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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 36 to 60 of 99. Go back in thread:
Posted by fayeroe on June 12, 2009, at 18:57:36
In reply to Re: why this site can be so hurtful... » fayeroe, posted by Sigismund on June 12, 2009, at 18:22:27
> Thanks Pat
>
> I was never much of a farmer, but this does resonate with me....
>
> >There is a growing body of evidence that the people in agriculture are not coping with the pressures that they face, and the mental illness that they experience. Farm male owners and managers commit suicide at around twice the rate of the national average.Years ago Willie Nelson, John Mellencamp and Bob Dylan and Neil Young started "Farm Aid" as a resouce and fund raiser for ranchers and farmers in the U.S.
They invite big name acts and have sold out every year that the concert has been held.
After they had been in "business" for about three years Willie told me that the suicide hotline had to be expanded because one line and one crisis manager couldn't keep up with the calls. They went in and established more lines and made it easier for the people to get through to a counselor. Unfortunately they aren't able to save all of the callers but it has been a great help to many people. The callers are overwhelmingly men.
I wish someone in the private sector would establish a crisis line for the soldiers that are committing suicide in record numbers.
>
>
Posted by Phillipa on June 12, 2009, at 19:13:25
In reply to Re: why this site can be so hurtful... » Sigismund, posted by fayeroe on June 12, 2009, at 18:57:36
Pat in all seriousness my Son is working on that through traveling the USA via DAV. Helping get the soldiers the proper both medical and psychiatric help they need. Love Phillipa. He has a website through DAV. Greenville NC. I think not sure? In Washington DC a lot also.
Posted by verne on June 12, 2009, at 19:39:48
In reply to Re: why this site can be so hurtful... » fayeroe, posted by Phillipa on June 12, 2009, at 19:13:25
About ten days ago a general assembled the troops and told them suicide wasn't an option, ordering them to stop. The rate has since increased.
I'm reminded of the Bob Newhart skit on MAD TV when he plays a psychiatrist and his answer to everything is: "STOP IT!". "Just stop it!"
Sheep commit suicide and goats are neurotic and have panic attacks. When farmers started feeding sheep parts to cattle, mad cow disease broke out. When ranchers fed infected cow parts to cattle (canabalism) and humans ate the meat, the disease jumped species and infected humans. (Discovery Channel)
Phillipa, I wish your son well. The VA hospital is too far and too much a nightmare for me, so I use tricare as a fall back. VA is free but it's a slow death. Hope Obama can finally drive the fat-cat medical insurance industry out of the health care equation.
I'm really manic after more trauma with my neighbors about their barking dog. Called the police for the first time in 10 months - that hurts me more than them. 9 days sober until now.
Last night after the police talked to them, the barking got worse and I was in DESPAIR. I mean, noise (PTSD) is TORTURE for me. I'm half deaf in one ear and keep double-paned windows closed and the dog's bark still cuts right through me.
I briefly considered suicide but drank instead. Now, of course, all's quiet. So the police had some effect.
Sorry this wasn't administravtioivish. And why ain't I blocked already?
Wurm
Posted by Phillipa on June 12, 2009, at 19:55:36
In reply to Military Suicides, posted by verne on June 12, 2009, at 19:39:48
Verne we Wuv you. What happened to the move to the water? love Phillipa not that I'm there anymore either.
Posted by Sigismund on June 12, 2009, at 21:01:47
In reply to Military Suicides, posted by verne on June 12, 2009, at 19:39:48
>When farmers started feeding sheep parts to cattle, mad cow disease broke out. When ranchers fed infected cow parts to cattle (canabalism) and humans ate the meat, the disease jumped species and infected humans.
Waste not, want not, hey? Don't want any of that valuable animal protein to go to waste. All of those cow off cuts are real good stock feed. Just watch out for swine flu. You wouldn't wanna decimate the human population.
Posted by Phillipa on June 12, 2009, at 21:12:21
In reply to Military Suicides, posted by verne on June 12, 2009, at 19:39:48
OOPS works for Verterans in Modern Warfare. No not just in Greenville just hangs a shingle there. Is in Washington DC most of the week. Love Phillipa
Posted by obsidian on June 12, 2009, at 22:02:33
In reply to Re: why this site can be so hurtful..., posted by SLS on June 12, 2009, at 5:50:14
I agree.
Posted by obsidian on June 12, 2009, at 22:40:48
In reply to Military Suicides, posted by verne on June 12, 2009, at 19:39:48
what a strange thing to order. we like to think we can control a lot more things than we can.
