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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 19 of 19. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Serzone Guy on January 17, 2002, at 17:23:21
Greetings,
I am Serzone Guy, I have been on this stuff for 4 and 1/2 years. I mean it helped me get better, which I do not deny, but I am in my early 30's Am I to take this drug for life ? Now they say Black Box warning, 1 in 200,000 users will die or need a liver. I mean why don't they study this shit better ? 6 to 8 weeks in a clinic, with Psychiatrists passing them out like friggin candy, with the general opinion, people are chemically imbalanced for life, so take the crap for life, isnt a good thorough Study. Now I am caught, cause they never told me when I took this crap, that when I wanted to stop it, or taper it I would feel like SHIT after the 4th day, I mean I feel worse with a reduction after 3 to 5 days as did when I was majorly depressed, but in a new way, locked up pupils, tremors, etc. Flu Pains, knee pains, etc. friggin unbearable, Serzone also gives you a soft bone, numbs your bone so when you orgasm, it barely spits out, with not much sensation. And I only take 200 mg a day, some people are taking 400 to 600 mg a day of this. Had I have been informed of the horrible effects when trying to reduce this, before I started taking it, I would not have ever taken it. I would have tried Prozac with a long half life. If someone out there can tell me how to get off of this stuff slowly over 1 year or 2 years if necessary, I will appreciate it.
Sincerely - Worried Serzone Guy
Posted by Rick on January 17, 2002, at 19:13:08
In reply to SERZONE a real BITCH for me to taper or reduce !!!, posted by Serzone Guy on January 17, 2002, at 17:23:21
Sorry to hear your plight. Some people can't tolerate Serzone's side effects when TAKING it, but even with its short half-life Serzone has MUCH lower incidence of withdrawal than, say Paxil or Effexor. Nonetheless, it *is* a problem for some people, as your situation demonstrates.
(Although I do wonder if some of your symptoms could be rebound depression/anxiety, even if manifested differently than before.)I once quit 450 mg/day Serzone cold turkey. Maybe that wasn't smart, but I didn't notice any physical distress at all. Of course, that was after "only" one and a half years, not four.
Also, I didn't notice any negative sexual effects at all on 450 mg Serzone (indeed, it seems to *enhance* sensations for me), while Celexa gave me near-complete anorgasmia at a lowish 20 mg and Nardil was even worse. As for the liver thing, 1/200,000 doesn't sound like a lot to me, although I have to admit it's one too many for every 200,000th user. Just hang in there, you'll get through this. Maybe *short-term* usage of a long-half-life benzo would ease the withdrawal.
Good Luck,
Rick
> Greetings,
> I am Serzone Guy, I have been on this stuff for 4 and 1/2 years. I mean it helped me get better, which I do not deny, but I am in my early 30's Am I to take this drug for life ? Now they say Black Box warning, 1 in 200,000 users will die or need a liver. I mean why don't they study this shit better ? 6 to 8 weeks in a clinic, with Psychiatrists passing them out like friggin candy, with the general opinion, people are chemically imbalanced for life, so take the crap for life, isnt a good thorough Study. Now I am caught, cause they never told me when I took this crap, that when I wanted to stop it, or taper it I would feel like SHIT after the 4th day, I mean I feel worse with a reduction after 3 to 5 days as did when I was majorly depressed, but in a new way, locked up pupils, tremors, etc. Flu Pains, knee pains, etc. friggin unbearable, Serzone also gives you a soft bone, numbs your bone so when you orgasm, it barely spits out, with not much sensation. And I only take 200 mg a day, some people are taking 400 to 600 mg a day of this. Had I have been informed of the horrible effects when trying to reduce this, before I started taking it, I would not have ever taken it. I would have tried Prozac with a long half life. If someone out there can tell me how to get off of this stuff slowly over 1 year or 2 years if necessary, I will appreciate it.
> Sincerely - Worried Serzone Guy
Posted by TSA West on January 17, 2002, at 23:49:12
In reply to SERZONE a real BITCH for me to taper or reduce !!!, posted by Serzone Guy on January 17, 2002, at 17:23:21
< _____________*****TSA West*****----------------- >
I think you have a better chance of winning the lottery than the chance of liver problems with Serzone; thus you have little to worry about. :)
If you want the same effects of Serzone (5HT-2A antagonism, a new antidepressant effect), perhaps you may try Zyprexa--an atypical neuroleptic with antidepressant properties and a benign side-effect profile.
Posted by Rick on January 18, 2002, at 1:28:33
In reply to Serzone lottery » Serzone Guy, posted by TSA West on January 17, 2002, at 23:49:12
>I think you have a better chance of winning the lottery than the chance of liver problems with Serzone; thus you have little to worry about. :)
Talking about Serzone and the liver, I feel compelled do the due diligence of pointing out that Serzone IS a powerful inhibitor of liver enzyme CYP3A4, which many other drugs depend on for metabolization. So Serzone can increase blood levels of other drugs, sometimes greatly, and thus any Serzone user should check carefully for potential interactions. Doctors *should* be aware of these, such as the potentially-dangerous interactions with some of the cholesterol-lowering statins, but often they're not. And the "drug interaction checkers" in books and on the net are not comprehensive. So with Serzone in combos, careful monitoring is advisable (e.g. for potentiated benzo effects...or for muscle weakness in combo with statins, which can signal the onset of dangerous statin-induced muscle atrophy), and annual liver function blood tests are advisable. The fix for interactions can involve either lowering the dosage of the "other" drug or switching to non-interacting meds. Sometimes the interactions can prove useful and beneficial, as they have for me.
