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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Hugh on June 21, 2020, at 15:46:31
Researchers of the national Turku PET Centre have shown that the opioid system in the brain is connected to mood changes associated with depression and anxiety.
Depression and anxiety are typically associated with lowered mood and decreased experience of pleasure. Opioids regulate the feelings of pain and pleasure in the brain. The new study conducted in Turku shows that the symptoms associated with depression and anxiety are connected to changes in the brain's opioid system already in healthy individuals.
"We found that the more depressive and anxious symptoms the subjects had, the less opioid receptors there were in their brain. These receptors function like small 'docks' that are influenced by both the brain's own opioids as well as opiates. These type of opioid-mediated mood changes can be an important mechanism in the central nervous system," says Professor Lauri Nummenmaa from the University of Turku.
"These results show that the mood changes indicating depression can be detected in the brain already early on. Both the brain's own opioids and synthetic opiate-based drugs regulate mood. Based on the results, drugs that have an effect on the opioid system can help in the treatment of depression," adds Nummenmaa.
The study was conducted with Positron Emission Tomography (PET) and altogether 135 volunteers participated as subjects. A small dose of radioactive tracer binding to the brain's opioid receptors was injected in their circulation. The decay of the tracers was measured with a PET camera, whereas the depressive and anxious symptoms of the subjects were measured with questionnaires.
The study is based on the AIVO database hosted by Turku University Hospital and Turku PET Centre. The database contains different in vivo molecular brain scans for extensive analyses.
Posted by sigismund on June 22, 2020, at 0:35:14
In reply to Brain's Opioid System Linked to Depression/Anxiety, posted by Hugh on June 21, 2020, at 15:46:31
Yes
Posted by Lamdage22 on June 22, 2020, at 0:38:58
In reply to Re: Brain's Opioid System Linked to Depression/Anxiety, posted by sigismund on June 22, 2020, at 0:35:14
Yeah, opioid system, endocannabinoid system... But that doesn't seem to make drug companies develop stuff that works on these systems
Posted by Hugh on June 22, 2020, at 0:52:44
In reply to Brain's Opioid System Linked to Depression/Anxiety, posted by Hugh on June 21, 2020, at 15:46:31
Researchers at the Department of Infection and Immunity of the Luxembourg Institute of Health (LIH) have developed a novel molecule that binds to and blocks a previously unrecognized opioid receptor in the brain. The team's studies showed that using the molecule, LIH383, to block this atypical opioid receptor, which is known as ACKR3, increases the availability of opioid peptides produced in the central nervous system (CNS) to bind to classical opioid receptors, effectively increasing their natural painkilling and antidepressant properties. The research could point to the development of a novel class of drugs for treating pain, depression, and also brain cancer.
"As an ACKR3 modulator that interacts and 'interferes' with ACKR3, LIH383 therefore also holds promise for the treatment of metastatic cancers, leveraging on our remarkable discovery of the dual chemokine-opioid 'scavenging' activity of this receptor," stated Chevigné. "We expect LIH383 to act as a precursor for the development of a new class of drugs against pain and depression, thus offering an innovative and original therapeutic strategy to tackle the opioid crisis."
"This is a glaring example of the way fundamental research can be translated into concrete applications with tangible benefits for patients, leading to improved clinical outcomes," commented Markus Ollert, PhD, director of the LIH Department of Infection and Immunity and co-author of the study. A patent application covering the team's developments was filed in April 2020.
Complete article:
Posted by sigismund on June 22, 2020, at 15:33:36
In reply to Re: Brain's Opioid System Linked to Depression/Anxiety, posted by Hugh on June 22, 2020, at 0:52:44
Goodness. Now you're talking.
Posted by PeterMartin on June 22, 2020, at 20:02:32
In reply to Re: Brain's Opioid System Linked to Depression/Anxiety, posted by Lamdage22 on June 22, 2020, at 0:38:58
What about Suboxone for depression? It's funny but I'd actually searched that earlier today after seeing someone mention it on another forum.
Id think the major risk w touch opioid receptors is addiction. Is Suboxone addictive? Anyone try it for depression?
Posted by undopaminergic on June 23, 2020, at 5:25:59
In reply to Re: Brain's Opioid System Linked to Depression/Anxiety, posted by PeterMartin on June 22, 2020, at 20:02:32
> What about Suboxone for depression? It's funny but I'd actually searched that earlier today after seeing someone mention it on another forum.
>
> Id think the major risk w touch opioid receptors is addiction. Is Suboxone addictive? Anyone try it for depression?
>Buprenorphine is also available as Subutex, Temgesic, and Buprenex.
There are some old threads about it here. One of them, from 2008, featuring my own experience with the drug, can be found here:
https://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20080519/msgs/831072.htmlI tried it for depression, in combination with methylphenidate (Concerta), but it turned out to be more useful as a nootropic for ADD, or more particularly, working memory dysfunction.
It can be addictive, but I (was forced to) quit cold-turkey, and there was no withdrawal syndrome.
