![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 6591 to 6615 of 10407. Go back in thread:
Posted by Draisy on March 23, 2004, at 1:32:01
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin to Buspar » Draisy, posted by Spinxxie on March 22, 2004, at 15:46:39
hey, thanks for the 2 cents :)
dr. put me on celexa. said buspar isn't all that effective for most people. i guess you're not most people on buspar like i'm not most people on wellbutrin. here goes round 2....
> I am on Effexor and Buspar.. the combo is good, my anxiety is way down, but my memory isn't as good as it was.. dang side effects.. but it is a good combination.. no sedating qualities, and I do generally sleep better then I did before. I have gained some weight.. but I think it is because I was depressed.. not the meds... I have to admit.. I am amazed how quickly the Effexor is working so quickly and well.. though.. still getting hot flashes..argh... anyhoo.. just my two cents.. tx Spinxxie
Posted by KennyBingo on March 23, 2004, at 11:31:41
In reply to Effexor Newbie, posted by ljfordrbob on March 18, 2004, at 17:16:25
For Beta, ljfordrbob, PoohBear, et al.:
I was struck by lj's post, finding numerous biographical parallels. I too am now slipping into mid-adulthood. Life changes (eg divorce, grad school) brought about crushing and enveloping depressive episodes not felt since adolescence. I don't believe it's an overstatement to say that Effexor, combined with smart choices and a good therapist, has been a lifesaver.
So for those discouraged by weightgain, among other unsavory side-effects (you can ditto everything in PoohBear's report about side-effects for me)and the hazards of tapering off, take heart. It is not always simply a chemical cross to bear.
True, I did gain a little weight once starting Effexor. It has given me a heretofore never experienced craving for chocolate, of all things. But changing my eating habits a bit and exercise have made this manageable. Plus, I think a lot of it is simply water retention. (Yes, guys get this too.)
True, the initial technicolor dreams and hypo-mania were a little exhausting. But they have subsided. Exercise has helped counter this as well.
True, there are still episodes of downward, blue moods occasionally. But I am able to "bracket" these with the knowledge that they are transient, under my control, and that they will soon pass. Effexor's no auto-happy panacea, but it is one hell of a shot in the arm. I no longer drown.
Hope my response is somehow useful to some of you. Good luck for all those just starting and just ending their treatment.
K
Posted by kp2sushi on March 23, 2004, at 18:13:01
In reply to Re: STAY OFF EFFEXOR IF YOU CAN, posted by romeyjuju on March 20, 2004, at 17:27:05
A few words of wisdom:
A) You don't know if Effexor will be a good or bad match until the subject ingests it. Your anecdotal evidence will not apply to everyone.B) Unproven and poorly understood "herbal" supplements are not going to be your magic bullet.
C) GABA is not an amino acid, it is a neurotransmitter. Unfortunately, it does not cross the blood brain barrier. Instead it is metabolized to PABA (yes, the PABA that every suncreen proudly announces it does not contain), which then crosses the blood brain barrier and is then converted to GABA as needed. GABA is essentially useless.
D) The Omega acids are your best bet, but look for small scale, long term improvement.
E) With this cocktail, it will be unlikely you will be able to eludicate a single agent that is causing improvement.
Posted by realblonde48 on March 24, 2004, at 16:43:14
In reply to To Realblonde re: weight gain, posted by Emma Smith on March 21, 2004, at 15:01:12
> Hi,
>
> I agree with you that the weight gain is most depressing. So sad that this has to be one of the "side effects."
>
> When I lost weight in the beginning, I thought "Yes!!! I must be one of the lucky ones who won't gain!" I didn't expect to lose weight, but I was hoping that eating right and exercising would help me maintain. Ugh.
>
> Can you tell me a bit more about your weaning strategy? This week I decided to take my 75mg dose every other day. Didn't really bother me that much. However, my body knew when it needed the next dose. Should I stay here for awhile? Or should I go every 3rd day? Or should I cut back the dose every other day? Of course the doctor would rather I wait a couple of more months. But, I feel my stressors and triggers are gone right now and I'd like to try and "handle" it.
>
> Any suggestions? I, too, would love to hear from others who took off the weight after discontinuing the Effexor. Good luck to you!