I hope you can get some rest now. No sleep is no good when you are irritable. I turn crazy when I don't sleep.
I have just started smoking pot again. I got tired of feeling agitated. I don't recommend it by the way, but only say it because it is something I probably know I shouldn't do (just as you know you shouldn't drink).
Posted by rskontos on June 14, 2009, at 0:22:50
In reply to why this site can be so hurtful..., posted by twinleaf on June 11, 2009, at 17:41:54
, say 2006, you will see how much warmth and goodwill has been lost, and how mean-spirited and even cruel many of the exchanges here now are. Unfortunately, I think Happy is right: fair-minded people who intend to have the happiest and most fulfilled lives that they can, and who wish the same for others no longer belong here. Even worse, some of us who trusted Babble, Bob and the posters here have had horrible, stressful experiences- ones we do not have in our daily lives and shouldn't have anywhere. I am going to be very blunt: Bob is possibly a sadistic individual who damages the people he comes into contact with. I am just one of many who has been hurt by him- not the first and, sadly, probably not the last by far.
** I agree. I have been here since 2006 and the tone and level of threads, posts, tones of voice in threads/posts, has indeed changed and not for the better I am afraid. I have been hurt by things he has said and by the things he has done to others I feel for.
>
> I, and very likely others here. expected Bob to be roughly similar to therapists in our real lives whom we have chosen because they are warm, intelligent, well-trained, and able to help us live happier and more fulfilling lives. I think we are discovering, painfully, that Bob does not possess any of these qualities. He is an on-line conundrum- anonymous, unknown, cold, and at times dangerous to our well-being.
\
I find the site a safe place, or rather I once did. I once felt like I needed Babble like I did my therapy sessions. Sadly I no longer feel like it is the safest place anymore.
Posted by rskontos on June 14, 2009, at 0:28:00
In reply to Re: why this site can be so hurtful... » twinleaf, posted by rskontos on June 14, 2009, at 0:22:50
Posted by Amelia_in_StPaul on June 17, 2009, at 22:21:43
In reply to Re: why this site can be so hurtful..., posted by Tabitha on June 12, 2009, at 11:27:00
Wow, this is exactly what I was thinking. On what other board would the administrator, no owner, be expected to be warm, enthusiastic, in touch, and in a relationship with the people there? I can't think of a single other board I've been involved with that is like that. And it shouldn't be. Dr. Bob would be rolling the dough from all the bills he would send out if he were to be like a therapist to us. This is a peer support board. I am dumbfounded.
And, I don't know if people gossip or not, but wow, that would be weird. I mean, nobody here is really all that real to me. I don't use my real name. I have said things about my life, but there's no way anyone is going to figure out who I am out of the millions of people in my metro area. So I care, a lot, about people here, but there is a necessary and complete distance that separates me from anyone I am actually "talking" to. So that none of this affects my day to day life. I will leave before I let the unreality of a bulletin board become my actual reality.
> I'm baffled when folks find it hurtful that Dr Bob doesn't behave like a warm and wonderful therapist. Why should he? He's not a therapist, and that's not his role here.
>
> In life, people in authority or leadership aren't likely to be wise & warm therapist-like figures. Is your boss that way? Your accountant? Your family doctor? It's almost as odd to me as if someone reported they were emotionally damaged by the coldness of their stockbroker. If that happened, wouldn't it be time to look at your expectations and projections? So why such expectations of a research psychiatrist & website owner?
>
> I wouldn't even want Dr Bob to be such a wonderful figure. Then this place would become "the Dr Bob Show" instead of a peer group support board.
Posted by yxibow on June 18, 2009, at 12:07:00
In reply to Re: why this site can be so hurtful... » Tabitha, posted by Amelia_in_StPaul on June 17, 2009, at 22:21:43
I have had feelings of leaving the board too... I left twice for some weeks I think after blocks which I felt were truly mincing and over parsing words.
I now bend over backward to be so civil that I can't express what I really mean about certain alternative therapies, certain "faiths" which are strongly anti-psychiatry, and other matters which would at best get a f-word on your typical "underground" or site-associated place run typically with an a-hem, much better system of posting.
