his life. All the turmoil over what is civil and who's offending whom is an outgrowth of the misunderstandings at the core. I think you understanding, after a year or two of trying, people just about go bonkers. . .people for whom it is normal to feel frustrations at not being heard, not being responded to.In real life, people talk through these things. This has become, for reasons precisely due to the personality - or biology - of the admin - an unhealthy place for a great many people who are perfectly, resoundingly healthy, by any standards but here.
People who are also *highly* reluctant to "blame it on Bob."
No blame attends. It does need to come out into the open that special circumstances apply, here.
Or, I suppose, this can be a board for the contained. Bob has expressed his vision of himself as Smokey the Bear who must stamp out fires before they begin.
But when he senses a fire, many of us know that he is sensing incorrrectly, and have known that this belief symbolizes methods of moderating that, no matter how good-hearted and well-meant, categoricially fail to provide the kind of container that promotes mental health.
Have I said that clearly enough? Does anybody get it? Bob, you haven't said anything - what do you think?
I'm content to just stay away. But it's been over a year since I started posting directly, here, about the unspoken. Spoken *off* list - but not voiced here. I never did like tip-toeing around . , that "you're only as sick as your secrets" thing. Blessings on all. It's been two solid years now without depression--after twenty-two years of being sick. There's hope for all. Just. . take your meds!
And Bob - talk to someone about this. Really. I know it's the very last thing you want to do, but try and just take my word for it. Just - accept. Consider. Imagine there is merit not only to what I'm saying but what everyone has been saying, all along. Everyone will benefit. You too.
Fondly,
Zo
Posted by Larry Hoover on August 8, 2003, at 13:26:15
In reply to Re: I QUIT! » Larry Hoover, posted by Zo on August 8, 2003, at 0:54:42
>
> See, Lar, Pax never offended anybody in his life.Wrong. Or are my feelings not relevant?
> In real life, people talk through these things. This has become, for reasons precisely due to the personality - or biology - of the admin - an unhealthy place for a great many people who are perfectly, resoundingly healthy, by any standards but here.
Who says this is a place for healthy people? (rhetorical question)
> But when he senses a fire, many of us know that he is sensing incorrrectly, and have known that this belief symbolizes methods of moderating that, no matter how good-hearted and well-meant, categoricially fail to provide the kind of container that promotes mental health.
Your hyperbole does not mesh with my perceptions.
> I'm content to just stay away.
Perhaps you've outgrown the environment?
Forgive the trite comment, but recovery is a journey, not a destination. Babble is a way-station.
Lar
Posted by Dr. Bob on August 9, 2003, at 0:55:52
In reply to Re: I QUIT! » Larry Hoover, posted by Zo on August 8, 2003, at 0:54:42
> after a year or two of trying, people just about go bonkers. . .people for whom it is normal to feel frustrations at not being heard, not being responded to.
This site definitely isn't for everyone.
> This has become ... an unhealthy place for a great many people who are perfectly, resoundingly healthy, by any standards but here.
When I block someone from posting, it is *not* intended to imply that I don't think they're healthy.
> People who are also *highly* reluctant to "blame it on Bob."
Some people, maybe. :-)
> Or, I suppose, this can be a board for the contained. Bob has expressed his vision of himself as Smokey the Bear who must stamp out fires before they begin.
I guess one way to see it is in fact as a board for the relatively containable.
Smokey Bear doesn't stamp out fires before they begin, I'm not sure how that would work, but stamps out campfires before they become wildfires:
http://www.smokeybear.com/vault/history.asp
> I'm content to just stay away.
Whatever you decide. But you're welcome to return as long as you're civil.
> It's been two solid years now without depression--after twenty-two years of being sick.
Congratulations, that's great!
Bob
Posted by BekkaH on August 9, 2003, at 1:26:42
In reply to Re: I QUIT!, posted by Dr. Bob on August 9, 2003, at 0:55:52
>Zo said: It's been two solid years now without >depression--after twenty-two years of being sick.
>
***********************************************Dr. Bob, I would like to know how Zo has managed to remain depression-free for two years, but since you blocked her for 16 weeks, I have no way to communicate with her. I'm sure Zo will do just fine, with or without PB; however, your blocking her is OUR loss.
Posted by Larry Hoover on August 9, 2003, at 7:36:19
In reply to Re: please rephrase that » Larry Hoover, posted by Dr. Bob on August 7, 2003, at 20:49:04
> > I was hoping to have a discussion, but there hasn't been one yet. All I've heard in reply from you is anger
I feel your anger. I hope you add to the discussion.
> > it doesn't matter what benefit you bring to the group...
Although I was using the "generic" you, the non-specific meaning with the same meaning as "one", it can easily be seen to be a reference to an individual. Therefore, to retain the same meaning as I intended....
...it doesn't matter what benefit one brings to the group...
> It's perfectly understandable that people will sometimes have strong reactions here, but still the idea is not to post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down. Keeping that in mind, could you please rephrase the above? Thanks,
>
> BobThank you, Dr. Bob, for helping me to improve my syntax.
Lar
Posted by Dr. Bob on August 10, 2003, at 10:41:22
In reply to Re: please rephrase that » Dr. Bob, posted by Larry Hoover on August 9, 2003, at 7:36:19
This is the end of the thread.
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