I am not the one to ask about weaning. I am a person who wants it to happen right now! The dr. said to take the lower dosage for a week, then every other day for a week and then every two days. By then, I should be off of it. Instead, I keep cutting it in half each week. I started out with the 37.5 pill and this week I am splitting that dosage into fourths. I am not a doctor and can't recommend this. So far, it's working for me. Last week I went for two days without and had the "brain shocks". I decided to slow down a little and break it into smaller dosages. I keep hoping the pounds will melt off as fast as they seemed to come on. I too, was on this about four months before I really noticed the weight gain. What made it really bad was that I joined a health club in November and had been going three days a week when the pounds started to pile on. It just didn't make sense.Let me know how you are doing. What makes it difficult for me is that I am in the mental health profession and just wanted something to help with the moods that come with work and everyday stressors. I was not a "depressed" person. I should have taken my own advice and sought counseling before starting any kind of medication!!!!
Posted by ritchie4 on March 25, 2004, at 9:44:23
In reply to Re: To Realblonde re: weight gain, posted by realblonde48 on March 24, 2004, at 16:43:14
just started at 37.5 7 days now at 75 at 9 days noticed sweating and yawning but have come back down to earth from the effects of my trauma and seem to be couping i have noticed a drop in labido though and am concerned will this be tempory wasnt speeping much for several days now im getting a bit better dr. was going to presribe sleeping pills but i expressed a need for something quick acting for the anxiety so he went with lorazepam instead i have only taken it at nite and not reqularary this is my first experience with this sort of thing i thought i was experiencing anxiety attacks doc say i am depressed situationally. this will help me deal with the situation and function
Posted by Hez on March 25, 2004, at 16:28:27
In reply to 10 days and sexual side effects ?, posted by ritchie4 on March 25, 2004, at 9:44:23
Well, I have read just about every post on this site (I have lot's of time on my hands at work) and its definitely interesting.
I started taking Effexor XR yesterday. I have been moderate to severely depressed for about 6 months and just going further and further down. I lost me, I lost my boyfriend (only temporarily I hope!) and I needed to do something. I am on the 37.5mg dose for 7 days and then if my side effects lessen or disappear I can bump myself to the 75mg a day.
A small dose, yes, but OMG! Yesterday at work was the first day in a long time I was actually productive before 2pm! I felt like I was on speed and not in a bad way! I felt manic is what I felt.
Anyway, I passed out at about 9pm and woke up to pee and I felt like I had been sleeping for hours and it had only been two. Then I went right back to sleep and slept straight thru to 5:30am (which is early for me).
My appetite is so surpressed that I can barely tell that I am hungry. Some things taste weird and I have a metallic taste in my mouth as well as my teeth and tongue feeling numb-ish...like when you get a buzz from drinking a beer.
I just hope I don't gain weight...but thank god that I am on Effexor because if I wasn't and I was reading all those posts about huge weight gains I would've had a panic attack!
At any rate, I feel better. I love that it is calming my mild OCD tendencies and my craving for ciggies. I can't believe that this drug would work that fast but dang! Reading everyone's contrubutions has been really informative. Thanks a lot..I'll be lurking!
Best,
Hez
Posted by Emma Smith on March 25, 2004, at 20:27:30
In reply to Re: To Realblonde re: weight gain, posted by realblonde48 on March 24, 2004, at 16:43:14
Hello,
Thanks for a "run-down" on how you are handling the tapering off. From what I have read here (and other places) it is the concensus to slowly wean as you are. I hope to follow suit.
I've been taking 37.5 every 3rd day now. (It has only been a week, but feels like it has been longer, for sure!) By the time my "dose" comes due, I'm quite dizzy....my brain seems to lag.... and I'm a bit irritable. I can get through the others, but the irritability is what gets me. With a 3 and 1 year old, irritability isn't good. Luckily my husband is in tune with it and knows when to make me take a break! :)
I'm going to keep at this level for awhile, I guess. I'm not feeling any depression or anxiety, so that is good.
I, too, hope the weight starts coming off. I'm not afraid to work at it. It's just frustrating to work at it and see the scale go up and clothes get tighter!! :) Good luck to you, keep us posted.
