![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 12 to 36 of 36. Go back in thread:
Posted by SLS on April 27, 2013, at 9:36:57
In reply to Lou's response-trazsaphrisnvega, posted by Lou Pilder on April 27, 2013, at 9:08:29
> Be not deceived. Look at the interactions between Trazodone, Saphris and Invega. These can interact to cause death via heart failure.
For my edification, can you provide evidence for cause and effect? Thanks.
eHealthMe likes to present numbers without providing guidance for how to interpret them.
Worse - eHealthMe includes in their statistics reports that do NOT come from the FDA. As you can see from the quote taken from the webpage you cited, the vast majority of the reports they use in their statistics come from unspecified studies.
"This is a real world study of Death among people who take Zyprexa. It is created by eHealthMe based on 1,462 reports from FDA. In total 41,631 Zyprexa users are studied."
Be not deceived.
- Scott
Posted by vbs on April 27, 2013, at 10:53:38
In reply to Re: Invega Sustenna and 4 other meds » vbs, posted by SLS on April 27, 2013, at 7:46:31
I spoke with my pharmacist about any interactions b/w my meds. She said there are no major interactions. :-)
Voices are still lingering. They're almost gone. It's much better now than before.
Yeah I'd like to just stop the Zyprexa but I'm afraid of rebound symptoms.
Posted by vbs on April 27, 2013, at 11:06:49
In reply to Lou's response-trazsaphrisnvega, posted by Lou Pilder on April 27, 2013, at 9:08:29
I don't trust ehealthme. I trust my pharmacist. She said there are NO major interactions. I don't recall reading anything about heart failure at drugs.com. And I don't think my pdoc would prescribe these meds if he thought the combo was unsafe.
Posted by SLS on April 27, 2013, at 12:33:12
In reply to Re: Invega Sustenna and 4 other meds » SLS, posted by vbs on April 27, 2013, at 4:58:23
> Apparently it takes time for Invega Sustenna to work. I've only been on it for nine days.
I just wanted to add that antipsychotics take longer to work in schizoid disorders than they do in bipolar disorder mania. It often takes six weeks for them to take full effect in schizophrenia whereas mania can be controlled within hours to a few days. That the voices you hear are substantially muted after only nine days is encouraging.
I hope your improvement continues.
- Scott
Posted by vbs on April 27, 2013, at 12:58:55
In reply to Re: Invega Sustenna and 4 other meds » vbs, posted by SLS on April 27, 2013, at 12:33:12
Yeah the voices are muted. That's a good way to phrase it. Thanks for the encouraging words.
I checked for drug interactions with another pharmacist. She said I was okay except watch for abnormal heart rhythm b/w Saphris & Invega Sustenna. That makes me feel better knowing that two pharmacists said I was okay, no serious interactions.
Posted by SLS on April 27, 2013, at 13:33:13
In reply to Re: Invega Sustenna and 4 other meds » SLS, posted by vbs on April 27, 2013, at 12:58:55
> Yeah the voices are muted. That's a good way to phrase it. Thanks for the encouraging words.
>
> I checked for drug interactions with another pharmacist. She said I was okay except watch for abnormal heart rhythm b/w Saphris & Invega Sustenna. That makes me feel better knowing that two pharmacists said I was okay, no serious interactions.A simple ECG will show you if these drugs are producing a prolongation of the QT interval, a type of arrhythmia. Generally, there is very little concern unless a cardiac conduction anomaly already exists. I have never seen anything in the literature that describes heart-failure as a possible adverse effect of antipsychotics.
- Scott
Posted by Lou Pilder on April 27, 2013, at 16:49:02
In reply to Re: Lou's response-trazsaphrisnvega » Lou Pilder, posted by vbs on April 27, 2013, at 11:06:49
> I don't trust ehealthme. I trust my pharmacist. She said there are NO major interactions. I don't recall reading anything about heart failure at drugs.com. And I don't think my pdoc would prescribe these meds if he thought the combo was unsafe.
vbs and friends,
the heart complications when taking Cymbalta are listed in the following article. One is sudden death.