All that said, I feel Serzone is generally a pretty safe drug relative to others. Interactions are a different story from the 1-in-200,000 liver-failure "lottery" for Serzone taken by itself.
Posted by Guinnee Pig on January 18, 2002, at 15:45:35
In reply to Re: Serzone lottery, posted by Rick on January 18, 2002, at 1:28:33
I took serzone for a year and ... when coming off of serzone (I am serzone free now for maybe a month) I am currently experiencing extreme anxiety. 'nuff said.
Posted by yachats on November 24, 2002, at 20:02:26
In reply to SERZONE a real BITCH for me to taper or reduce !!!, posted by Serzone Guy on January 17, 2002, at 17:23:21
Are you also taking a benzo such as Xanax or Klonopin? Serzone inhibits the enzyme that metabolizes benzos-- which result in an increase in benzo blood levels. When you go off Serzone and the enzyme is no longer inhibited your benzo level will drop and you may experience benzo withdrawal symptoms.
Posted by desi on November 25, 2002, at 13:07:13
In reply to Re: SERZONE a real BITCH for me to taper or reduce !!!, posted by yachats on November 24, 2002, at 20:02:26
Has anyone ever experienced weight gain or weight loss with Serzone?
Posted by Rick on November 25, 2002, at 18:40:05
In reply to SERZONE and weight gain » yachats, posted by desi on November 25, 2002, at 13:07:13
While I'm *not* suggesting this -- especially for someone who is in a depressive, anxious, or other "vulnerable" state -- I've tapered from 450 mg Serzone to 0 within 48 hours -- a couple of times. No problems either time, and I *was* taking a benzo, Klonopin (although it's not known if Serzone interacts with Klonopin to the same extent it interacts with some other benzos). OTOH, I have read of a few cases of withdrawal symptoms from Serzone. It's a far cry from the avalanche of withrawal difficulties you see for Paxil or Effexor, but for the person who *is* affected, their own situation is obviously what counts.
In case no one who has experienced weight gain due to Serzone chimes in...Serzone usually doesn't cause weight gain, but again, that's a "usually doesn't," not a "never does."
Rick
Posted by snowden on November 25, 2002, at 19:43:11
In reply to SERZONE and weight gain » yachats, posted by desi on November 25, 2002, at 13:07:13
neither...just made me really, really, really tired...
Posted by JohnX2 on November 26, 2002, at 13:56:05
In reply to SERZONE and weight gain » yachats, posted by desi on November 25, 2002, at 13:07:13
> Has anyone ever experienced weight gain or weight loss with Serzone?
I got weight gain.
Posted by desi on November 26, 2002, at 14:32:26
In reply to Re: SERZONE and weight gain » desi, posted by JohnX2 on November 26, 2002, at 13:56:05
> > Has anyone ever experienced weight gain or weight loss with Serzone?
>
> I got weight gain.
>
> What dosage were you on and did you experience the weight gain immediately? I'm trying to pinpoint whether or not it's the serzone or another thyroid drug I'm on.
Posted by BeardedLady on November 26, 2002, at 14:49:39
In reply to Re: SERZONE and weight gain, posted by desi on November 26, 2002, at 14:32:26
I have been on it for three years. It's hard to say whether my weight gain was due to it or to being cured of my anxiety to the point at which I could eat again. My pdoc assures me it's weight neutral.
I think it increases carb cravings. It took me a long time to lose 20 pounds because of those cravings, but I did, eventually.
I really think the anxiety reduction was the culprit, however. I am on a range of 250-300 mg.
beardy
Some thyroid drugs are known to cause weight gain.
Posted by BeardedLady on November 26, 2002, at 14:55:21
In reply to SERZONE a real BITCH for me to taper or reduce !!!, posted by Serzone Guy on January 17, 2002, at 17:23:21
I have been on Serzone for three and a half years. My pdoc tells me that the liver problem usually happens right away if it's going to happen. I have my liver blood panels checked every six months, just in case.
I have gone off Serzone once. It took me four months to taper, as I didn't want to shock my system back into anxiety.
Although someone on this thread quit it quickly, we're all different. I was told that it would cause vomiting, shakes, and serious illness if I were to quit it cold turkey. There's another way to do it, though, which involves a day on, a day off, two days on, two days off. Or something like that. A good pharmacist can usually tell you.
