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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 12 of 12. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by uncouth on August 3, 2011, at 11:39:05
Hi folks,
I am doing yet another med switch and i'm expecting some mood instability on the downside. I live in the US and tianeptine isn't used here much but I have a big supply of it and in the past my doctor was relatively OK with us trying it.I wanted to compile the latest thinking you guys have on whether tianeptine is an effective antidepressant in your experience. Especially if you've found it helpful for certain subtypes of depression, e.g. chronic depression, bipolar depression, anhedonia, etc. I hear that it has a low incidence of side effects. For me SSRIs and SNRIs have always felt a bit numbing and i'm not sure how good they have been for me in the long term. They certainly haven't done anything to measurably improve my life and if anything, may make me complacent when I really need to be making changes.
I have been reducing my dose of bupropion from 800mg to 600mg which i've been at for 7 days, and two weeks ago removed 30mg of cymbalta I had been taking. But what I'm really worried about is decreasing Saphris from 10mg to 5mg with the eventual intention of getting off of it completely. SO far the change has been negatively affecting my sleep but i'm wondering how the decrease in dose will affect my thinking. I haven't been totally off of an antipsychotic for an extended period of time in I think years. I'm hoping it will remove the feeling of being numbed to the world but i'm afraid of the depression getting really bad. I tried getting off of saphris completely 2 months ago and only lasted a week before I had to go back on because of sleep and mood issues.
Thanks, let me hear about your tianeptine experiences and if you have any comments on saphris or what it was like to go down on antipsychotics that would be good too.
Uncouth
Posted by Phillipa on August 3, 2011, at 13:42:20
In reply to Does Tianeptine actually work? +Decreasing Saphris, posted by uncouth on August 3, 2011, at 11:39:05
Uncouth mind if I follow so much negative on meds lately would love to hear some good stuff. Phillipa
Posted by orbital on August 3, 2011, at 16:29:05
In reply to Does Tianeptine actually work? +Decreasing Saphris, posted by uncouth on August 3, 2011, at 11:39:05
I was on tianeptine for 6 months. Short answer is "yes it works", at least ime, but you need to be very patient and med compliant.
Let me know if you want a very detailed answer, I'd be glad to share my experience.
I've little experience with APs so can't help there.
Orbital.
> Hi folks,
> I am doing yet another med switch and i'm expecting some mood instability on the downside. I live in the US and tianeptine isn't used here much but I have a big supply of it and in the past my doctor was relatively OK with us trying it.
>
> I wanted to compile the latest thinking you guys have on whether tianeptine is an effective antidepressant in your experience. Especially if you've found it helpful for certain subtypes of depression, e.g. chronic depression, bipolar depression, anhedonia, etc. I hear that it has a low incidence of side effects. For me SSRIs and SNRIs have always felt a bit numbing and i'm not sure how good they have been for me in the long term. They certainly haven't done anything to measurably improve my life and if anything, may make me complacent when I really need to be making changes.
>
> I have been reducing my dose of bupropion from 800mg to 600mg which i've been at for 7 days, and two weeks ago removed 30mg of cymbalta I had been taking. But what I'm really worried about is decreasing Saphris from 10mg to 5mg with the eventual intention of getting off of it completely. SO far the change has been negatively affecting my sleep but i'm wondering how the decrease in dose will affect my thinking. I haven't been totally off of an antipsychotic for an extended period of time in I think years. I'm hoping it will remove the feeling of being numbed to the world but i'm afraid of the depression getting really bad. I tried getting off of saphris completely 2 months ago and only lasted a week before I had to go back on because of sleep and mood issues.
>
> Thanks, let me hear about your tianeptine experiences and if you have any comments on saphris or what it was like to go down on antipsychotics that would be good too.
> Uncouth
Posted by uncouth on August 3, 2011, at 19:13:21
In reply to Re: Does Tianeptine actually work? +Decreasing Sap » uncouth, posted by orbital on August 3, 2011, at 16:29:05
Please! Be as detailed as you care to be, especially with its differential response vs. other meds you may have tried and how it felt subjectively. Are you still on it? What is your diagnosis?
thanks orbital
uncouth
Posted by bleauberry on August 4, 2011, at 20:07:20
In reply to Does Tianeptine actually work? +Decreasing Saphris, posted by uncouth on August 3, 2011, at 11:39:05
It didn't work for me.
