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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 11 of 11. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by UGottaHaveHope on February 14, 2007, at 11:41:01
Stargazer:
First of all, thanks for the offer to help me out with my wet patches. I think I will be OK. That was thoughtful, though.
I noticed you have tried Emsam and Nardil. I am thinking about making the same switch, going from Emsam to Nardil. I am on week six of the Emsam, but it seems to be a little too activating for my anxiety. I was wondering if I could ask you a few questions:
1. Does Nardil seem to help your anxiety better than Emsam?
2. How was the transition between the two? Did you have a washout period or go straight into it?
3. How long did it take for you to feel a response from Nardil?If you would prefer to email me these answers (and that would be great), it's sportscarvell@yahoo.com
Thanks!
Posted by stargazer on February 14, 2007, at 22:18:34
In reply to EMSAM to Nardil - Stargazer, posted by UGottaHaveHope on February 14, 2007, at 11:41:01
Hi Ugotta...No problem with loaning you a few patches...I've plenty for all.
I havent't made the switch to Nardil yet but think it may be the way to go if Emsam fails to achieve more of a response. I'm waiting on another pdoc opinion, thinking perhaps my pdoc is jsut clueless like so many are with resistent cases.
I'm tempted to add a med called Phenylalanine (DLPA) to the Emsam as Laima has had good results doing that before I switch off Emsam completely.
Some of the other meds I'm looking at trying too are Tianeptine or Amisulpride, although I know next to nothing about them but understand they have helped others when the traditional meds have failed to help them.
Nardil was the first AD that worked for me back in 1987 and gave me 2 brief years of relief but I do remember the response was very good with minimal side effects. That is why I want to try it again since that was the only time I was on it. The MAO's fell out of popularity once Prozac and the others came out so my pdoc tried every other drug for depression with little long term results. I'm thinking there could be a good chance it would work again, but I tried Marplan a second time and it did not work, so that could happen with Nardil, but I think I should give it another chance using higher dosages as other here have used, up to 90 mg. I was only on 30 mg when I took it, 15 mg 2x/day. I don't think my pdoc tried to increase the dosage but I really can't remember.
But I can remember Nardil making me handle stress very well up until it stopped working...hate when that happens as it has made my recovery from depression all but impossible.
We have to keep in touch, I'll keep your email for another conversation...Thanks.
Stargazer
Posted by UGottaHaveHope on February 15, 2007, at 0:04:11
In reply to Re: EMSAM to Nardil /UGotta, posted by stargazer on February 14, 2007, at 22:18:34
Thats very nice of you. Those patches are $18.50 a pop lol.
Let me ask you this: What side effects did you have on Nardil? Can you elaborate? Thanks.
Posted by stargazer on February 15, 2007, at 8:21:21
In reply to Re: EMSAM to Nardil/Stargazer, posted by UGottaHaveHope on February 15, 2007, at 0:04:11
I don't remember any terrible side effects...all I remember (20 years ago) was that I did begin to see a response in the first week, something subtle but definately making me more resilient to stress, almost like a buffering effect towards everything that made me nervous. I thought to myself, this pdoc is amazing, it was the second med she tried (after Elavil) and went right for a MAO, no pussyfooting around like they do today.
Sounds too good to be true, right?
I didn't find the diet that bad...knowing that my life was improved I could stop eating everything on that list...cheese was the only thing that I had trouble eliminating completely.
When will you start Nardil? Is your pdoc reluctant? I am thinking enough of the Emsam myself, although it has helped get me out of a deep depression, I still have all the residual symptoms of lack of motivation and interest, the symptoms that never go away completely...
I'm calling the consulting pdoc today for a second opinion I had requested... hopefully he can evaluate things differently, maybe he'll say let's try Nardil, right off the bat! I'll be ready, I think...my life is not worth very much without the ability to work and make money and feel useful...SG
Posted by UGottaHaveHope on February 15, 2007, at 10:13:09
In reply to Re: EMSAM to Nardil/Stargazer, posted by stargazer on February 15, 2007, at 8:21:21
SG:
Well, my pdoc wanted me to give Emsam an 8-week trail, which I am doing. It is week 6, and I hate to admit this, but I am feeling a little better. Maybe it is kicking in a little. The only reason I hate to admit, because I am really determined to do a two-month trial on Nardil, hearing that it has a better effect on generalized anxiety disorder than Emsam.You still ate a little cheese on Nardil? Did you ever have any bad reactions on anything?
Posted by stargazer on February 15, 2007, at 17:36:02
In reply to Re: EMSAM to Nardil/to Stargazer, posted by UGottaHaveHope on February 15, 2007, at 10:13:09
as long as I didn't eat really aged cheese which I don't really like and stick with American or Mozzarella I was oK, cream cheese is OK. Occasionally I could feel myself getting headache but never turned into a crisis.
