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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 26. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by cee on November 23, 2009, at 14:33:57
GOOD DAY
I was wondering if any one new how long it takes for lamotrigine to kick and at what does
god bless
cee
Posted by morganator on November 23, 2009, at 23:49:32
In reply to lamotrigine, posted by cee on November 23, 2009, at 14:33:57
Umm you may be looking at 5 to 8 months at 100 to 200 mgs. Are you taking it for bipolar depression/mood swings? The most common dose is 100 which takes 5 weeks to titrate up to I believe. Then you may have to wait another few weeks to see if 100 is working for you.
I didnt like lamictal too much. They say it's one of the cleanest or the cleanest mood stabilizer. I think this is a bunch of hogwash. But, some people love it and feel great on it so I think it is worth a shot.
It does deplete folic acid(so does depakote/valproic acid) so you want to consider supplementing extra folic acid while on it.
Also, it binds to or collects in the melanin in your eyes and skin and GSK admits to not knowing the long term effects of this.I say give it a shot if you are out of options and you are suffering that bad.
Posted by Phillipa on November 24, 2009, at 0:19:22
In reply to Re: lamotrigine, posted by morganator on November 23, 2009, at 23:49:32
I didn't know of the new side effects. I took it only to 50mg as ad booster. Phillipa
Posted by fattoush on November 24, 2009, at 4:22:59
In reply to Re: lamotrigine, posted by morganator on November 23, 2009, at 23:49:32
I wasn't aware of these serious side effects. It seems every time everyone is crcazy about a new drug, something serious is hidden.
Anyway, to answer your question cee, I noticed improvement in my mood as early as at 75 mgs, and I forget when you reach that dose. At 50, it had started giving me headaches, which kept getting worse. At 100 mgs, I felt I had a vise around my head all the time that nothing would relieve, but I am a migraineur. I would have stuck with it otherwise, I think.. unless something new popped up.
Posted by morganator on November 24, 2009, at 4:57:16
In reply to Re: lamotrigine » morganator, posted by Phillipa on November 24, 2009, at 0:19:22
These are not new side effects they are merely potential health risks that are not talked about.
Lamictal is a powerful medication which is probably why so many people feel so much better on it. Powerful medications that help so many often can have more serious side effects on many others. I have read of people experiencing MS type symptoms. I have also read of people having serious cognitive deficits. A few have even talked about experiencing hallucinatory effects.
I felt like I was walking in water at 150 mgs. At one point I felt almost muted, like I didn't want to speak. I also felt like I had trouble speaking at around 100 mgs. \
Lamictal is kinda like Cymbalta, very powerful with many success stories and many people experiencing crazy side effects. I don't trust either of these medications. But if they work for you and the benefits outweigh the risks, I say go for it.
Posted by morganator on November 24, 2009, at 4:57:45
In reply to Re: lamotrigine » morganator, posted by Phillipa on November 24, 2009, at 0:19:22
These are not new side effects they are merely potential health risks that are not talked about.
Lamictal is a powerful medication which is probably why so many people feel so much better on it. Powerful medications that help so many often can have more serious side effects on many others. I have read of people experiencing MS type symptoms. I have also read of people having serious cognitive deficits. A few have even talked about experiencing hallucinatory effects.
I felt like I was walking in water at 150 mgs. At one point I felt almost muted, like I didn't want to speak. I also felt like I had trouble speaking at around 100 mgs. \
Lamictal is kinda like Cymbalta, very powerful with many success stories and many people experiencing crazy side effects. I don't trust either of these medications. But if they work for you and the benefits outweigh the risks, I say go for it.
Posted by SLS on November 24, 2009, at 5:33:51
In reply to Re: lamotrigine, posted by morganator on November 23, 2009, at 23:49:32
> Umm you may be looking at 5 to 8 months at 100 to 200 mgs. Are you taking it for bipolar depression/mood swings? The most common dose is 100 which takes 5 weeks to titrate up to I believe. Then you may have to wait another few weeks to see if 100 is working for you.
It does happen that some people feel better briefly at 50mg, and then again upon dosage increases. It can be confusing. However, I do recommend continuing up to 100mg. If, by the end of the second week at 100mg, there is no improvement, I would continue to titrate upwards. 200mg seems to be the most common dosage arrived at for the treatment of affective disorders. Once 200mg is established, then the wait should not be longer than 4 weeks if it is the right dosage. It would be advisable to work with a doctor on this. By now, I imagine most have enough clinical experience with lamotrigine to know how it behaves.