Lou
http://www.livestrong.com/article/74136-cymbalta-cardiac-complications
Posted by Lou Pilder on April 27, 2013, at 17:30:12
In reply to Lou's response-trazsaphrisnvega, posted by Lou Pilder on April 27, 2013, at 9:08:29
> > > > Hi VBS did you ask your pharmacist if any interractions with the combo? Phillipa
> > >
> > > No. I'll call my pharmacist tomorrow. I did check for interactions at drugs.com though. Nothing significant except for *possible* interactions b/w trazodone and Cymbalta and b/w the 3 atypical antipsychotics. I don't know I just don't feel good. Sucks! The voices seem to be fading away though. So that much is positive.
> >
> > Friends,
> > The poster writes that they checked "Drus.com" and found nothing significant in the interactions of the drugs listed except a possible interaction between Cymbalta and trazodone and the 3 atypical antipsychotics.
> > Be not deceived n thinking that the interactions can not be significant. It is plainly visible in the list on drugs .com that death is a possibility via serotonin syndrome and that there are cns depressants combined that could cause death among all the other adverse consequences that could happen to those that take these drugs in combination.
> > Here is the link to what the poster wrote that they saw.
> > Lou
> > http://www.drugs.com/interactions-check.php?drug_list=2228-0,949-2273,1781-2498,1781-13969,3168-13988,1744-1113
>
> Friends,
> Be not deceived. Look at the interactions between Trazodone, Saphris and Invega. These can interact to cause death via heart failure. You see, when these type of drugs are taken in combination, the effects are multiplied.
> Let us look at them taken by themselves
> Lou
> http://www.ehealthme.com/ds/trazodone/death
> http://www.ehealhtme.com/ds/saphris/death
> http://www.ehealthme.com/ds/invega/death
> http://www.ehealthme.com/ds/cymbalta/death
> http://www.ehealthme.com/ds/zyprexa/deathFriends,
It is written here in another post that the poster did not see anything about heart complications/death in the drugs.com interactions of the 5 drugs in question here.
Now the link here by me in this post shows the interactions of the 5 drugs. Notice that with Trazodon, Saphris/Invega that there is the listing of
A. Irregular heart rhythm
B. prolongation of the QT interval
C. Sudden death from the combination of Invega and Saphris
But it is much more than that. You see, when all 5 drugs are combined, there becomes a dramatic increase of the potential of death. There are deaths from taking a pain pill and then a glass of wine. If you took just the pain pill(opiate} or just the wine, that would not be the same as taking them together.
I am not anti-drug or anti-psychiatry. I am anti-death. And the prohibitions to me here prevent me from responding to the (redacted by respondent)here.
I am requesting that those interested in this thread go to the admin board here and look at the last thread there in relation to what's being allowed to stand here about me, and the tactics being used. If you could, then I think that you could have your eyes opened to how hate is promulgated here that psychologists say could keep readers from overcoming depression and addiction. And then they could become prisoners of the drugs and kill themselves and or others, and even commit mass-murder. My friends, it is your choice as to whom you want to believe. It has been revealed to me that thousands of years ago the scriptures that the Jews use told of these days and The Great Deception. I am prevented from telling you about that here due to the prohibitions to me here by Mr Hsiung.
Lou
Posted by vbs on April 27, 2013, at 17:35:53
In reply to Lou's response-mighfarmasystsez » vbs, posted by Lou Pilder on April 27, 2013, at 16:49:02
Hi Lou, I wasn't aware of Cymbalta causing possible heart complications. Thanks for bringing that to my attention. As they say, knowledge is power.
Posted by vbs on April 27, 2013, at 17:59:28
In reply to Lou's urgent warning-combination of drugs/death, posted by Lou Pilder on April 27, 2013, at 17:30:12
Lou, I know you're trying to help. I am aware of the potential for serious interactions like those that you mentioned. I trust that my treatment team (pharmacist included) knows what they're doing. I have a serious mental illness, schizoaffective disorder w/ major depression. I'm not hearing voices right now and I don't feel depressed. Is the medicine working? In my case, the benefits outweigh the risks. I don't particularly like hearing voices and feeling depressed. I feel good at this moment.
Posted by SLS on April 27, 2013, at 19:18:45
In reply to Re: Lou's response-mighfarmasystsez » Lou Pilder, posted by vbs on April 27, 2013, at 17:35:53
> Hi Lou, I wasn't aware of Cymbalta causing possible heart complications.
What complications are you concerned about?
> Thanks for bringing that to my attention. As they say, knowledge is power.
What sources of information are you relying upon?
