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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 8 of 8. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by don_bristol on October 10, 2003, at 10:06:37
I have been on Nardil for about 6 weeks. The last two weeks on 60mg.
I have noticed that I sometimes go SLOW. I don't feel sleepy when al this is going on.
I may walk slowly. Or I may talk slowly (friends have all commented on it). And the weirdest thing is that when I notice I am walking ot talking slowly and I realise it is too slow, I still have no inclination whatsoever to want to go faster!
I also feel sort of muddled in my mind but not confused, if that makes sense. In other words, I can have what seems to be very clear thought indeed but there is a sort of dullness.
Does anyone recognise this sort of side effect from Nardil? Is it likely to pass? How common is it?
Don
Posted by timidly on October 12, 2003, at 20:21:33
In reply to Why am I walking and talking SLOWLY on Nardil?, posted by don_bristol on October 10, 2003, at 10:06:37
Don, My experience is that it gets better with time, but it never goes away. You have another month or so to go before the "start up" side effects wear off. If you still have problems with "SLOWness" after another month you should ask your pdoc about augmenting the Nardil with something to help the slowness. I've been on Nardil almost 30 years, and am now also taking Ritalin, Provigil, and Thyroid (T3) to augment the Nardil. [EOB]
> I have been on Nardil for about 6 weeks. The last two weeks on 60mg.
>
> I have noticed that I sometimes go SLOW. I don't feel sleepy when al this is going on.
>
> I may walk slowly. Or I may talk slowly (friends have all commented on it). And the weirdest thing is that when I notice I am walking ot talking slowly and I realise it is too slow, I still have no inclination whatsoever to want to go faster!
>
> I also feel sort of muddled in my mind but not confused, if that makes sense. In other words, I can have what seems to be very clear thought indeed but there is a sort of dullness.
>
> Does anyone recognise this sort of side effect from Nardil? Is it likely to pass? How common is it?
>
> Don
Posted by Tepiaca on October 12, 2003, at 22:59:13
In reply to Re: Why am I walking and talking SLOWLY on Nardil?, posted by timidly on October 12, 2003, at 20:21:33
hi timidly (sorry for get out of the theme don)
Im afraid of the poop out with the nardil
have you suffered any time a poop out in these 30 years ??
what have been your mainly side effects ? do you have found crontol of them ??what is your dose? by the way
greetings
Posted by timidly on October 13, 2003, at 20:28:05
In reply to Re: Why am I walking and talking SLOWLY on Nardil? » timidly, posted by Tepiaca on October 12, 2003, at 22:59:13
Yes, I have had times when it seemed the Nardil stopped working.
For me it happened fairly regularly about every 9 years. Each time
I went off the Nardil, tried the newest wonder drug, and after a couple
months went back on the Nardil. Each time, except right now, the Nardil
kicked in like it did when I first started it. The most recent poop out
started about 4-5 years ago. I went through the same process, but this time
the Nardil didn't kick in lick all the previous times. I am currently taking
120 mg every day (8 tablets). Nardil is the only antidepressent that has ever
worked for me (I have tried everything on the market, including electroshock).
Dosage: my current daily dosages are 120 mg Nardil (8 tablets), 60 mg Metadate ER (Ritalin),
200 mg Provigil, 12.5 ug Cytomel (T3), and 200 mg Trazodone. Keep in mind that for
the first 26 of those 30 years I was feeling great on 60 mg Nardil and 20 mg Ritalin.
Side Effects: Anorgasmia and the slow down you mentioned have been chronic side effects.
When starting the Nardil, or just changing
the dosage, there were transient side including dry mouth, blurred vision or trouble focusing,
constipation, and postural hypotension. On the plus side, the Nardil controls my hypertension
and cholesterol, which eliminates two other medicines I have to take when off the Nardil.
The diet restrictions are a very small price to pay for getting my life back.
Hope this helps.
>
> hi timidly (sorry for get out of the theme don)
> Im afraid of the poop out with the nardil
> have you suffered any time a poop out in these 30 years ??
> what have been your mainly side effects ? do you have found crontol of them ??
>
> what is your dose? by the way
>
> greetings
Posted by don_bristol on October 14, 2003, at 17:19:20
In reply to Re: Why am I walking and talking SLOWLY on Nardil?, posted by timidly on October 12, 2003, at 20:21:33
> Don, My experience is that it gets better with time, but it
> never goes away. You have another month or so to go before
> the "start up" side effects wear off. If you still have
> problems with "SLOWness" after another month you should ask
> your pdoc about augmenting the Nardil with something to help
> the slowness.Timidly, thank you so much for replying. I was beginning to worry that no-one else recognised my side effecs on Nardil so I am very glad to hear that you recognise them.
I find the side effects I get from Nardil quite hard to handle. And sadly I don't find Nardil anything like as effective as you seem to yourself. The slowness is really quite weird to me and it feels that I move like an elderly person with Parkinsons. The slow talking is creepy too.
> I've been on Nardil almost 30 years, and am now also
> taking Ritalin, Provigil, and Thyroid (T3) to augment
> the Nardil.Do these stimulants actually remove the "brain fog" which you might get with Nardil?
