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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 10 of 10. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Squiggles on February 11, 2002, at 12:20:46
Hello everyone,
You may remember my posts about benzo withdrawal.
I managed to withdraw from XANAX (which was not
a necessary prescription as the Synthroid had
made me anxious - this theory my doctor has more or less
gone along with and furthermore, lowered the
Synthroid dose by about 40%) I no longer have
panic attacks.My battle with Klonopin withdrawal is a horse of
a different colour. The Xanax (2.0mg over 10-15 yrs)
took 3-4 months of anxiety, etc. to get over and
successfully withdraw from.The Klonopin on the other hand at a dose 0f 1.0mg
has taken close to two years. It had to be suspended
on account of a stroke/seizure incident this August,
which left me very ill (stroke symptoms: travelling
electric sensations in the head culminating in a
feeling of an axe hit in the back centre head;
consequent staggering, lack of concentration, narcolepsy,
painful migraine like headaches, severe depression both
physically and mentally, pin point pupils unreactive
to light, disorientation, etc.) for a month.My husband nursed me back to 0.50mg from 0.125mg -
that was the point of the cerebral "storm" effect;
and then my doctor asked me to wait 6 months to see
how it went at that dose... unfortunately i started
getting worse, and my doctor doubled it to the
original 1.0mg.Where I am now - reinstating to 1.0 - it has been a month;
going up is not as hard as going down, but it certainly
is no piece of cake - I get dyspnea upon taking the
K dose, and I also get pains in the back of my head -
the headaches are getting better but reminiscent of
the areas where the "electric eels" traversed - that's
benzo talk for electric current sensations around the head.I hope to stabilize soon. The localized, headaches in the
back really feel like there's tumour there or something,
but I am sure that is just subjective. I also take lithium and
Synthroid if that is significant.I suppose I will never be able to get off this drug, and
perhaps I should not - I have read articles that as
an anti-convulsant it is specifically given to bipolars
because this disorder shares certain aspects of an epileptoid
disorder. On the other hand I have also seen it prescribed
for GAD - so unless the two are co-concurrent I really
don't know if they've got this right.In any case, stability seems to be the best I can hope
for now, no matter what the pharmacopolitics.Thanks for reading. ( I tried posting before unsuccessfully
it seems).Squiggles
Posted by JohnX2 on February 11, 2002, at 14:13:29
In reply to Klonopin withdrawal AND reinstatement, posted by Squiggles on February 11, 2002, at 12:20:46
Hi,I'm sorry to hear about your chronic pain.
It sounds just awful.I have struggled with a really bad facial neuralgia
for about 2 years. The symptoms were bad tension
headaches, lock jaw, a feeling of wierd pressure
points that would cause pain in my head if touched,
and other issues. The only medicine that seemed to
cure it was Klonopin. I took a pretty strong dose
as I grew tolerant to the anti-convulsant action.
Last month I switched medicines to Topamax which
has basically very similar anti-convulsant actions
as Klonopin but is not habit forming. Anyways I
have been tapering Klonopin quite successfully
from 6 mg to 0.75 mg in 6 weeks with the Topamax
replacement. Topamax may not be for everybody,
but you may want to keep it in mind.I hope you feel better.
-John
> Hello everyone,
>
> You may remember my posts about benzo withdrawal.
> I managed to withdraw from XANAX (which was not
> a necessary prescription as the Synthroid had
> made me anxious - this theory my doctor has more or less
> gone along with and furthermore, lowered the
> Synthroid dose by about 40%) I no longer have
> panic attacks.
>
> My battle with Klonopin withdrawal is a horse of
> a different colour. The Xanax (2.0mg over 10-15 yrs)
> took 3-4 months of anxiety, etc. to get over and
> successfully withdraw from.
>
> The Klonopin on the other hand at a dose 0f 1.0mg
> has taken close to two years. It had to be suspended
> on account of a stroke/seizure incident this August,
> which left me very ill (stroke symptoms: travelling
> electric sensations in the head culminating in a
> feeling of an axe hit in the back centre head;
> consequent staggering, lack of concentration, narcolepsy,
> painful migraine like headaches, severe depression both
> physically and mentally, pin point pupils unreactive
> to light, disorientation, etc.) for a month.
>
> My husband nursed me back to 0.50mg from 0.125mg -
> that was the point of the cerebral "storm" effect;
> and then my doctor asked me to wait 6 months to see
> how it went at that dose... unfortunately i started
> getting worse, and my doctor doubled it to the
> original 1.0mg.
>
> Where I am now - reinstating to 1.0 - it has been a month;
> going up is not as hard as going down, but it certainly
> is no piece of cake - I get dyspnea upon taking the
> K dose, and I also get pains in the back of my head -
> the headaches are getting better but reminiscent of
> the areas where the "electric eels" traversed - that's
> benzo talk for electric current sensations around the head.
>
> I hope to stabilize soon. The localized, headaches in the
> back really feel like there's tumour there or something,
> but I am sure that is just subjective. I also take lithium and
> Synthroid if that is significant.