- Scott
Posted by Phillipa on April 27, 2013, at 20:33:45
In reply to Re: Lou's urgent warning-combination of drugs/deat » Lou Pilder, posted by vbs on April 27, 2013, at 17:59:28
VBS sorry to take so long to reply. Glad you checked with two pharmacists. I find them a wealth of information. Also have found they will research the meds in question. Isn't there a medical professional in your family also? If so I"m sure they would caution you if they felt there was a problem. Glad the voices are fading. Phillipa
Posted by vbs on April 28, 2013, at 6:36:44
In reply to Re: Invega Sustenna and 4 other meds » vbs, posted by SLS on April 27, 2013, at 19:18:45
SLS, I don't know how reliable the information is but Lou referenced an article on the web: http://www.livestrong.com/article/74136-cymbalta-cardiac-complications
The article says that Cymbalta can cause tachycardia, arrhythmia, and palpitations. Is this not true?
Personally, I'm not particularly concerned about any possible heart complication. I haven't experienced any.
Posted by vbs on April 28, 2013, at 6:47:59
In reply to Re: Lou's urgent warning-combination of drugs/deat » vbs, posted by Phillipa on April 27, 2013, at 20:33:45
Hi Phillipa, yes, there is a medical professional in my family. My father is a doctor and my brother is a dentist. And I haven't asked them about drug interactions. I don't want to worry them.
Yeah the voices are nearly gone. I'm not hearing any right now. They fade in & out. :-)
Posted by SLS on April 28, 2013, at 8:53:05
In reply to Re: Invega Sustenna and 4 other meds » SLS, posted by vbs on April 28, 2013, at 6:36:44
I'm glad that you have medical professionals in the family and a good pharmacist. They can help guide you when interpretating the statistics presented in the medical literature.
The only cardiovascular side effect mentioned in the package label is palpitations. Palpitations are not necessarily an indication of a change in cardiac function. It can represent a shift in autonomic function towards a "fight or flight" state which occurs as the result of increased sympathetic tone and/or decreased parasympathetic tone. I'm sure you know that heart palpitations can actually be a symptom of depression. I don't know the physiology behind it, but again, it is not representative of cardiac malfunction.
In post-marketing reporting, cardiac arrhythmia has been reported. I have no reason to doubt that this has happened. However, the literature presents a caveat as to how such reports must interpreted:
"Postmarketing Spontaneous Reports
The following adverse reactions have been identified during postapproval use of Cymbalta. Because these reactions are reported voluntarily from a population of uncertain size, it is not always possible to reliably estimate their frequency or establish a causal relationship to drug exposure."
Regarding drug interactions, any drug that inhibits the CYP2D6 enzyme can increase blood levels of Cymbalta. This would include Prozac and Paxil. In a similar fashion, Cymbalta can raise the blood levels of other drugs like tricyclics and phenothiazines. You are not taking any of these drugs. Still, it is good to check as thoroughly as you can the safety of your treatment. You are obviously doing this.
- Scott
Posted by Lou Pilder on April 28, 2013, at 11:00:39
In reply to Re: Lou's urgent warning-combination of drugs/deat » Lou Pilder, posted by vbs on April 27, 2013, at 17:59:28
> Lou, I know you're trying to help. I am aware of the potential for serious interactions like those that you mentioned. I trust that my treatment team (pharmacist included) knows what they're doing. I have a serious mental illness, schizoaffective disorder w/ major depression. I'm not hearing voices right now and I don't feel depressed. Is the medicine working? In my case, the benefits outweigh the risks. I don't particularly like hearing voices and feeling depressed. I feel good at this moment.
vbs and friends,
The poster writes that they know that I am trying to help. I am trying to save lives by warning you of the potential of death from this drug in question. There are those that will accept death to have a moment of feeling good. I am trying to reach those other than those of that mind-set. There are more warnings to Cymbalta than death by cardiac arrest. The drug can induce thoughts to compel you to kill yourself.
The chemical mechanism of the drug I am prevented from posting in depth here due to the prohibitions to me by Mr Hsiung. The drug has the chemical core of mothballs. Now mothballs emit a vapor that kills insects and worms and such. The chemical is also used in chemical dyes. Now mothballs made of the chemical (naphthalene) are illegal in China, for children can eat them and have horrible consequences.