- Scott
Posted by delna on November 24, 2009, at 10:52:19
In reply to lamotrigine, posted by cee on November 23, 2009, at 14:33:57
> GOOD DAY
>
> I was wondering if any one new how long it takes for lamotrigine to kick and at what does
>
> god bless
> ceehi,
Well for me it started working really fast- by 50mg. I was taking it for agitated depression associated with BP and mood-swings. It really did a good job on that. It didn't lift depression at all -only took care of the agitation bit. At 200mg it has worked well for many years (5-6 years)
Personally I like it alot. Its easy to tolerate compared to other drugs. For me it did come with cognitive side effects , like poor memory and being less' on the ball' but that was a small price to pay- in my particular case.
I especially like it because its good for women in that it does not mess with your hormones like say valproate.
Just my personal experience...
TC
D
Posted by delna on November 24, 2009, at 10:56:57
In reply to Re: lamotrigine, posted by morganator on November 24, 2009, at 4:57:16
>I have read of people experiencing MS type symptoms.What MS type side effects? I am very curious as who knows what is exacerbating my current condition. It could be lamotrigine, the very drug I trust the most and see as pretty benign (relatively speaking)
thanks for any input
TC
D
Posted by ColoradoSnowflake on November 24, 2009, at 14:44:47
In reply to Re: lamotrigine » morganator, posted by delna on November 24, 2009, at 10:56:57
Hi Delna:
When I tried Lamictal a couple of years ago it was terrible for me. Almost immediately it affected my whole body. Not like the Rheumatoid Arthritis I have, but more like what I think MS might feel like. I didn't have much control of my arms and legs or head had a very hard time walking or moving my arms. I was disoriented. I ached all over. I was really disappointed because I had heard good things about lamictal. I quit it and all that stuff went immediately away.
So, YES, I do think that is possible!
I also think Parnate is kicking in my R.A. I have felt it since the git-go but the Parnate was working so well I felt it was worth it. As the R.A. gets worse and worse I'm beginning to wonder.
Geeze, it's always something!
Hugs,
Gayle
Posted by morganator on November 24, 2009, at 15:14:15
In reply to Re: lamotrigine » morganator, posted by delna on November 24, 2009, at 10:56:57
I experienced leg weakness for the most part. I would be walking and my legs felt so wobbly my knees were practically giving out on me. Maybe this is not MS like but it was pretty miserable. I also had a mind numbing sensation much of the time. My hands also felt weak and I would often drop things. It's unfortunate because I did have moments, especially in the beginning, when I felt like Lamictal was really working well for me.
Posted by zana on November 24, 2009, at 15:53:19
In reply to Re: lamotrigine, posted by morganator on November 24, 2009, at 15:14:15
Hi Cee,
I am just coming off my third trail of lamictal. Without fail by the time I reach 75mgs I become terribly agitated. Really terrible. In the beginning it always seems to perk me up and the only side effect I notice is a slight headache. But it is not a good med for me. I agree with Scott about titrating up and giving a few weeks to see how you feel.
Good luck with it.
Zana
Posted by SLS on November 24, 2009, at 16:40:25
In reply to Re: lamotrigine, posted by ColoradoSnowflake on November 24, 2009, at 14:44:47
> I also think Parnate is kicking in my R.A. I have felt it since the git-go but the Parnate was working so well I felt it was worth it. As the R.A. gets worse and worse I'm beginning to wonder.
>
> Geeze, it's always something!
I'm really sorry to hear this.I have read that MAOIs can actually drive R.A. into remission. From your research, do any treatments worsen symptoms first and improve them later?
- Scott
--------------------------------------------Int J Immunopharmacol. 1983;5(4):353-7.
Remission of rheumatoid arthritis and other disorders of immunity in patients taking monoamine oxidase inhibitors.Lieb J.
Elevated levels of prostaglandin E2 (PGE2) play an important role in rheumatoid arthritis and other disorders of immunity. By inhibiting the release of arachidonic acid from cells, monoamine oxidase inhibitors (MAOI's) inhibit PGE2 synthesis. MAOI's appear to be capable of remitting the symptoms of rheumatoid arthritis and may have the potential to arrest it. MAOI's also appear to be effective in other disturbances of immunity in which excessive synthesis of PGE2 plays a role.