Posted by Neelix on March 25, 2004, at 22:15:28
In reply to Wanting to quit, posted by PixieEm on February 16, 2004, at 13:31:42
Hey Emily, As I understand there is a list of so called dangerous drugs either in a class action lawsuit or slated for one. The web page to go to is: www.gilmanpastor.com. They have a whole list of drugs and what can be done to protect your rights. N
Posted by muggins on March 26, 2004, at 0:31:03
In reply to Re: Effexor newbies, posted by KennyBingo on March 23, 2004, at 11:31:41
hi guys.....brilliant to read posts and know all in the same boat....started 37.5mg for a week and zoloft (trying to get off zoloft)then 75mg effexor only.....total shock.....boyfriend of over a year dumped me in the middle of my personal hell.....was not at all expected.....now having problems figuring out what is heartbreak and what is new meds. boyf got new stressful job, shifts, mum died all in the sapce of a month and I wobbled as well. all too much for the poor manam also on anti anxiety pills for when i need (alzam)....someone here suggested getting something to counteract the anxiety side effects (i dont usually have anxiety)...now 3 weeks into 75mg and saw pDoc yesterday.......suicide trailer in my head, but have a beautiful 4 year old daughter (single mum) who i could not bear to leave...pDoc suggested clinic yesterday....but that wold be admitting defeat....am now going up to 150mg today....you can get homeopathic pills for water retention, will buy, eating like a bird but feel fat (am 60kgs)...will have to hit the gym........thanks guys....make me feel sane !
> For Beta, ljfordrbob, PoohBear, et al.:
>
> I was struck by lj's post, finding numerous biographical parallels. I too am now slipping into mid-adulthood. Life changes (eg divorce, grad school) brought about crushing and enveloping depressive episodes not felt since adolescence. I don't believe it's an overstatement to say that Effexor, combined with smart choices and a good therapist, has been a lifesaver.
>
> So for those discouraged by weightgain, among other unsavory side-effects (you can ditto everything in PoohBear's report about side-effects for me)and the hazards of tapering off, take heart. It is not always simply a chemical cross to bear.
>
> True, I did gain a little weight once starting Effexor. It has given me a heretofore never experienced craving for chocolate, of all things. But changing my eating habits a bit and exercise have made this manageable. Plus, I think a lot of it is simply water retention. (Yes, guys get this too.)
>
> True, the initial technicolor dreams and hypo-mania were a little exhausting. But they have subsided. Exercise has helped counter this as well.
>
> True, there are still episodes of downward, blue moods occasionally. But I am able to "bracket" these with the knowledge that they are transient, under my control, and that they will soon pass. Effexor's no auto-happy panacea, but it is one hell of a shot in the arm. I no longer drown.
>
> Hope my response is somehow useful to some of you. Good luck for all those just starting and just ending their treatment.
>
> K
Posted by DirtyLowDown4 on March 26, 2004, at 8:31:44
In reply to My first time on anything ever!, posted by Hez on March 25, 2004, at 16:28:27
It is truly remarkable that you would get such positive results so quickly. I think your positive attitude helps. The drug will not work unless you have confidence that it will work. Most drugs have a plesibo effect based on a patient's attitude. It usually takes up to 8 weeks to get the full effect. If you are happy with the results you might want to hold off on upping your dosage. The side effects may change with increased dosage. Women on this medication generally report loss of labido and anorgasmia. You might want to consider that possibility when increasing your dosage. I started out at 37.5 and increased to 75 mg and then increased to 150 mg. I did not like how I felt at 150 and backed it down to 75 mg and feel pretty good and will stay at 75 mg unless I start feeling low again. This is just a suggestion so take it for what it's worth. You have to decide what's best for you. Good luck for this med!
> Well, I have read just about every post on this site (I have lot's of time on my hands at work) and its definitely interesting.
>
> I started taking Effexor XR yesterday. I have been moderate to severely depressed for about 6 months and just going further and further down. I lost me, I lost my boyfriend (only temporarily I hope!) and I needed to do something. I am on the 37.5mg dose for 7 days and then if my side effects lessen or disappear I can bump myself to the 75mg a day.
>
> A small dose, yes, but OMG! Yesterday at work was the first day in a long time I was actually productive before 2pm! I felt like I was on speed and not in a bad way! I felt manic is what I felt.