If you've ever looked at these web boards, usually some variant of v-bulletin or other software, they have the ability for moderators to delete posts (in a different way from here), individuals to edit or delete their own posts if they change their mind about what was said, and even add something to their original post.And also, a-hem, I know this is a research project and thus everything that someone ever said is on google, but that isn't the way most specialized boards are run. First of all crawling takes up bandwidth, and second of all privacy is wanted.
So only parts of the site ever get indexed, and they have a robots.txt file that (if crawlers follow the rules) mutes most of what is said so what someone said 5 years ago isn't still out there and can't be erased and still embarrasses the person.
And there is such a thing as not being able to respond to a "hurtful event" in 'real time'.People do have to conduct their lives off this board and its not realistic to expect an immediate return.
It may take several days to come back to the board, to find yourself blocked for 720 years.
I know of people I know that haven't gotten to my email in several weeks.
Just my 2c-- Jay
Posted by Amelia_in_StPaul on June 18, 2009, at 12:43:27
In reply to Re: why this site can be so hurtful..., posted by yxibow on June 18, 2009, at 12:07:00
You know, ironically, I experienced that in between the time I posted last and the time you posted this message. So it's time for me to take a break. Or remain doing as I have done, posting strictly about meds and alternatives and etc. The rest is not useful in my life.
> I have had feelings of leaving the board too... I left twice for some weeks I think after blocks which I felt were truly mincing and over parsing words.
Posted by SLS on June 18, 2009, at 12:50:37
In reply to Re: why this site can be so hurtful..., posted by yxibow on June 18, 2009, at 12:07:00
Hi Jay.
What's wrong with the way I am approaching things here on the threads below to try to get more people to participate in discussing the operation of the website and the rules of civility?
- Scott
Posted by SLS on June 18, 2009, at 12:53:49
In reply to Re: why this site can be so hurtful... » yxibow, posted by Amelia_in_StPaul on June 18, 2009, at 12:43:27
> You know, ironically, I experienced that in between the time I posted last and the time you posted this message. So it's time for me to take a break. Or remain doing as I have done, posting strictly about meds and alternatives and etc. The rest is not useful in my life.
>Do you have any interest in expressing your views in the threads below?
What do you find to be the most troublesome aspect of the rules of civility here?
Thanks.
- Scott
Posted by Amelia_in_StPaul on June 18, 2009, at 15:15:48
In reply to Re: why this site can be so hurtful... » Amelia_in_StPaul, posted by SLS on June 18, 2009, at 12:53:49
Hi Scott, thank you for your reply and invitation. I will think about this...gotta go for now/today. It's my birrrttthhhhday and I should get off the internetz.
> > You know, ironically, I experienced that in between the time I posted last and the time you posted this message. So it's time for me to take a break. Or remain doing as I have done, posting strictly about meds and alternatives and etc. The rest is not useful in my life.
> >
>
> Do you have any interest in expressing your views in the threads below?
>
> What do you find to be the most troublesome aspect of the rules of civility here?
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> - Scott
Posted by Phillipa on June 18, 2009, at 20:05:01
In reply to Re: why this site can be so hurtful... » SLS, posted by Amelia_in_StPaul on June 18, 2009, at 15:15:48
Happy Birthday Amelia hope it's a good one!!!!! Love Phillipa
Posted by Dr. Bob on June 25, 2009, at 12:23:20
In reply to Blocked » BabyToes, posted by Deputy Dinah on June 11, 2009, at 19:48:21
> I am leaving it to him to set block length, or reverse the block if he sees fit.
>
> Deputy DinahAccording to the formula:
duration of previous block: 14 weeks
period of time since previous block: 1 week
severity: 2 (default) + 1 (uncivil toward particular group) = 3
block length = 41 weeks> I remember that as an abused child, I wanted my mom to change, and I kept thinking she would see the light and do that. But I left home and will never come back because I have my own home now, a much safer place that doesn't have to wait for "slow change" or to "be the change you wish to see" because it isn't dysfunctional as this site. Dr. Bob is in the darkness of himself, you can't change him. I couldn't change my mom.
>
> BabyToesYour experience here sounds like your experience at home as a child. As if I were Dr. Mom. I hope you can free yourself from this chain of rigid authority figures,
Bob
Posted by Dr. Bob on June 25, 2009, at 14:15:51
In reply to Re: why this site can be so hurtful..., posted by yxibow on June 18, 2009, at 12:07:00
> I now bend over backward to be so civil that I can't express what I really mean about certain alternative therapies, certain "faiths" which are strongly anti-psychiatry, and other matters
Thanks for making civility a priority. I know it can mean limiting your freedom of speech.