--------------------------------------------------
Abstract
IgA nephropathy (IgAN), characterized by renal mesangial deposits of antibodies (of the IgA subtype), is the most common glomerulonephritis worldwide. The cause of IgAN is not known. IgAN can often lead to end stage renal disease (ESRD), and there is no known treatment proven to prevent ESRD in IgAN. Long term use of steroids or other immunosuppressant drugs carry severe toxicities and other risks. IgAN patients have high serum levels of tumor necrosis factor-α (TNF). Increased monoamine levels, via increased cellular cyclic AMP, can decrease TNF elaboration. Monoamine oxidase inhibitors (MAO-Is) have been found effective in case studies for a number of diseases, e.g. rheumatoid arthritis and Crohns disease, characterized by high TNF levels. Here I suggest that MAO-Is might be of utility in IgAN by decreasing TNF levels.
--------------------------------------------
Posted by morganator on November 24, 2009, at 17:39:04
In reply to Re: lamotrigine, posted by zana on November 24, 2009, at 15:53:19
> Hi Cee,
> I am just coming off my third trail of lamictal. Without fail by the time I reach 75mgs I become terribly agitated. Really terrible. In the beginning it always seems to perk me up and the only side effect I notice is a slight headache. But it is not a good med for me. I agree with Scott about titrating up and giving a few weeks to see how you feel.
> Good luck with it.
> ZanaWhat about staying on 50 mgs and not titrating up anymore?
Posted by polarbear206 on November 24, 2009, at 18:07:40
In reply to Re: lamotrigine, posted by zana on November 24, 2009, at 15:53:19
Lamictal has been very positive for me and I've been on it almost ten years at 200mg. As with ANY drug, a small percentage of people experience adverse reactions.
Posted by Phillipa on November 24, 2009, at 20:13:18
In reply to Re: lamotrigine, posted by ColoradoSnowflake on November 24, 2009, at 14:44:47
Gayle I'm really sorry as my Mother had it and suffered so they didn' have the meds they do today. Are you on an IV treatment for it?. Love Phillipa
Posted by ColoradoSnowflake on November 24, 2009, at 22:28:03
In reply to Re: lamotrigine, posted by SLS on November 24, 2009, at 5:33:51
Scott:
Thank you for posting that! It makes me feel better. I haven't researched it myself, just experienced it. Actually, stress is the WORST for causing my exacerbations. Junk food a little bit. I have been really stressed with my little grandson. Maybe that is it. Now the (detestable) holidays.
I take Plaquinel twice a day for my R.A. It works well for me. When I cut down on it I get pain right away so I know it's working.
I absolutely refuse to take any steroids or pain pills. A friend of mine died a horrible death with R.A. that way. She took so many steriods and new "junk" for R.A. and so many pain pills. Every bone in her body was broken when she died and the pain couldn't be stopped unless she was knocked out and even then she moaned. The morphine is actually what she died from. But there was little choice. It devastated her husband and children.
I'll fast and swim every day for a while and it will get better. I'm better already reading what Scott posted!
Thanks, Scott!!!
Gayle xxoo
Posted by Phillipa on November 25, 2009, at 20:05:18
In reply to Re: lamotrigine » SLS, posted by ColoradoSnowflake on November 24, 2009, at 22:28:03
Gayle I know of plaquinal so it now comes in pill form? That's great news and agree about Holiday stress. It exacerbates about everything. Love Phillipa
Posted by keina on November 26, 2009, at 13:54:57
In reply to Re: lamotrigine, posted by morganator on November 24, 2009, at 4:57:16
hi im new to this. just wanted to say im on lamictal 100mg. not quite doing the job so my doctor added a new drug saphris to it. this has made a big improvement but im gaining weight from both drugs. Lamictal also gives me migraines something awful.
Posted by SLS on November 26, 2009, at 19:44:05
In reply to Re: lamotrigine, posted by keina on November 26, 2009, at 13:54:57
> hi im new to this. just wanted to say im on lamictal 100mg. not quite doing the job so my doctor added a new drug saphris to it. this has made a big improvement but im gaining weight from both drugs. Lamictal also gives me migraines something awful.
Welcome.:-) <smile>
100mg is a bit low for Lamictal. Most people settle in at 200mg. I'm afraid I don't have a remedy for the headaches. If your headaches are true migraines, perhaps you could add a moderate amount of Topamax, which would minimize the migraines and help control body weight at the same time.
Are you bipolar?