Now Cymbalta has the fused benzene rings, which is naphthalene, and I started a thread where I was stopped by Mr Hsiung which could have educated members here concerning the use of Benzene in relation to mass-murder. The chemical manipulation of naphthalene with other compounds does not change the naphthalene to apple butter.
Here is a link to the numbers relating to people thinking about killing themselves when they take Cymbalta. Notice the huge, statistically that is, number that have that thinking.
Lou
http://www.ehealthme.com/ds/cymbalta/suicidal+thoughts
Posted by vbs on April 28, 2013, at 12:25:15
In reply to Lou's urgent warning-suicidal thought » vbs, posted by Lou Pilder on April 28, 2013, at 11:00:39
Anti-depressant drugs can prevent and decrease suicidal thoughts. Strangely, it is well known that anti-depressant drugs may actually cause suicidal thinking, especially in young people. I've never had suicidal thoughts. Cymbalta chemically related to mothballs? Is that what you're saying? Where did you get this information from? Cymbalta is not poisonous. It's safe, IMO, when taken as directed. We are way off topic from my original post. I was concerned about drug-drug interactions. And two pharmacists said I was okay, nothing to worry about. Start a new thread if you wish to talk about Cymbalta.
Posted by SLS on April 28, 2013, at 13:22:28
In reply to Invega Sustenna and 4 other meds, posted by vbs on April 26, 2013, at 20:02:58
> I am wondering if I'm on one too many meds. I was given my first injection of Invega Sustenna last Thurs and 2nd dose yesterday. I also take the following:
>
> Zyprexa 20 mg
> Saphris 10 mg
> Cymbalta 60 mg
> trazodone 50 mg
>
> And I'm still hearing voices! What's up w/ that? Any input / feedback on my drug cocktail would be appreciated.I would just add that there is a small possibility that Cymbalta would interact with trazodone to produce serotonin syndrome (serotonin toxicity). This can occur whenever two or more drugs act synergistically to increase serotonin activity. Theoretically, the combining of two drugs like Cymbalta and trazodone can do this, as they are both serotonin reuptake inhibitors. Personally, I would not be too concerned, though. However, I thought I would be remiss had I not mentioned the potential interaction.
I'm glad that you continue to feel better.
- Scott
Posted by Phillipa on April 28, 2013, at 20:04:32
In reply to Re: Lou's urgent warning-combination of drugs/deat » Phillipa, posted by vbs on April 28, 2013, at 6:47:59
So Dad still practicing? I hope you have a good relationship with him. Might want to run it by him. I'm sure he care. Phillipa
Posted by vbs on April 29, 2013, at 11:47:41
In reply to Re: Lou's urgent warning-combination of drugs/deat » vbs, posted by Phillipa on April 28, 2013, at 20:04:32
He still practices medicine. And our relationship is good. My father is actually my representative payee for my Social Security Disability. I hit him up for $ about every two weeks.
Posted by vbs on April 29, 2013, at 11:56:13
In reply to Re: Invega Sustenna and 4 other meds » vbs, posted by SLS on April 28, 2013, at 13:22:28
Scott, I'm aware of serotonin syndrome. In general, I'm feeling a lot better. Practically no voices. The Invega Sustenna is helping. I'm happy about that...
Posted by SLS on April 29, 2013, at 13:03:22
In reply to Re: Invega Sustenna and 4 other meds, posted by vbs on April 29, 2013, at 11:56:13
> In general, I'm feeling a lot better. Practically no voices. The Invega Sustenna is helping. I'm happy about that...
I'm sure this news is putting a smile on quite a few faces.
:-)
- Scott
Posted by Phillipa on April 29, 2013, at 20:39:03
In reply to Re: Lou's urgent warning-combination of drugs/deat » Phillipa, posted by vbs on April 29, 2013, at 11:47:41
VBS glad to hear your Dad is well & congrats on your med working. Phillipa
Posted by SLS on April 29, 2013, at 20:42:27
In reply to Re: Lou's urgent warning-combination of drugs/deat » vbs, posted by Phillipa on April 29, 2013, at 20:39:03
> VBS glad to hear your Dad is well & congrats on your med working. Phillipa
Posted by vbs on April 30, 2013, at 12:18:44
In reply to Re: Invega Sustenna and 4 other meds » Phillipa, posted by SLS on April 29, 2013, at 20:42:27
This is the end of the thread.
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