Posted by timidly on October 14, 2003, at 21:51:16
In reply to Re: Why am I walking and talking SLOWLY on Nardil? » timidly, posted by don_bristol on October 14, 2003, at 17:19:20
Yes and no. About a month or so after I started Nardil my pdoc started me on Ritalin to combat the slowness and fatique. The combination has worked quite well for me for many years. Even though that was 30 years ago it is still very vivid in my mind. My situation now is very different than yours. After 30 years the Nardil is no longer enough to keep me going. There are no new classes of antidepressents on the horizon, and none of the existing ones help me. My pdoc has told me to prepare for permanent disability. All the extra meds are his last ditch attempt to postpone the inevitable. He said the Provigil was his last shot, and there was nothing more he could do. Parnate is much more activating/stimulating than Nardil. I had severe side effects with Parnate, and it aggrevated my anxiety problems. Both Parnate and Nardil are MAOI antidepressents. Nardil has the advantage that it helps with quite a few other things, for me these included constant anxiety, social anxiety, panic attacks, paranoia, OCD, etc. There are a lot more options now than I had 30 years ago. Talk to your pdoc about which options make sense in your case. Your situation, symptoms, and medical history are unique to you. Everyone reacts differently to medications; sometimes very slightly different and other times extremely different. Your experiences will be uniquely yours. The experiences of others will be similar in some areas and different in others. You and your pdoc are the only ones familar with all aspects and nuances of your condition. You are not alone in your struggles. The experiences of others may comfort you or horrify you. There is no way to predict how things will turn out for you.
Posted by don_bristol on October 15, 2003, at 2:21:46
In reply to Re: Why am I walking and talking SLOWLY on Nardil?, posted by timidly on October 14, 2003, at 21:51:16
--------QUOTE -------
Yes and no. About a month or so after I started Nardil my pdoc started me on Ritalin to combat the slowness and fatique. The combination has worked quite well for me for many years. Even though that was 30 years ago it is still very vivid in my mind. My situation now is very different than yours. After 30 years the Nardil is no longer enough to keep me going. There are no new classes of antidepressents on the horizon, and none of the existing ones help me. My pdoc has told me to prepare for permanent disability. All the extra meds are his last ditch attempt to postpone the inevitable. He said the Provigil was his last shot, and there was nothing more he could do. Parnate is much more activating/stimulating than Nardil. I had severe side effects with Parnate, and it aggrevated my anxiety problems. Both Parnate and Nardil are MAOI antidepressents. Nardil has the advantage that it helps with quite a few other things, for me these included constant anxiety, social anxiety, panic attacks, paranoia, OCD, etc. There are a lot more options now than I had 30 years ago. Talk to your pdoc about which options make sense in your case.
-------- END QUOTE -------Timidly, thank you for your information. I am in the UK and I have just started Nardil for atypical depression and dysthmia.
I have begged and bowed to get my pdoc and my GP to prescribe ritalin or any other minor stimulant but they are adament that they can not give me such a thing. The frequent therapeutic use of the sorts of meds are still relatively new in the UK (we ares till struggling to recognise things like ADHD). So, sadly, that is not an option for me.
I suspect I will have to change from Nardil. The results I have been getting from Nardil are nothing like as good as you have had.
You may or may not know that we in the UK still have Marplan. I get the feeling it is closer to nardil than it is to Parnate. QUESTION 1: do you or anyone else here know if that is true as I see my pdoc *tomorrow* and would like to propose a change.
On the other hand, if I get something stimulating then maybe it will be good for me and help to energise me although I suspect will have to medicate myself with sleeping tablets.
QUESTION 2: Do you think that if Nardil did not work well for me (it worked a little although I guess it is early days) then maybe I should go for Parnate as it is supposed to be somewhat different.
BTW we also have Moclobemide which you guys don't. That was a really good med for me although it pooped out after only a few months. Maybe you can import either Marplan or Moclobemide if Parnate is not going to be a good alternative for you.
Thanks to you or anyone else for amy info.
Posted by timidly on October 15, 2003, at 14:05:55
In reply to Re: Choosing Parnate or Marplan (or Nardil) » timidly, posted by don_bristol on October 15, 2003, at 2:21:46
> --------QUOTE -------
> Timidly, thank you for your information. I am in the UK and I have just started Nardil for atypical depression and dysthmia.
>
> I have begged and bowed to get my pdoc and my GP to prescribe Ritalin or any other minor stimulant but they are adamant that they can not give me such a thing. The frequent therapeutic use of the sorts of meds are still relatively new in the UK (we are still struggling to recognise things like ADHD). So, sadly, that is not an option for me.
>
> I suspect I will have to change from Nardil. The results I have been getting from Nardil are nothing like as good as you have had.
>
> You may or may not know that we in the UK still have Marplan. I get the feeling it is closer to Nardil than it is to Parnate. QUESTION 1: do you or anyone else here know if that is true as I see my pdoc *tomorrow* and would like to propose a change.
>
> On the other hand, if I get something stimulating then maybe it will be good for me and help to energise me although I suspect will have to medicate myself with sleeping tablets.
>
> QUESTION 2: Do you think that if Nardil did not work well for me (it worked a little although I guess it is early days) then maybe I should go for Parnate as it is supposed to be somewhat different.
>
> BTW we also have Moclobemide which you guys don't. That was a really good med for me although it pooped out after only a few months. Maybe you can import either Marplan or Moclobemide if Parnate is not going to be a good alternative for you.
>
> Thanks to you or anyone else for any info.
> -------- END QUOTE -------Nardil is the drug of choice when depression is accompanied by things like dysthmia. Stimulants can also aggravate dysthmia. Taking vitamin B complex is very important while taking an MAOI, and may help with some of the symptoms.
You are correct that Marplan and Moclobemide are more like Nardil than Parnate. You are also correct that Parnate is quite different than Nardil. Parnate may help the depression but it is known to aggravate things like dysthmia. Parnate can cause a "too fast" effect like Nardil can cause a "slow down" effect. Parnate is quite energizing with effects similar to minor stimulants. If you do try Parnate you may require additional anti-anxiety and sleep meds.
- Just one man's opinion - Timidly
This is the end of the thread.
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