I don't like red white so that was OK, I would drink a glass of white wine and that was fine.
I just found out the second opinion pdoc can't see me for another two weeks so I may give the amino acid DLPA a try if I can get some.
I hate wasting time not trying something else.
I am doing OK on Emsam 9 but lack interest and energy and have had trouble with lightheadedness and hypotension which is a SE of the MAOs although I don't remember it with Nardil.Perhaps we can both try Nardil in 2 weeks, although I did call my regular pdoc to possible see him next week and God only knows what he'll do but there's always 12 mg Emsam to bump up to before giving it the heave ho.
Later...SG
Posted by UGottaHaveHope on February 15, 2007, at 22:59:06
In reply to Re: EMSAM to Nardil/Ugotta, posted by stargazer on February 15, 2007, at 17:36:02
You know what's weird about Emsam? You dont really hear any success stories about it.
That's not to say it won't work for someone reading this, but I don't really see anyone saying they are the Emsam Champ!!!!!
That is interesting that you would have a BP reaction on Emsam, but not on Nardil since Nardil is considered much much stronger and robust. The only thing I can think is maybe you are taking another med with Emsam that in combination did not mix well with what you ate.
Yes, let's start the trial together in two weeks! :)
Posted by stargazer on February 17, 2007, at 0:12:19
In reply to Re: EMSAM to Nardil/ Stargazer, posted by UGottaHaveHope on February 15, 2007, at 22:59:06
Hey how come nobody else is interested in our post? I guess it is just our own private conversation...
Well 20 years have gone by since I tried nardil and you know the parts start to wear out a bit, at least that is what I blame many of my breakdowns on.
But I have been having the dizziness even prior to trying Emsam beginning with Seroquel and Lamictal but it didn't go away after I stopped them. I have always been a bit dizzy anyway.
I have a tendency to get easily dehydrated and since I forget to eat and drink often, the BP falls even lower. I also have to add salt to my food to make me thirsty since I don't get thirsty either. More weird biochemical stuff.
I'm searching for the amino acid DLPA to add to the Emsam rlike Laima is doing. I have found it online, now I just have to get it and test it out.
Another experiment on the horizon. It's better than doing nothing while the pdocs are clueless as to how they can help some of us, probably more than a few are in our situation.
I'll let you know how that goes too.
SG
Posted by stargazer on February 17, 2007, at 0:12:28
In reply to Re: EMSAM to Nardil/ Stargazer, posted by UGottaHaveHope on February 15, 2007, at 22:59:06
Hey how come nobody else is interested in our post? I guess it is just our own private conversation...
Well 20 years have gone by since I tried nardil and you know the parts start to wear out a bit, at least that is what I blame many of my breakdowns on.
But I have been having the dizziness even prior to trying Emsam beginning with Seroquel and Lamictal but it didn't go away after I stopped them. I have always been a bit dizzy anyway.
I have a tendency to get easily dehydrated and since I forget to eat and drink often, the BP falls even lower. I also have to add salt to my food to make me thirsty since I don't get thirsty either. More weird biochemical stuff.
I'm searching for the amino acid DLPA to add to the Emsam rlike Laima is doing. I have found it online, now I just have to get it and test it out.
Another experiment on the horizon. It's better than doing nothing while the pdocs are clueless as to how they can help some of us, probably more than a few are in our situation.
I'll let you know how that goes too.
SG
Posted by UgottaHaveHope on February 17, 2007, at 9:56:08
In reply to Re: EMSAM to Nardil/ Stargazer/Ugotta, posted by stargazer on February 17, 2007, at 0:12:28
Why add the amino acid? What is the thought process behind that? Thanks
Posted by stargazer on February 17, 2007, at 20:49:20
In reply to Re: EMSAM to Nardil/ Stargazer/Ugotta, posted by stargazer on February 17, 2007, at 0:12:28
This amino acid, Phenylalanine is a precursor to dopamine and norepinephrine and has been used for treatment of depression. There was study that said it was more effective than desipramine and that in combination with Seligeline (Emsam)it was a powerful antidepressant.
I googled it, Phenylalanine and read some of the reports about it. I figure it was worth trying and both Laima and someone else is having good results with it. Laima is also on Emsam.
Since it does not require a prescription it is one of those things I can try myself to see if there is any effect.
I found it online and just haven't ordered it yet.
I don'tthink it can casue any harm andmay actually help with things. There may be some infor on the alternative boards too for more information.I can't remember what is your history with depression and past treatment if it isn't too complicated.
Stargazer
This is the end of the thread.
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