Still, I think the meds keep your symptoms at bay, so it would be best to trick your body by reducing 50 mg. at a time--I'd say for two weeks at each new dose, if you're not that worried about returning problems. But ask your doc.
beardy
Posted by JohnX2 on November 26, 2002, at 16:01:12
In reply to Re: SERZONE and weight gain, posted by desi on November 26, 2002, at 14:32:26
> > > Has anyone ever experienced weight gain or weight loss with Serzone?
> >
> > I got weight gain.
> >
> > What dosage were you on and did you experience the weight gain immediately? I'm trying to pinpoint whether or not it's the serzone or another thyroid drug I'm on.
>
>
I don't remember the dosage. Probably 450-600 mg.
I think it took a while to notice the weight gain, at least a number of weeks as I usually don't look for it but my clothes started to fit
tighted. Mostly the medicine made me really drowsy
and drunk feeling and greatly increased my appetite. I think the sluggishness may have been an indicator of slower metabolism. I dunno. Plus the pigging out definately was a whammy. When I quit the medicine I stopped the weight gain. The vast majority of people don't gain weight on Serzone.
Posted by Rick on November 27, 2002, at 15:31:50
In reply to Re: SERZONE and weight gain » desi, posted by JohnX2 on November 26, 2002, at 16:01:12
As you probably know, Serzone has fairly weak SRI properties, in addition to other mechanisms of action. I would surmise that at a high-end dose (which 600 certainly is), it would have some of the same side effects you'd get with a typical dose of one of the usual SSRI's. I wonder if that could have encouraged weight gain. Along the same lines. I understand that sexual dysfunction, which usually isn't a problem with Serzone, is somewhat more likely at higher-end doses.
Rick
> I don't remember the dosage. Probably 450-600 mg.
> I think it took a while to notice the weight gain, at least a number of weeks as I usually don't look for it but my clothes started to fit
> tighted. Mostly the medicine made me really drowsy
> and drunk feeling and greatly increased my appetite. I think the sluggishness may have been an indicator of slower metabolism. I dunno. Plus the pigging out definately was a whammy. When I quit the medicine I stopped the weight gain. The vast majority of people don't gain weight on Serzone.
Posted by JohnX2 on December 2, 2002, at 16:09:05
In reply to Re: SERZONE and weight gain » JohnX2, posted by Rick on November 27, 2002, at 15:31:50
Just a dart throw, I think the weight gain may
have been related to the noradrenergic alpha-1
receptor blockade.Serzone has been a weak AD for me, but it is
excellent for my headaches, insomnia, and it
doesn't cause sexual dysfunction.J
> As you probably know, Serzone has fairly weak SRI properties, in addition to other mechanisms of action. I would surmise that at a high-end dose (which 600 certainly is), it would have some of the same side effects you'd get with a typical dose of one of the usual SSRI's. I wonder if that could have encouraged weight gain. Along the same lines. I understand that sexual dysfunction, which usually isn't a problem with Serzone, is somewhat more likely at higher-end doses.
>
> Rick
>
>
> > I don't remember the dosage. Probably 450-600 mg.
> > I think it took a while to notice the weight gain, at least a number of weeks as I usually don't look for it but my clothes started to fit
> > tighted. Mostly the medicine made me really drowsy
> > and drunk feeling and greatly increased my appetite. I think the sluggishness may have been an indicator of slower metabolism. I dunno. Plus the pigging out definately was a whammy. When I quit the medicine I stopped the weight gain. The vast majority of people don't gain weight on Serzone.
>
Posted by Ted McDonough on January 7, 2003, at 20:47:53
In reply to Re: SERZONE and weight gain » JohnX2, posted by Rick on November 27, 2002, at 15:31:50
I've experienced the opposite - weight loss. I also swear it affects ability to build/gain/retain muscle mass when lifting weights. During the 9 months I was off Serzone, I bulked up nicely. Back on it for about 7 months and have lost 18 pounds. A friend who quit Serzone added muscle mass at an amazing rate (well, probably a normal rate but far faster than when he was taking Serzone).
Posted by contchy on October 24, 2003, at 9:17:17
In reply to Re: SERZONE and weight gain » desi, posted by JohnX2 on November 26, 2002, at 13:56:05
could 100mg of serzone be causing weight gain? i came off celexa and i haven't been able to lose weight and am still on 100mg of serzone for sleep. is it possible? it doesnt seem likely since serzone is not supposed to and 100mg is such a low dose .. i m thinking maybe the celexa is still in my system? anyone know? could 100mg be causing this weight to not come off? ( i know myself and when i diet i KNOW i lose weight and i am NOT losing weight)
Posted by platinumbride on October 26, 2003, at 6:21:14
In reply to Re: SERZONE and weight gain, posted by contchy on October 24, 2003, at 9:17:17
well, ummm...
weight neutral, huh?
I hate that drug for many reasons......
suffice to say for this post that while i was on it for 6 weeks at 300 mgs, barely eating a thing, I gained 10 lbs.But I hate that damn drug.....
and yet, cheers to all for whom it worksDiane
PS: I don't think celexa stays in your body all that long.......prozac, i believe, stays much longer
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