![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 17 to 41 of 66. Go back in thread:
Posted by Jeroen on March 18, 2018, at 15:48:34
In reply to Re: To Ed_Uk - tried every atypical anti psychotic » Jeroen, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 18, 2018, at 14:51:01
since i started taking nobiten, a beta blocker for sinus tachyardia
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 18, 2018, at 16:04:30
In reply to Re: To Ed_Uk - tried every atypical anti psychotic, posted by Jeroen on March 18, 2018, at 15:48:34
>since i started taking nobiten, a beta blocker for sinus tachycardia
Oh I see. That should be easy to solve then! As well as being a beta blocker, nebivolol (Nobiten) dilates blood vessels. This can cause dizziness which makes it more difficult to walk.
You could ask your doctor to stop nebivolol and switch to atenolol. Atenolol does not normally cause dizziness. The usual dose starting dose for sinus tachycardia is 25mg in the morning. This can be increased to 50mg if necessary.
Atenolol is an older beta blocker but it's a good one for sinus tachycardia because the side effects are usually mild.
If atenolol doesn't suit you either, there are other options, so don't worry.
Posted by Jeroen on March 18, 2018, at 17:05:57
In reply to Re: To Ed_Uk - tried every atypical anti psychotic » Jeroen, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 18, 2018, at 16:04:30
how to switch beta blocker? do i have to take 2 at the same time because i tried to cut down on this dangerous med once 1/4 a pill and 2 days later i almost got a heart attack
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 18, 2018, at 17:07:53
In reply to Re: To Ed_Uk - how to switch beta blocker?, posted by Jeroen on March 18, 2018, at 17:05:57
> how to switch beta blocker? do i have to take 2 at the same time because i tried to cut down on this dangerous med once 1/4 a pill and 2 days later i almost got a heart attack
What dose of nebivolol are you on?
Posted by Jeroen on March 18, 2018, at 17:13:30
In reply to Re: To Ed_Uk - how to switch beta blocker? » Jeroen, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 18, 2018, at 17:07:53
half a pill of 5 mg
it caused headaches for months too and other side effects
Posted by Jeroen on March 18, 2018, at 17:13:57
In reply to Re: To Ed_Uk - how to switch beta blocker?, posted by Jeroen on March 18, 2018, at 17:13:30
the headaches part is better now
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 18, 2018, at 17:23:23
In reply to Re: To Ed_Uk - how to switch beta blocker?, posted by Jeroen on March 18, 2018, at 17:13:57
>the headaches
Nebivolol is a bit unusual. The headache and dizziness are due to blood vessel dilation, not because it's a beta blocker.
Because you're on a low dose, you should be able to switch straight to atenolol 25mg the next day. It's worth asking your doc.
Nebivolol is a slightly unusual choice for sinus tachycardia, because the additional blood vessel dilation reduces blood pressure. It is more often used for high blood pressure. A more standard beta blocker is usually chosen for sinus tachycardia, unless you have high blood pressure too.
Posted by Jeroen on March 18, 2018, at 17:44:05
In reply to Re: To Ed_Uk - how to switch beta blocker? » Jeroen, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 18, 2018, at 17:23:23
no my BP is normal for years i think, never problem with it
Posted by Jeroen on March 18, 2018, at 17:45:41
In reply to Re: To Ed_Uk - how to switch beta blocker? » Jeroen, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 18, 2018, at 17:23:23
thanks Ed, i appreciate this. How are you holding up these days?
Posted by Jeroen on March 19, 2018, at 8:54:28
In reply to Re: To Ed_Uk - how to switch beta blocker? » Jeroen, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 18, 2018, at 17:23:23
Hi Ed, my lyme test came back negative :)
but i do know now that my depression is caused by brain inflammation or some sort and not lymes
Do you know more about this?
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 19, 2018, at 12:58:31
In reply to Re: To Ed_Uk - how to switch beta blocker?, posted by Jeroen on March 19, 2018, at 8:54:28
Hi J,
That's good news. Since your potential exposure was a long time ago and your antibody test is negative, that should rule out Lyme disease - particularly because you live in a part of the world where it is rare.
>but i do know now that my depression is caused by brain inflammation
Have you been doing some reading about depression? It's a difficult one to answer because there are many types and causes of depression. Some people with depression have been found to have higher levels of inflammatory markers in the blood.