>
> Anyway, I passed out at about 9pm and woke up to pee and I felt like I had been sleeping for hours and it had only been two. Then I went right back to sleep and slept straight thru to 5:30am (which is early for me).
>
> My appetite is so surpressed that I can barely tell that I am hungry. Some things taste weird and I have a metallic taste in my mouth as well as my teeth and tongue feeling numb-ish...like when you get a buzz from drinking a beer.
>
> I just hope I don't gain weight...but thank god that I am on Effexor because if I wasn't and I was reading all those posts about huge weight gains I would've had a panic attack!
>
> At any rate, I feel better. I love that it is calming my mild OCD tendencies and my craving for ciggies. I can't believe that this drug would work that fast but dang! Reading everyone's contrubutions has been really informative. Thanks a lot..I'll be lurking!
>
> Best,
> Hez
Posted by realblonde48 on March 26, 2004, at 11:29:29
In reply to Re: Effexor newbies, posted by muggins on March 26, 2004, at 0:31:03
After reading your post, I hope you take the advice of the doctor and seek some help with all of the other "baggage" you are having to deal with. Don't be afraid to ask someone for help. You are right in that your four year old needs you more than you will ever know. Suicide is not even an option. As a mother and a counselor, there are alternatives. Give your self time but also keep a support network open.
Posted by Davez on March 26, 2004, at 20:27:31
In reply to Re: sexual side effect- effexor-xr, posted by jal on September 13, 2002, at 14:53:11
I'm on 75mg dose right now and have what I could explain as an increase in sexual stamina (staying power so to speak). It does sort of feel like a numbness in a way but I can get past it to climax. I looked on the NET and they say "abnormal ejaculation" is a side effect. That sounds to me like cats and dogs shooting out of your penis or something weird like that. I have heard from others that Prozac and other similar drugs can prevent a person from climaxing. I found that I just require faster sex to get off and that slower sex will last all night. I would think though if I went up to 225mgs I might not be able to climax at all. I would talk to your doctor about it and maybe you could switch to another brand. That sometimes works.
> I've been on effexor xr for the past 4 months, went from 37.5mgs up to 225mgs now and the only thing I feel is numbness in my penis and my sex drive is way down from where it was before effexor xr.Is this common for men to feel this?
> Any men out there have the same numbness down there? Whats the cure ? Help my girlfriend thinks its her but I'm telling her its my meds.
Posted by scullycat on March 27, 2004, at 1:43:21
In reply to My first time on anything ever!, posted by Hez on March 25, 2004, at 16:28:27
It is "my first time on anything ever" (at the 4 week mark) although it should have probably happened a long time ago. I can't believe that I went from completely bawling my eyes out hysterically every single day for 2 years to not at all beginning with the first dose. I'm only taking the 75mg and I feel like I'm actually able to get through the day and communicate with my poor husband without having my emotions constantly running over the top. I can actually talk about things and not freak out. Nice for him. Nice for me.
I do seem to have a lot of side effects that I'm still hoping will go away. Nausea, the metal taste thing (glad to hear I'm not the only one using that description), the constant sweating and chills, fatigue and the headache that just won't go away. But I can deal with that 'cause I feel so much better.
I'm also having some concerns about my eyesight that I noticed only last week (I am not able to read some things that I could very recently). I know that I am a candidate for narrow angle glaucoma, and I have vision in only one eye so I'm a bit concerned after reading the FDA report of possible side effects. Of course I will see my opthamologist, but I'm wondering if anyone experienced this type of thing or read info about it anywhere else other than the effexor web site?
Thanx!
Posted by pekostar on March 27, 2004, at 18:36:40
In reply to I'm getting off Effexor (if I can) READ!!!, posted by kataklysm on January 18, 2003, at 5:32:11
I have been on medication for years, also for anxiety. Effexor really worked for me....but I gained weight and its time to see if I can handle life without it. I weened myself off of it. (over a months time) And even then it has some terrible withdrawls. HORRIBLE. I am finding now that I am emotional but i am determined to get though this. Has anyone else succeeded in becoming drug free? Did you lose weight? Did you end up on something else?