-undopaminergic
Posted by Hugh on June 23, 2020, at 13:13:30
In reply to Re: Brain's Opioid System Linked to Depression/Anxiety, posted by PeterMartin on June 22, 2020, at 20:02:32
Extremely low doses of the opioid buprenorphine (Subutex) significantly decreased depression symptoms in people suffering from treatment-resistant depression. Their average daily dose was 0.4 mg.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6121503/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4157317/
Thread discussing this topic:
Posted by undopaminergic on June 23, 2020, at 16:04:49
In reply to Re: Brain's Opioid System Linked to Depression/Anxiety, posted by Hugh on June 23, 2020, at 13:13:30
> Extremely low doses of the opioid buprenorphine (Subutex) significantly decreased depression symptoms in people suffering from treatment-resistant depression. Their average daily dose was 0.4 mg.
>0.4 is not "extremely" low. In fact, Temgesic is available only as 0.2 and 0.4 mg sublingual tablets.
-undopaminergic
Posted by rjlockhart37 on June 24, 2020, at 0:09:21
In reply to Brain's Opioid System Linked to Depression/Anxiety, posted by Hugh on June 21, 2020, at 15:46:31
they use buprenorphine sometimes for offlabel for depression, its a partial agonst of opiod receptors. Opiate receptrs when low, cause pain and depression. Then when you take a opiate, it seems to restore the imbalalance, or unstimulated receptors. I read somewhere methadone was used for depression, in cases where nothing was working. And methadone is a full agonist of opiate sites, and is more addicting. Alot of heroin and heavy opiate users, have to take methadone. And that also depends on the doctor's regulations and their treatment. Some will explore more options than just the classified treatment. Opiates are antidepressants, no kidding. You feel alot better when you take them.
Posted by Hugh on June 24, 2020, at 0:46:54
In reply to Re: Brain's Opioid System Linked to Depression/Anxiety, posted by undopaminergic on June 23, 2020, at 16:04:49
> 0.4 is not "extremely" low. In fact, Temgesic is available only as 0.2 and 0.4 mg sublingual tablets.
What dose did you take? I've read that some people go as high as 3.2 mg. But, with some people, Temgesic can be an effective analgesic at 0.1 mg. It would be interesting to see if doses that low, and even lower, have an antidepressant effect.
Posted by undopaminergic on June 24, 2020, at 5:35:47
In reply to Re: Brain's Opioid System Linked to Depression/Anxiety » undopaminergic, posted by Hugh on June 24, 2020, at 0:46:54
> > 0.4 is not "extremely" low. In fact, Temgesic is available only as 0.2 and 0.4 mg sublingual tablets.
>
> What dose did you take?Up to 1.5 mg if I recall correctly.
> I've read that some people go as high as 3.2 mg.
For opioid substitution therapy, I think the dose can be up to 8 or 16 mg.
> But, with some people, Temgesic can be an effective analgesic at 0.1 mg. It would be interesting to see if doses that low, and even lower, have an antidepressant effect.
>I found it to be useless for pain.
-undopaminergic
Posted by Hugh on June 24, 2020, at 12:58:13
In reply to Brain's Opioid System Linked to Depression/Anxiety, posted by Hugh on June 21, 2020, at 15:46:31
Taking a low dose of naltrexone daily helps to boost the amount of natural opiates your brain produces. I've taken low-dose naltrexone (LDN) for years, and I've tried many different doses -- all the way up to what is considered to be LDN's maximum dose of 4.5 mg. And I've experimented with ultra-low-dose naltrexone (ULDN), taking doses in the micrograms, nanograms, and picograms.
Naltrexone is water-soluble, so I dissolve a 50-mg tablet in 50 ml of distilled water and keep it in the refrigerator. I use a medicine dropper to measure the dose. Most people take LDN at bedtime.
Of all the many different doses of naltrexone I've tried, the ones that have had the most positive effect on my mood were 125 mcg and 250 mcg. But every brain is different.
This thread discusses LDN and ULDN:
https://www.dr-bob.org/babble/alter/20180212/msgs/1103507.html
Posted by rjlockhart37 on June 30, 2020, at 1:47:17
In reply to Re: Brain's Opioid System Linked to Depression/Anxiety, posted by Hugh on June 24, 2020, at 12:58:13
buprenorphine is used by some doctors with treatment resistant depression, they use it off-label, and not as classified treatment. It defiantly depends on the doctor, to explore more options. Some just stay with classified antidepressants Naltrexone say it low does, with antidepressants, one including bupropion are effective
Posted by rjlockhart37 on July 1, 2020, at 0:20:11
In reply to Re: Brain's Opioid System Linked to Depression/Anxiety, posted by rjlockhart37 on June 30, 2020, at 1:47:17
i've taken hydrocodone for pain, yes it is pleasant, but then when you stop it, you lose that opiate feeling. It's a content feeling, like the opiate pain reliever system, it relives psychial and emotional pain. Emotional trauma, and PTSD defintly would benefit from them, but that is totally not a treatment, there would be a surplus of addiction cases.
methadone, It's not a opiate, like oxycodone. It's diffrent, it doenst give that high opiate feeling, but it still is a full agonist of opiate receptors. Herion users on the street, have to go to methdadone clinicss to replace it. They each show up every morning to the clinic to take their methadone. But methadone itself is addicting, its just a replacement for heavier opiates. It's usaslly a replacement for very hard core, heron users. I've thought about taking it, just see how it work, but that would cause addiction everyday.
This is the end of the thread.
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