Posted by bleauberry on March 22, 2018, at 6:44:27
In reply to Re: bleauberry - had my blood drawn today, posted by Jeroen on March 13, 2018, at 8:11:06
> Re: bleauberry - had my blood drawn today
I hope it shows something useful. The tests are about as accurate as flipping a coin. We get lucky sometimes.
But you already know what is going on. The test won't tell you anything you don't already know.
Doxy is a good med but for suspected infection issues it needs to be dosed at 400mg instead of 200mg. That's because 400mg gets into the brain but 200mg doesn't. It's also because Doxy at 200mg doesn't outright kill the organisms, it weakens them so that they naturally die or your immune system has a shot at them. But 400mg outright kills them.
As you know, the Herxing can be vicious and terrifying. I have experienced what you described and it is indeed scary. It's the closest I have ever felt to being truly insane. It's absolutely stunning how the debris of bacterial death in your system can wreak such havoc on the brain. So low and slow is a good way to start.
It also is a clear indication to critics and nonbelievers that chronic infection is directly related to psychiatry. In my opinion, there is no other primary cause of psychiatric symptoms. It is the main one. Unsuspected stealth infections. There are bacteria from ticks and cats and mice. Various viruses. Fungi, mold and yeasts. All of these can set up shop in the body and wreak absolute havoc on the brain with their enzymes, excretions, and holes they drill into human tissue, including the brain.
Posted by Jeroen on March 22, 2018, at 6:52:39
In reply to Re: bleauberry - had my blood drawn today » Jeroen, posted by bleauberry on March 22, 2018, at 6:44:27
i know whats going on its an infection in my brain
What treatment options are safe with my meds?
Posted by bleauberry on March 22, 2018, at 8:06:23
In reply to To Bleauberry, posted by Jeroen on March 22, 2018, at 6:52:39
> i know whats going on its an infection in my brain
>
> What treatment options are safe with my meds?I would just ask the doc if there are any drug-drug reactions with your meds that you should watch out for. My guess is likely none of any significance. But ask just to be sure.
Posted by Jeroen on March 22, 2018, at 9:00:29
In reply to Re: To Bleauberry » Jeroen, posted by bleauberry on March 22, 2018, at 8:06:23
Should i ask for doxycycline then even if i tested negative for lymes i know minocycline 50 mg works but i do not tolerate it anymore i get dangerous life treathening herx on it, that you would describe insanity, im so sad bleauberry.
Posted by Phillipa on March 22, 2018, at 9:05:42
In reply to Re: To Bleauberry, posted by Jeroen on March 22, 2018, at 9:00:29
Jeroen, no you are not insane. I know you and talk to you all the time. Phillipa
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 22, 2018, at 12:05:43
In reply to Re: bleauberry - had my blood drawn today » Jeroen, posted by bleauberry on March 22, 2018, at 6:44:27
>But you already know what is going on.
Except that we don't actually know. Mental health is a complex area with many possible causes and contributing factors. To suggest that we really do know is a major assumption. I'm not saying the doctors don't make assumptions too, because they do.
>The test won't tell you anything you don't already know.
It shifts the probability away from Lyme, and hence towards something else. Lyme isn't as common in these parts of Europe as is it in the US. J believed he might have had an exposure many years ago. It seems improbable that antibodies would not have been produced by now, if it was still present. Also, physical symptoms would be expected.
In terms of latent infection, other agents such as Toxoplasma are far more common in Europe. Although usually asymptomatic, possible links between Toxoplasma and mental health are interesting and worthy of further investigation.
Interestingly, doxycycline is one of the antibiotics with anti-toxoplasma activity. Although chronic latent infection is very hard to eradicate.
>As you know, the Herxing can be vicious and terrifying. I have experienced what you described and it is indeed scary.
I think it's important to be cautious RE assumptions that we have experienced what others have experienced, especially when it's not clear what they have experienced.
Although the term Herxheimer reaction is now used by some people to describe almost anything that happens after taking an antibiotic, I think this is confusing. I don't think it's fair to assume that panic symptoms in the absence of typical physical symptoms such as fever represent a Herxheimer reaction (endotoxin release syndrome).
Anyway, with respect to the possibility of latent infection (and it is a possibility not a fact), I think it would be useful for J to look away from Borrelia and towards organisms such as Toxoplasma which are more common here.
Studies have reported that individuals diagnosed with schizophrenia, compared to controls, have a higher prevalence of antibodies to Toxoplasma. Although this is an association rather than proof, I do think it's very interesting, especially since Toxoplasma is so prevalent in cats here.