Posted by Davez on March 28, 2004, at 10:12:29
In reply to Re: I'm getting off Effexor (if I can) READ!!! » kataklysm, posted by pekostar on March 27, 2004, at 18:36:40
I quit smoking a year ago and that was pure hell. Felt like someone was jumping on my chest. I couldn't imagine Effexor withdrawl could compare. I hope not because I just started taking it.
> I have been on medication for years, also for anxiety. Effexor really worked for me....but I gained weight and its time to see if I can handle life without it. I weened myself off of it. (over a months time) And even then it has some terrible withdrawls. HORRIBLE. I am finding now that I am emotional but i am determined to get though this. Has anyone else succeeded in becoming drug free? Did you lose weight? Did you end up on something else?
>
>
>
Posted by mary rose on March 28, 2004, at 20:51:35
In reply to Anyone had success on Effexor XR? , posted by jp on October 24, 1999, at 14:59:14
I like Effexor XR alot. I've been on it since they introduced the XR and it helps me to concentrate, gives me energy and puts me in a better mood.
However, it doesn't help anxiety like Paxil does. I was taking both and they worked great together except I had to stop taking Paxil due to the excessive weight gain.
How does Buspar work for anxiety? Maybe the two together would be a good combination.
Posted by mary rose on March 28, 2004, at 21:01:42
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin to Buspar, posted by Draisy on March 21, 2004, at 23:15:09
Paxil is the anti depressant that causes the most weight gain of any of the anti-depressants.
I had to get off it because I just kept gaining more and more weight on it.
I haven't tried Buspar yet, but am going to ask my doctor for it next time I see her.
Posted by PoohBear on March 29, 2004, at 9:31:13
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin to Buspar, posted by mary rose on March 28, 2004, at 21:01:42
> Paxil is the anti depressant that causes the most weight gain of any of the anti-depressants.
Actually, I would disagree with this statement...From personal experience I can tell you that Remeron caused me to gain 12 pounds in two weeks... It gave me the best sleep I've ever had, but the weight gain issue made me drop it and go to Seroquel instead.
Tony
150mg Effexor XR
20mg Adderall XR
100mg Seroquel
Posted by DirtyLowDown4 on March 29, 2004, at 9:50:54
In reply to Re: sexual side effect- effexor-xr » jal, posted by Davez on March 26, 2004, at 20:27:31
I started on 75 mg of Effexor a few months ago noticed not only was there a little less sensation that made it take longer to reach climax but also that my sex drive kicked up a notch or two. I was concerned about kicking up the dosage to 150 mg thinking it might completely impair my orgasms altogether but that did not happen when I increased the dosage. As time goes on the sensation I initially lost seems to be coming back and I my sex drive is still in overdrive. My sex life has never been better and I don't ever want to stop taking this stuff. Good luck!
> I'm on 75mg dose right now and have what I could explain as an increase in sexual stamina (staying power so to speak). It does sort of feel like a numbness in a way but I can get past it to climax. I looked on the NET and they say "abnormal ejaculation" is a side effect. That sounds to me like cats and dogs shooting out of your penis or something weird like that. I have heard from others that Prozac and other similar drugs can prevent a person from climaxing. I found that I just require faster sex to get off and that slower sex will last all night. I would think though if I went up to 225mgs I might not be able to climax at all. I would talk to your doctor about it and maybe you could switch to another brand. That sometimes works.
>
>
> > I've been on effexor xr for the past 4 months, went from 37.5mgs up to 225mgs now and the only thing I feel is numbness in my penis and my sex drive is way down from where it was before effexor xr.Is this common for men to feel this?
> > Any men out there have the same numbness down there? Whats the cure ? Help my girlfriend thinks its her but I'm telling her its my meds.
>
>
Posted by E-Lee on March 29, 2004, at 14:12:01
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin to Buspar » mary rose, posted by PoohBear on March 29, 2004, at 9:31:13
> > Paxil is the anti depressant that causes the most weight gain of any of the anti-depressants.
>
>
> Actually, I would disagree with this statement...
>
> From personal experience I can tell you that Remeron caused me to gain 12 pounds in two weeks... It gave me the best sleep I've ever had, but the weight gain issue made me drop it and go to Seroquel instead.