>
> I suppose I will never be able to get off this drug, and
> perhaps I should not - I have read articles that as
> an anti-convulsant it is specifically given to bipolars
> because this disorder shares certain aspects of an epileptoid
> disorder. On the other hand I have also seen it prescribed
> for GAD - so unless the two are co-concurrent I really
> don't know if they've got this right.
>
> In any case, stability seems to be the best I can hope
> for now, no matter what the pharmacopolitics.
>
> Thanks for reading. ( I tried posting before unsuccessfully
> it seems).
>
> Squiggles
Posted by Squiggles on February 11, 2002, at 14:21:19
In reply to Re: Klonopin withdrawal AND reinstatement » Squiggles, posted by JohnX2 on February 11, 2002, at 14:13:29
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm sorry to hear about your chronic pain.
> It sounds just awful.
>
> I have struggled with a really bad facial neuralgia
> for about 2 years. The symptoms were bad tension
> headaches, lock jaw, a feeling of wierd pressure
> points that would cause pain in my head if touched,
> and other issues. The only medicine that seemed to
> cure it was Klonopin. I took a pretty strong dose
> as I grew tolerant to the anti-convulsant action.
> Last month I switched medicines to Topamax which
> has basically very similar anti-convulsant actions
> as Klonopin but is not habit forming. Anyways I
> have been tapering Klonopin quite successfully
> from 6 mg to 0.75 mg in 6 weeks with the Topamax
> replacement. Topamax may not be for everybody,
> but you may want to keep it in mind.
>
> I hope you feel better.
>
> -John
>
>thank you John,
Yes I definitely will keep Topamax in mind - my
doctor said something about considering a new
med in 6 months or so - perhaps that is what
he had in mind. I really don't care about
addiction as long as tolerance is watched for,
though I suppose the side effect mount with
increasing dose. The Klonopin is a strange
drug that way - I think it took me 7 years before
I even felt anything like tolerance if that is
what it was. Whereas the XANAX is quite pronounced'
and happened much faster.I am very happy that they have a med for your
terrible symptoms - that is reason for optimism
to be sure.Squiggles
Posted by JohnX2 on February 11, 2002, at 14:28:27
In reply to Re: Klonopin withdrawal AND reinstatement, posted by Squiggles on February 11, 2002, at 14:21:19
Yes I found Topamax in the nick of time;
my pdoc told me at 6 mg the risk of my brain
becoming severly addicted to Klonopin was going
up substantially.I agree that Klonopin is one of the best benzos with respect to low probability
for addiction. I seem to have grown tolerant to
it much quicker than the average Joe. I'm glad it
has not been a problem for you. I'm very fortunate
that the tapering of Klonopin has not been as
big a nightmare as I expected.Regards,
John
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I'm sorry to hear about your chronic pain.
> > It sounds just awful.
> >
> > I have struggled with a really bad facial neuralgia
> > for about 2 years. The symptoms were bad tension
> > headaches, lock jaw, a feeling of wierd pressure
> > points that would cause pain in my head if touched,
> > and other issues. The only medicine that seemed to
> > cure it was Klonopin. I took a pretty strong dose
> > as I grew tolerant to the anti-convulsant action.
> > Last month I switched medicines to Topamax which
> > has basically very similar anti-convulsant actions
> > as Klonopin but is not habit forming. Anyways I
> > have been tapering Klonopin quite successfully
> > from 6 mg to 0.75 mg in 6 weeks with the Topamax
> > replacement. Topamax may not be for everybody,
> > but you may want to keep it in mind.
> >
> > I hope you feel better.
> >
> > -John
> >
> >
>
> thank you John,
>
> Yes I definitely will keep Topamax in mind - my
> doctor said something about considering a new
> med in 6 months or so - perhaps that is what
> he had in mind. I really don't care about
> addiction as long as tolerance is watched for,
> though I suppose the side effect mount with
> increasing dose. The Klonopin is a strange
> drug that way - I think it took me 7 years before
> I even felt anything like tolerance if that is
> what it was. Whereas the XANAX is quite pronounced'
> and happened much faster.
>
> I am very happy that they have a med for your
> terrible symptoms - that is reason for optimism
> to be sure.
>
> Squiggles
Posted by Squiggles on February 11, 2002, at 14:38:33
In reply to Re: Klonopin withdrawal AND reinstatement » Squiggles, posted by JohnX2 on February 11, 2002, at 14:28:27
>
> Yes I found Topamax in the nick of time;
> my pdoc told me at 6 mg the risk of my brain
> becoming severly addicted to Klonopin was going
> up substantially.
>
> I agree that Klonopin is one of the best benzos with respect to low probability
> for addiction. I seem to have grown tolerant to
> it much quicker than the average Joe. I'm glad it
> has not been a problem for you. I'm very fortunate
> that the tapering of Klonopin has not been as
> big a nightmare as I expected.