Posted by Jeroen on March 22, 2018, at 12:17:48
In reply to Re: bleauberry, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 22, 2018, at 12:05:43
and i saw it, i also as you know love cats as i had several.
how can I get a test for Toxoplasma?
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 22, 2018, at 12:35:35
In reply to To Ed_Uk - my cat had a tick last weekend, posted by Jeroen on March 22, 2018, at 12:17:48
>how can I get a test for Toxoplasma?
Hi J.
Toxoplasmosis is a very common infection in Europe, especially in people who have cats. A large proportion of cats have it, and it comes out in the cat poo.
Usually, toxoplasmosis does not cause any symptoms in humans, unless they have a weak immune system or are pregnant. Sometimes, it cases symptoms like the flu.
Some people think there is a link between toxoplasma and the development of psychosis. This is an area of current research.
It is quite likely that you have been infected at some point because it's so common, but that doesn't mean it is the cause of any of your problems. It is just one possibility.
Doctors usually only test for toxoplasmosis in people with immune system suppression (eg. Advanced HIV infection). Occasionally, pregnant women are tested if they are at risk. The test uses a small blood sample to test for two different types of antibodies.
You could certainly ask your doctor about it, especially as you've had many cats, but I'm not sure what they'd say.
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 22, 2018, at 12:38:59
In reply to Re: To Bleauberry, posted by Jeroen on March 22, 2018, at 9:00:29
>Should i ask for doxycycline then even if i tested negative for lymes i know minocycline 50 mg works but i do not tolerate it anymore
Minocycline is an interesting antibiotic because there is some evidence that it can be helpful in schizophrenia, usually in combination with antipsychotics. This may or may not be related to its antimicrobial effects. Minocycline is believed to have an anti-inflammatory action.
Unlike minocycline, doxycycline hasn't been studied in people with schizophrenia, although it is a closely related drug.
When you tried minocycline before, where did you get it from?
Posted by Jeroen on March 22, 2018, at 12:40:37
In reply to Re: To Ed_Uk - my cat had a tick last weekend, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 22, 2018, at 12:35:35
This is getting stranger and stranger ive had many cats, could this be really be Ed?
It is possible...
Posted by Jeroen on March 22, 2018, at 12:42:26
In reply to Re: To Bleauberry, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 22, 2018, at 12:38:59
My psychiatrist prescribed it to me and it worked i only took 3 doses got a bad reaction but the cure for psychosis lasted 2 weeks i felt normaly for 2 weeks witouth even taking it daily!
Posted by Jeroen on March 22, 2018, at 12:48:59
In reply to To Ed_Uk Minocycline, posted by Jeroen on March 22, 2018, at 12:42:26
All paranoid beliefs, delusion, hallucinations, depression, traumas was eliminated from my CNS with only taking 3 doses of minocycline 50 mg.
In other words i was cured.
Posted by SLS on March 22, 2018, at 14:30:46
In reply to To Ed_Uk Minocycline, posted by Jeroen on March 22, 2018, at 12:42:26
> My psychiatrist prescribed it to me and it worked i only took 3 doses got a bad reaction but the cure for psychosis lasted 2 weeks i felt normaly for 2 weeks witouth even taking it daily!
That's interesting.
Unlike doxycycline, minocycline has robust anti-inflammatory effects in the brain. I am guessing that's why it helped me with bipolar depression. I had to discontinue it after two years, though. I began to show dark spots on my feet and shins (hyperpigmentation). Some mental illnesses are associated with brain inflammation, including depression, bipolar disorder, and schizophrenia. I am not saying that minocycline works by reducing brain inflammation, but it is a possibility.
- Scott
Posted by SLS on March 22, 2018, at 15:08:28
In reply to Re: To Ed_Uk Minocycline, posted by SLS on March 22, 2018, at 14:30:46
> > My psychiatrist prescribed it to me and it worked i only took 3 doses got a bad reaction but the cure for psychosis lasted 2 weeks i felt normaly for 2 weeks witouth even taking it daily!
>
> That's interesting.
>
> Unlike doxycycline, minocycline has robust anti-inflammatory effects in the brain. I am guessing that's why it helped me with bipolar depression. I had to discontinue it after two years, though. I began to show dark spots on my feet and shins (hyperpigmentation). Some mental illnesses are associated with brain inflammation, including depression, bipolar disorder, and schizophrenia. I am not saying that minocycline works by reducing brain inflammation, but it is a possibility.Minocycline also reduces or modulates glutamate activity. This might be even or important for treating schizophrenia.
- Scott
Go forward in thread:
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.