> If you've ever looked at these [other] web boards, usually some variant of v-bulletin or other software, they have the ability for moderators to delete posts (in a different way from here), individuals to edit or delete their own posts if they change their mind about what was said, and even add something to their original post.
FYI, I've been thinking (again) about moving to different software. But it would be a huge project, and change is slow. So don't hold your breath.
> And also, a-hem, I know this is a research project and thus everything that someone ever said is on google, but that isn't the way most specialized boards are run. First of all crawling takes up bandwidth, and second of all privacy is wanted.
Just to clarify, this site isn't currently considered research. Also, bandwidth isn't an issue. Please do remember how private this is:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#privacy
Bob
Posted by yxibow on June 25, 2009, at 18:38:57
In reply to Re: block length » BabyToes, posted by Dr. Bob on June 25, 2009, at 12:23:20
> > I am leaving it to him to set block length, or reverse the block if he sees fit.
> >
> > Deputy Dinah
>
> According to the formula:
>
> duration of previous block: 14 weeks
> period of time since previous block: 1 week
> severity: 2 (default) + 1 (uncivil toward particular group) = 3
> block length = 41 weeks
I do still have the freedom to say, Dr. Bob, that's ridiculous. 80% of a year? Why not just then say never come back, because that's exactly what it is.I will put my neck out and say that no individual is going to care about the board any more if they can't post in this lifetime.
-- Jay
Posted by Dr. Bob on June 26, 2009, at 8:30:42
In reply to Re: block length » Dr. Bob, posted by yxibow on June 25, 2009, at 18:38:57
> I do still have the freedom to say, Dr. Bob, that's ridiculous. 80% of a year? Why not just then say never come back, because that's exactly what it is.
IMO, there's a big difference between 41 weeks, or even a year, and forever. No one's blocked forever here. After a block, a Babbler's always welcome back.
Bob
Posted by twinleaf on June 26, 2009, at 14:34:15
In reply to Re: block length, posted by Dr. Bob on June 26, 2009, at 8:30:42
I am very sad to see the length of the block you have given to Happyflower- and right in the middle of an extensive and thoughtful discussion (below) about the destructive effects of long blocks, the desirability of either no or very short blocks, and even more, the importance of giving posters an opportunity to work out their differences. Happyflower has been such an asset here, but she did not receive any of the benefit of our community's expressed feelings about what would be best for everyone. I am extremely disappointed in you. Bob. You expressed a formulaic statement about hoping she would overcome her traumatic childhood with her abusive mother, but you seem to have unwittingly put yourself "in loco parentis"- YOU are now rejecting and hurting her. If you think she can return after these long blocks, and feel as she once did- free to share her feelings, to trust others, and to work with others towards understanding herself and helping others understand themselves. you are mistaken. These long blocks have traumatized her, not, hopefully, for everywhere, but almost certainly definitely and permanently for Psychobabble. Why do such a destructive thing?
An addendum: calculus is easy for me, but I have never been able to figure our how you do the arithmetic for the blocks you give out.
Posted by gobbledygook on June 26, 2009, at 16:52:27
In reply to Re: block length, posted by twinleaf on June 26, 2009, at 14:34:15
(((Twinleaf)))
Please PM me when you have some time.
It would be very helpful for me to process...with you.Thinking of you,
Ava
Posted by Zeba on June 27, 2009, at 0:25:13
In reply to Re: block length » BabyToes, posted by Dr. Bob on June 25, 2009, at 12:23:20
Anything more than 30 days is grossly excessive and punitive. This is why I and others view Babble as hurtful and not at all helpful. Before blocks were subjective, and that almost seems preferable to what is now. No one ever got blocked for such long periods of time. This seems to fit the definition of "cruel and unusual punishment." I am wondering when the "death penalty" kicks in.
Posted by Deneb on June 27, 2009, at 0:32:00
In reply to Re: block length » Dr. Bob, posted by Zeba on June 27, 2009, at 0:25:13
I think the formula for determining blocks now is much better than the rule before. Before your block was doubled, no matter how long you've been good. So lets say you got a block of 4 weeks before and you were civil for 3 years before making a mistake and being uncivil, your block would be 8 weeks.
Now the formula takes into consideration how long you've been without a block so you can bring your block length down to one week again after you've been good for a certain amount of time which depends on how long your block was previously.
This new system rewards people for being civil, unlike the last system. I like this one a lot better.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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