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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 17 of 17. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Quintal on July 29, 2008, at 19:59:33
My pdoc switched me from zopiclone to temazepam and I took my first dose (10mg) two hours ago. After the initial half hour of mild drowsiness I began to get more alert. I forced myself to get into bed anyway and turn out the light, but it's no use, I can't even try to go to sleep. I want to get some work done but it's the middle of the night. I couldn't have hoped to have more energy if I'd just taken a dexedrine instead.
Adrafinil makes me drowsy, maybe I should use that as a sleep aid instead? Or maybe some methamphetamine? I'm sure to get some deep, refreshing sleep from that.
Q
Posted by Quintal on July 30, 2008, at 10:17:25
In reply to Paradoxical reactions, posted by Quintal on July 29, 2008, at 19:59:33
Goodness! Over ten hours and no more posts on the meds board?! This place is hitting rock bottom. Where's the sense of community gone?
Anyway, I took a zopiclone in the hope of falling asleep, but all it did was give me tinnitus. Also, no bitter metallic taste when taken with temazepam, and the same thing happened when I took it with Lyrica. Curious. So, another night with nearly complete insomnia despite taking two sleeping meds. Today I felt crappy. By dinner time I felt I couldn't go on, so I took another temazepam. Had no effect on anxiety at all, in fact I came close to panic. So I took a carisoprodol. Two hours later I feel slightly better for that, but this is getting ridiculous.
Tonight I'm cracking open a bottle of wine, respiritory collapse or not, I'm going to get some sleep. I'm not really bothered. I don't know what I'm going to say to the pdoc. I might hand him the temazepam back so he knows I'm not just trying to hoard it. What next? Chloral hydrate? Something's wrong here. I shouldn't be this resistant to sedatives, but this is exactly what happened to me with clonazepam - I went through periods where the prescribed dose just didn't work, so I 'had' to take huge doses just to get a therapeutic effect. Hence my history of benzo addiction. Sometimes I think that's all it is - some people just lose the therapeutic effect very quickly and have to raise the dose just to get any effect. This is what predisposes me to benzo addiction. It's not some attempt at getting a cheap party buzz, although it may look like that to some people from a distance. Just wanted to get that off my chest.
Q
Posted by Phillipa on July 30, 2008, at 10:43:39
In reply to Re: Paradoxical reactions, posted by Quintal on July 30, 2008, at 10:17:25
Yup I hear an echo here. And I also have the same problem with sleep meds. Now I just fall asleep on same l5mg of valium. But last summer that high doseage of benzos that pdoc gave me I didn't sleep for two weeks and that was cause the tiny dose of luvox was taken. Well I'll not leave you hanging with no responses. I hope you feel better Q. Love Phillipa
Posted by Quintal on July 30, 2008, at 10:51:44
In reply to Re: Paradoxical reactions » Quintal, posted by Phillipa on July 30, 2008, at 10:43:39
Thank you Phillipa. I'm wondering if it might be rebound from stopping Lyrica? It says in the leaflet that difficulty sleeping might be a problem on stopping it. Temazepam feels more like an anti-anxiety drug than a hypnotic, and I think that's the problem. When all the anxiety is gone I feel more lively. I don't want to go to sleep.
Q
Posted by Amigan on July 30, 2008, at 11:20:08
In reply to Re: Paradoxical reactions, posted by Quintal on July 30, 2008, at 10:51:44
These paradoxical reaction are common to adolescents, but they can occur to adults sometimes.
> Where's the sense of community gone?
I don't know. The lack of feedback on psycho-babble worries me too. I don't think it went elsewhere, as i am not aware of any other boards which are equally good to this one.
Posted by Quintal on July 30, 2008, at 11:38:33
In reply to Re: Paradoxical reactions, posted by Amigan on July 30, 2008, at 11:20:08
Thank you. I must have an immature nervous system - I tend to get paradoxical excitement with antihistamines too.
>I don't think it went elsewhere, as i am not aware of any other boards which are equally good to this one.
I think it might have been slowly eroded by various factors over time.
Q
Posted by Phillipa on July 30, 2008, at 11:56:46
In reply to Re: Paradoxical reactions, posted by Quintal on July 30, 2008, at 10:51:44
Q you just never know what these drugs are doing and the interactions of others with it. It's good thought. Phillipa glad you're getting responses now so frustrating waiting.
Posted by Quintal on July 30, 2008, at 12:04:49
In reply to Re: Paradoxical reactions » Quintal, posted by Phillipa on July 30, 2008, at 11:56:46
Yes, it's good too see traffic picking up. One of the women that comes to see me said today that she was told many of the side effects we suffer might actually be a form of drug poisoning. My pdoc admits that I'm his guinea pig with Lyrica as he's never used it before. Hardly any of these combinations have been tested together like individual drugs are in clinical trials, so I suppose we don't know for sure if they're safe.
Q
Posted by Phillipa on July 30, 2008, at 20:06:48
In reply to Re: Paradoxical reactions, posted by Quintal on July 30, 2008, at 12:04:49
Q what's your combo now? Phillipa
Posted by Quintal on July 31, 2008, at 6:35:13
In reply to Re: Paradoxical reactions » Quintal, posted by Phillipa on July 30, 2008, at 20:06:48
37.5mg Tianeptine
100mg Lamotrigine
Zopiclone 7.5mg/Temazepam 10mg at night.And the codeine, and quite a few anti-allergy meds too.