>
> Tony
>
> 150mg Effexor XR
> 20mg Adderall XR
> 100mg SeroquelMy doctor actually prescribed me Remeron knowing that I was trying to gain weight, but it made me feel drugged. I only took it once but I was out of it for 2 days. I didn't like that feeling. I am on Effexor and have been for 8 months and my weight has been steady - no loss and no gain. I do feel like I have big time mood swings though not where I am depressed but just really tired and mellow and then all of a sudden I will be bouncing off the walls. I don't like the inconsistency. Another thing is my memory and concentration is terrible. Anybody have any suggestions on how to improve that.
Lee
>
>
Posted by PoohBear on March 29, 2004, at 14:18:27
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin to Buspar, posted by E-Lee on March 29, 2004, at 14:12:01
"My doctor actually prescribed me Remeron knowing that I was trying to gain weight, but it made me feel drugged. I only took it once but I was out of it for 2 days."
You might want to try it again. 1 day is not enough time. The feelings you describe tend to moderate or go away with time. You can add Remeron to Effexor. Many do it at night to help with sleep...
Tony
Posted by Spinxxie on March 29, 2004, at 14:54:15
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin to Buspar » E-Lee, posted by PoohBear on March 29, 2004, at 14:18:27
I agree.. the side effects are generally temporary, you have to give a drug a few days to really see how it will work.. many drugs, and in my case Effexor, made me really tired at first, but it does wear off. I have been on it for about a month now and I am so pleased that it works quite well, no real hot flashes any more. I find that my appetite has gone down a bit, it was bad at first with the Effexor, I wanted to eat anything and everything! The Buspar helps with the anxiety, though I have noticed it has screwed with my short term memory, will have to discuss that with my shrink. I think I still need to up my dose of Effexor, still not where I want to be yet.. but better then suicidal right?
I think on any of the drugs, you have to give them time, and you have to have a Dr. who knows what s/he is talking about, not just reading what their drugs rep has given them.. so ask a lot of questions, research it a lot yourselves.. be informed! I used to hear a lot of bad things about Effexor, but after doing a lot of research, the good outweighs the bad by a ton! Hang in their, hugs to all!
Posted by MP on March 29, 2004, at 16:32:25
In reply to Re: Effexor XR and weight gain , posted by PAD702 on April 21, 2000, at 4:57:08
I have been taking Effexor XR since Jan '01. I was taking 75mg twice a day and lost weight like crazy the first few months and then stabilized. Then my doctor changed my prescription from taking 2 pills twice a day to taking just 1, 150 mg, once a day. Since the change I have gained 20+ lbs in a 6 month period. Has anyone lost weight by quitting the Effexor XR or by decreasing the dosage?
Posted by MP on March 29, 2004, at 16:44:20
In reply to Re: got FAT?, posted by Shyla on March 22, 2004, at 8:41:39
Shyla I am happy for you. Effexor (75mg 2x's a day) did the same for me and has continued except for the weight problem. The first few months I lost weight, alot of weight and I felt great. Well it has been 2 (1 pill 150mg 1x a day)years and I still feel great but I have gained weight drastically. I don't mean to put a damper on the outlook, but just thought you should know what to expect if you continue for awhile. Who knows maybe you will be the lucky one! Keep me posted.
Posted by KennyBingo on March 30, 2004, at 1:05:54
In reply to Give the Meds time to work, posted by Spinxxie on March 29, 2004, at 14:54:15
Hi Folks,
Just here with my two cents' (if that) worth on the matters of increased weight and decreased libido. I've gained a little weight. Can't quite figure out if it's the Effexor or just the usual mid-thirties pile-up. It occurs to me that, since starting the Effexor (37.5 to 75, then 150 mg/day) a year ago, I really get a kick out of EATING much more than before. Never before has food been so enjoyable. Perhaps depression was just making me sick to my stomach all those years...
As for sexual dampening. Well, again--is it age or is it pharmacologically induced phrigidity? [sic] Likely the latter, which for me isn't so bad. See, my partner has also been on the stuff (300mg/day, no less)for years. It's therefore rather convenient, if kind of sad, to see my sexual sensitivity and sensibility take a nosedive. And I'm sure she appreciates the respite from my solicitations. Still, this priest-like existence is weird.
Any reflections on the above?
k
Go forward in thread:
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.