Actually it started out great. The first day felt clearly dopaminergic, and I felt improvement fast. The second day not as much, but definitely some good antianxiety was happening. Third day very calm but kind of withdrawn. Fourth day, oh man, deep deep dark depression. It didn't lift until about 2 days after I stopped taking it. After just being on it I think a total of 6 days, it came with a real nasty heavy withdrawal when I tried to stop.
I later tried different dosing....smaller, larger, more frequent, less frequent, whatever....and it was just bad for me no matter what I did.
It does look good in the clinical studies. I guess I just haven't yet seen it work like that with anyone I know.
Overall I think it is a good substance simply based on the known mechanisms we are aware of. It is cheap enough and easy to get. All those clinical studies couldn't have been lies, so for anyone who isn't afraid of trying it, it might not be a bad choice. It certainly offers a whole different approach than the crowd of reuptake inhibitors.
Posted by sigismund on August 4, 2011, at 21:16:25
In reply to Re: Does Tianeptine actually work? +Decreasing Saphris, posted by bleauberry on August 4, 2011, at 20:07:20
It made me feel better and got me out of the house.
I took it for a couple of years.
I knew straight away I would be OK with it.
There can be some anxiety, but not always.
Posted by orbital on August 5, 2011, at 11:34:38
In reply to Re: Does Tianeptine actually work? +Decreasing Sap » orbital, posted by uncouth on August 3, 2011, at 19:13:21
Okay, I'll be long winded and go into detail.
I remember how it felt very clearly, as it was my very first real AD long-term experience, after a horrendous aborted Prozac trial (sheer panic after a week, I know Phillipa can relate to this).
Anyway, Stablon.
I took it for 10 months, 12,5mg TID. 6 years ago. For moderate depression, GAD/social phobia. I was also on Xanax 1mg/day at the time and Klonopin 4mg.
Stablong certainly was not free of side effects, don't believe the hype... ime of course. I had some GI upset, so had to take pills with food. VERY strong headaches. Insomnia, pretty bad at first, which called for a short course of .. I want to say Vistaril, maybe Phenergan (definitely a prescription-strength antihistamine). For a while (and this is important) there was also this very marked feeling that I cannot put into words.. I felt weird and everything seemed a bit surreal and dream-like. It was like constant dejavu. Not unpleasant at all, just strange, it came in waves and it only lasted a few minutes.
All of the side effects disappeared after 2 weeks, then nothing... as in nothing at all. My doc asked for patience.It's strange that we doubt our meds if we're not experiencing side effects!
Around the second month, I suddenly realized that I felt quite normal. Not well, just normal. The depression was mostly gone, no more anxiety attacks or SP. I felt "restored", that's the proper word. I also realized that I'd spontaneously quit drinking alcohol sometime during those months and have remained abstinent ever since (I later learnt that tianeptine has an excellent track record treating alcoholics -not my case, I used to binge drink on occasion). The one time I drank on Tianeptine I was very ill.
I quit the Xanax (1 mg/day) cold turkey and had no withdrawal. Was able to lower Klonopin to 1mg quite quickly. As an anxyiolitic, tianeptine is pretty amazing once it has kicked in. I would call it "the silent worker". It works in the background, it's not an inyouface med. Still, it's very powerful.
Around maybe the..4th.. month, I was feeling good. Not manic, just an overall sense of wellness. At this poin, how much of this was due to the tianeptine is debatable, as I'd started getting a life after my first depressive episode - work, school, friends, dating etc confidence. I remember going on a (short) trans-oceanic vacation, something which I've not been able to do again since.
Then the problems started. Bouts of insomnia. Dose was increased to 12.5mg QID,which made insomnia worse. Reduced to 12.5 mg BID, no change. Then that feeling I described earlier -the dream-like sensation- began again, and I started feeling weirded out and uncomfortable.It's so hard to describe. Doc said it was no longer worth it, I agreed and tapered off quite quickly with absolutely no withdrawals. I'd achieved remission and I was fine for about a year or so.
So... that's my experience: Stablon was a very strong anxiolytic. The one issue is "patience", if you're expecting a rush, I doubt you'll get it. It treated my (moderate) depression very effectively at the time. Compared to other meds, it's very solid I think, but not as aggressive. After writing all this, I feel like trying it again!
Hope this helps :) Orbital
> Please! Be as detailed as you care to be, especially with its differential response vs. other meds you may have tried and how it felt subjectively. Are you still on it? What is your diagnosis?