Q
Posted by Phillipa on July 31, 2008, at 23:56:22
In reply to Re: Paradoxical reactions, posted by Quintal on July 31, 2008, at 6:35:13
Q been gone all day but that is not a lot. For some reason I thought you were on more. Hope you are well today. Love Phillipa
Posted by Phillipa on August 1, 2008, at 0:01:43
In reply to Re: Paradoxical reactions » Quintal, posted by Phillipa on July 31, 2008, at 23:56:22
Read lyrica can have a nasty withdrawal. Maybe tolerance is why a stonger med merely lightens anxiety so you feel happy but no sleep is not good not good at all. Did you sleep last night? Love Phillipa
Posted by Quintal on August 1, 2008, at 7:04:04
In reply to Re: Paradoxical reactions, posted by Phillipa on August 1, 2008, at 0:01:43
Yeah, a little. I took zopiclone instead and it worked quite well. I think it might have been the switch from zopiclone to temazepam that was the problem. Temazepam might have worked if I wasn't already used to zopiclone, but it's useless as a hypnotic for me now. I might try it again tonight just to see, but I have an appointment with pdoc on Tueday and I'll ask if he'll try something different. Maybe Ambien? That used to work very well for actually getting me to sleep, but not so good for maintenance.
Q
Posted by West on August 1, 2008, at 10:20:31
In reply to Re: Paradoxical reactions, posted by Quintal on August 1, 2008, at 7:04:04
I'm actually having exactly the same problem at the moment- with exactly the same two drugs- I reckon i must have the most juvenile nervous system in town. Moclobemide is to blame though, you (I) can't win with it as regards dosing and sleep. Not taking my second dose today for that reason. Temazepam is roughly as euphoric as zopiclone to me, possibly it's relief from depression (or associated anxiety) but don't want to take it as an antidepressant. Both just encourage late night surfing/film watching in me but a month of moclobemide has totally ravaged me. I was given nitrazepam when i complained of not sleeping despite tem./zop. That was a different thing altogether.
Posted by Quintal on August 1, 2008, at 11:08:18
In reply to Re: Paradoxical reactions, posted by West on August 1, 2008, at 10:20:31
Well it's good to know I'm not alone with this. I too find them similarly euphoric, but I find zopiclone causes more cognitive impairment. I really struggle to keep a straight train of thought on that, but with temazepam my head feels clearer, I suppose because there are fewer intrusive/obsessive thoughts. I think this is why zopiclone helps me fall asleep better.
I took moclobemide at the maximum dose for six months back in 2003, and had no benefit from it whatsoever. I remember it did cause some sleeping difficulty at first and my GP gave me some zolpidem to help with that. The only thing that stands out about nitrazepam was the huge size of the tablets, like horse tablets, and that I'd wake up falling out of bed for some reason. I suppose I must have roused myself in a heavily sedated state and only properly woken up when I realized I was falling.
Q
Posted by West on August 1, 2008, at 14:43:03
In reply to Re: Paradoxical reactions » West, posted by Quintal on August 1, 2008, at 11:08:18
> Well it's good to know I'm not alone with this. I too find them similarly euphoric, but I find zopiclone causes more cognitive impairment. I really struggle to keep a straight train of thought on that, but with temazepam my head feels clearer, I suppose because there are fewer intrusive/obsessive thoughts. I think this is why zopiclone helps me fall asleep better.
>
> I took moclobemide at the maximum dose for six months back in 2003, and had no benefit from it whatsoever. I remember it did cause some sleeping difficulty at first and my GP gave me some zolpidem to help with that. The only thing that stands out about nitrazepam was the huge size of the tablets, like horse tablets, and that I'd wake up falling out of bed for some reason. I suppose I must have roused myself in a heavily sedated state and only properly woken up when I realized I was falling.
>
> QThey're like alka seltzers. Don't recall anything about them apart from feeling grotty all the next day, might borrow your idea and give them back to my gp. Virtue points. Zopiclone is a much better sleep drug than temazepam but i have gotten too tolerant lately- my gp is quite old herself and only prescribes the benzos if you ask for something to help you sleep. Actually i have become relatively functional on them when i can't get off to sleep, especially physically- making elaborate meals, cleaning, push ups - with only a very faint memory on waking. Not very reassuring!
I begun buying mine on the net for about 33p each since i can't guarantee a prescription when i need them the most. I try to be responsible with them and wait until 3am to see if i can't sleep naturally but i nearly always end up popping one. I have come off them and been fine. Nytol is a bad choice as it has so many (primary) effects other than sedation and tends to leave me feeling nasty the nest day.
Actually i'd like to come off sleep drugs altogether. Zopiclone does gradually make me more depressed i think.
Did you ask for zolpidem? Just interested since i've never heard of it being used here.
Glad to read from other posts that you're still doing well on tianeptine. What dose are you taking?
Posted by Quintal on August 1, 2008, at 21:18:00
In reply to Re: Paradoxical reactions, posted by West on August 1, 2008, at 14:43:03
I sometimes take half a zopiclone if I want to get something done during the day. I took 20mg temazepam a few hours ago in the hope of being able to get some housework done, but felt nothing. It's absolute sh*t, if I may be so frank. This was very much the impression I was left with years ago when I first took it. I just hoped it would be different this time.
I did ask for zolpidem (Stilnoct here). I've had it almost as often as zopiclone. You're right, it isn't really used here at all, compared to the US where it's maybe the most popular sleep aid. I've never tried zaleplon though. I'm sure the pharmacy would have none in stock and wouldn't be surprised if they coudn't even source it for me. I've had that happen with a few other drugs. I have ordered it and clonazepam from online pharmacies in the past, but lately I've had trouble getting it past customs. My current pdoc is pretty good about giving me what I need though.
I usually take three tablets (37.5mg) of tianeptine a day.
Q
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