>
> Regards,
> John
>The tolerance business is a mystery to me
with regard to the chemical differences of
the benzos - they are one class and yet the
clonazepam is very different - I sometimes
wonder if it was not invented by some evil
genius on some rare strain of rat that he
himself cloned. BTW "clonazepam" - is that
after clonic tonic seizures? or cloned? wonder
about the etymology.And uhm, I would not say it was not a problem
for me - I think it almost killed me with
that "seizure/stroke" incident and it made
me quite sick upon withdrawal for more than
a year - we are talking 1.0 mg here.But anyway, onward and upward LOL
Squiggles
Posted by Ritch on February 13, 2002, at 9:46:46
In reply to Re: Klonopin withdrawal AND reinstatement, posted by Squiggles on February 11, 2002, at 14:38:33
> The tolerance business is a mystery to me
> with regard to the chemical differences of
> the benzos - they are one class and yet the
> clonazepam is very different - I sometimes
> wonder if it was not invented by some evil
> genius on some rare strain of rat that he
> himself cloned. BTW "clonazepam" - is that
> after clonic tonic seizures? or cloned? wonder
> about the etymology.
>
> And uhm, I would not say it was not a problem
> for me - I think it almost killed me with
> that "seizure/stroke" incident and it made
> me quite sick upon withdrawal for more than
> a year - we are talking 1.0 mg here.
>
> But anyway, onward and upward LOL
>
> Squiggles
Hi Squiggles,Just one note about clonazepam. I have noticed in the last few months (after about being mostly on it for 3 years), that it *doesn't* work worth a dang for sleep like it used to. I can *get* to sleep on it but it won't keep me asleep. The *good* part is it still works fantastic for social phobia symptoms. I can take just a 1/4 of a .5mg tab in the day (with a little Neurontin) and I feel a big difference.
Mitch
Posted by Squiggles on February 13, 2002, at 19:36:07
In reply to Re: Klonopin withdrawal AND reinstatement » Squiggles, posted by Ritch on February 13, 2002, at 9:46:46
> Hi Squiggles,
>
> Just one note about clonazepam. I have noticed in the last few months (after about being mostly on it for 3 years), that it *doesn't* work worth a dang for sleep like it used to. I can *get* to sleep on it but it won't keep me asleep. The *good* part is it still works fantastic for social phobia symptoms. I can take just a 1/4 of a .5mg tab in the day (with a little Neurontin) and I feel a big difference.
>
> Mitch
Mitch,It's potent - no doubt; as for tolerance - I am
not sure what that depends on - possibly for what
it is taken for in the first place; in my case,
and it was not spelled out, I think the theory in
vogue is, maybe was that bipolars are epileptoid;
either that or it was given for GAD - frankly
I do not know. However, I think for 5-7 years
i did not feel a difference.The thing about K, is that imho you don't feel
it getting on, but it is incredible getting off.You might need a raise in dose or another - I am
not sure if this drug is still in favour - perhaps
heavily used for epilepsy.tx
Squiggles
Posted by Ritch on February 13, 2002, at 23:25:38
In reply to Re: Klonopin withdrawal AND reinstatement, posted by Squiggles on February 13, 2002, at 19:36:07
>
>
>
>
> > Hi Squiggles,
> >
> > Just one note about clonazepam. I have noticed in the last few months (after about being mostly on it for 3 years), that it *doesn't* work worth a dang for sleep like it used to. I can *get* to sleep on it but it won't keep me asleep. The *good* part is it still works fantastic for social phobia symptoms. I can take just a 1/4 of a .5mg tab in the day (with a little Neurontin) and I feel a big difference.
> >
> > Mitch
>
>
> Mitch,
>
> It's potent - no doubt; as for tolerance - I am
> not sure what that depends on - possibly for what
> it is taken for in the first place; in my case,
> and it was not spelled out, I think the theory in
> vogue is, maybe was that bipolars are epileptoid;
> either that or it was given for GAD - frankly
> I do not know. However, I think for 5-7 years
> i did not feel a difference.
>
> The thing about K, is that imho you don't feel
> it getting on, but it is incredible getting off.
>
> You might need a raise in dose or another - I am
> not sure if this drug is still in favour - perhaps
> heavily used for epilepsy.
>
> tx
>
> SquigglesWell, all I can say is it *still* works at low-doses for SP, and that has not changed over the entire time I have taken it. I *have* noticed some muscle spasms if I miss a dose at nite (the next day), so that is something to consider I guess.
Mitch
Posted by Squiggles on February 14, 2002, at 8:12:14
In reply to Re: Klonopin withdrawal AND reinstatement » Squiggles, posted by Ritch on February 13, 2002, at 23:25:38
> MitchI've come to the cynical conclusion that that is
what matters after all :-)btw, your name appears as Ritch, but you are
Mitch in signature.Squiggles
Posted by Ritch on February 14, 2002, at 12:34:41
In reply to Re: Klonopin withdrawal AND reinstatement, posted by Squiggles on February 14, 2002, at 8:12:14
>
> > Mitch
>
> I've come to the cynical conclusion that that is
> what matters after all :-)
>
> btw, your name appears as Ritch, but you are
> Mitch in signature.
>
> Squiggles
Yep, I am "really" Mitch. But, due to ISP/email probs, etc. I am "Ritch" now. I could get it fixed, but it doesn't really matter, as long as it works now.Mitch
This is the end of the thread.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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