> thanks orbital
> uncouth
Posted by uncouth on August 5, 2011, at 11:48:38
In reply to Re: Does Tianeptine actually work? +Decreasing Sap » uncouth, posted by orbital on August 5, 2011, at 11:34:38
orbital, thanks so much for taking the time to write about your experience. i will see what my doctor says and report back on my experience if i take it.
uncouth
Posted by orbital on August 5, 2011, at 21:21:18
In reply to Re: Does Tianeptine actually work? +Decreasing Sap, posted by uncouth on August 5, 2011, at 11:48:38
Glad to help out. I hope you get to try it and that it works for you. Good luck :)
orbital> orbital, thanks so much for taking the time to write about your experience. i will see what my doctor says and report back on my experience if i take it.
> uncouth
Posted by Phillipa on August 5, 2011, at 21:27:15
In reply to Re: Does Tianeptine actually work? +Decreasing Sap » uncouth, posted by orbital on August 5, 2011, at 11:34:38
I do relate but really remissions were anxiety related for me with benzos. Phillipa
Posted by dragonblack on August 5, 2011, at 22:51:37
In reply to Does Tianeptine actually work? +Decreasing Saphris, posted by uncouth on August 3, 2011, at 11:39:05
Hey,
I took it for a short time back when I was misdiagnosed as MDD. I had no insurance at the time, was desperate, and I had become fixated on tianeptine due to Servier's push of the neuroplasticity angle (turns out this is pretty much how AD's work generally (for most), but they were ahead of the game and managed for market tianeptine specifically as a brain fixer). So, I got it on my own, and on day 3, I believe, switched from depressed to hypomanic (or manic...). I proceeded to rapid cycle after that, and needless to say, it didn't work for me, except that it gave me an opportunity to finally figure out that I'm Bipolar II, and get my Dx right! So, I owe it that.
The only side effect I really had from it was occasionally feeling a little tipsy after dosing, like I had had 2 or 3 beers on an empty stomach. It was never a really big deal, but I actually remember wondering whether I was good to drive once. That's it for me. Wish I could have trialed it with a mood stabilizer on board, it's way too expensive for Americans, though.
Posted by veggieseattle on August 17, 2011, at 17:33:55
In reply to Does Tianeptine actually work? +Decreasing Saphris, posted by uncouth on August 3, 2011, at 11:39:05
> Hey y'all. I'm *still* thinking of getting off Effexor and trying the Tianeptine. My doc is okay with it, but he's moving in a couple of weeks so I have no idea if my new one will be... Obviously there are logistical and financial issues with this...where to get it? Is it worth flying somewhere to get enough for a 6 month trial, blah blah? Or should I wait until Servier's new med comes out? Which is supposedly similar to Stablon? ORrrrr, will Medicare simply not cover that for years bc it's new? Thoughts? I'm treatment resistant, and have major depression, anxiety, lots and lots of panic attacks. So, the anti-anxiety profile of Tianeptine is promising. I'd love to hear from folks in the US - and if there are things you can't say on the board, could you private message me? I'm not sure what the rules are re: giving info. about online pharmacies, etc. (I'm on disability, so obviously the financial part is a big deal. I have a friend in Thailand tho, so I'm checking to see if it's available there) Thanks!!!
Hi folks,
> I am doing yet another med switch and i'm expecting some mood instability on the downside. I live in the US and tianeptine isn't used here much but I have a big supply of it and in the past my doctor was relatively OK with us trying it.
>
> I wanted to compile the latest thinking you guys have on whether tianeptine is an effective antidepressant in your experience. Especially if you've found it helpful for certain subtypes of depression, e.g. chronic depression, bipolar depression, anhedonia, etc. I hear that it has a low incidence of side effects. For me SSRIs and SNRIs have always felt a bit numbing and i'm not sure how good they have been for me in the long term. They certainly haven't done anything to measurably improve my life and if anything, may make me complacent when I really need to be making changes.
>
> I have been reducing my dose of bupropion from 800mg to 600mg which i've been at for 7 days, and two weeks ago removed 30mg of cymbalta I had been taking. But what I'm really worried about is decreasing Saphris from 10mg to 5mg with the eventual intention of getting off of it completely. SO far the change has been negatively affecting my sleep but i'm wondering how the decrease in dose will affect my thinking. I haven't been totally off of an antipsychotic for an extended period of time in I think years. I'm hoping it will remove the feeling of being numbed to the world but i'm afraid of the depression getting really bad. I tried getting off of saphris completely 2 months ago and only lasted a week before I had to go back on because of sleep and mood issues.
>
> Thanks, let me hear about your tianeptine experiences and if you have any comments on saphris or what it was like to go down on antipsychotics that would be good too.
> Uncouth
This is the end of the thread.
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