- Scott
Posted by fattoush on November 26, 2009, at 22:58:30
In reply to Re: lamotrigine, posted by keina on November 26, 2009, at 13:54:57
I was wondering when anyone was going to say anything about what I will call headaches - not migraines. Not that I'll stick to that classification. I started getting headaces here and there at 50 mgs. At 75 mgs, they were daily. I continued, because both Pdoc and neurologosit said the weirdest thing, your headaches go away as you keep titrting up. Well, by the time I was 2 weeks into 100 mgs, I felt that my head was in a vice for 4 weeks. Nothing on earth would relieve me. I liked Lamictal for what it did to my morale at as soon as 50, and sometimes through the frowning at 75, but migraine/tension headaches has got to be the most awful thing ever. I now know there is such a thing known as the Lamictal headache like people talk of the Lamictal rash. And easier titration won't help cause I tried a second time, though the second time, I did not allow myself to go over one week of 75 mgs, as the headaches grew like the wild things.
I don't know about adding Topamax. I can't take Topamax for all sorts of reasons.
Posted by fattoush on November 26, 2009, at 23:10:13
In reply to Re: lamotrigine » keina, posted by SLS on November 26, 2009, at 19:44:05
Scott -
What might be a moderate amount of Topamax? It does wonders on my migraines. However, aside from what for peole like us are typically acceptable side effects, twitches, losing words, jitteriness, etc.. it makes me depressed. At higher than 50 mgs, I entertain death wishes, at 75 mgs they graduate to plans, at 100 mgs, I was admitted to the psych ward. This happened twice, even under supervision, and with an AD on board. You have no idea though how I'd love a small dose of Tope with something that could offset the depression and that I could take to prevent my in and of themselves suicidal headaches. I am bipolar II, so ADs scare the hell out of me. I already take Lithium at 450 mgs.
Posted by SLS on November 27, 2009, at 9:55:53
In reply to Re: lamotrigine » SLS, posted by fattoush on November 26, 2009, at 23:10:13
> What might be a moderate amount of Topamax?
I was thinking 100mg.
> It does wonders on my migraines. However, aside from what for peole like us are typically acceptable side effects, twitches, losing words, jitteriness, etc.. it makes me depressed. At higher than 50 mgs, I entertain death wishes, at 75 mgs they graduate to plans, at 100 mgs, I was admitted to the psych ward. This happened twice, even under supervision, and with an AD on board. You have no idea though how I'd love a small dose of Tope with something that could offset the depression and that I could take to prevent my in and of themselves suicidal headaches. I am bipolar II, so ADs scare the hell out of me. I already take Lithium at 450 mgs.
Lithium is not considered to be particularly effective for treating bipolar II. Even so, a dosage of 450mg would be too low. I believe lithium can make migraine worse. You might consider using Depakote instead.
What happens when you get manic?
Which antidepressants trigger mania?
- Scott
Posted by fattoush on November 27, 2009, at 10:20:11
In reply to Re: lamotrigine » fattoush, posted by SLS on November 27, 2009, at 9:55:53
> > What might be a moderate amount of Topamax?
>
> I was thinking 100mg.
>
> > It does wonders on my migraines. However, aside from what for peole like us are typically acceptable side effects, twitches, losing words, jitteriness, etc.. it makes me depressed. At higher than 50 mgs, I entertain death wishes, at 75 mgs they graduate to plans, at 100 mgs, I was admitted to the psych ward. This happened twice, even under supervision, and with an AD on board. You have no idea though how I'd love a small dose of Tope with something that could offset the depression and that I could take to prevent my in and of themselves suicidal headaches. I am bipolar II, so ADs scare the hell out of me. I already take Lithium at 450 mgs.
>
> Lithium is not considered to be particularly effective for treating bipolar II. Even so, a dosage of 450mg would be too low. I believe lithium can make migraine worse. You might consider using Depakote instead.
>
> What happens when you get manic?
>
> Which antidepressants trigger mania?
>
>
> - Scott
>
>
My mania had never exhibited itself before I took anti-depressants. On the SSRIs, I get that super uncomfortable inner agitation all day, so much that I'm afraid I might press too far too fast on the gas pedal. On SNRI and on EMSAM, I was a riot. I was buying sunglasses by the dozen and having sex with a dozen men a week.
All I've read seems to support the notion that Lithium is being used even as monotherapy for depression. I can't take higher, shortness of breath.
Depakote would be good for both my migraines and my bipolar, but I won't gain 5 pounds a month for as long as you're on it. This is an experience I went through twice and rather die instead. Plus, it's supposed to be better on mania.
Thanks.
Posted by keina on November 27, 2009, at 14:08:12
In reply to Re: lamotrigine » keina, posted by SLS on November 26, 2009, at 19:44:05
yes im bipolar. beleive it or not topamax makes me gain wt. and gives me more headaches. I always have the worst luck with side effects. I would give anything to find something to help with the weight. been on geodon, gave me involuntary mouth movements but lost 20lbs. had to go off because of the mouth thing.
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