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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by Sean9 on April 4, 2003, at 4:47:13
In reply to Re: thanks » Paco (nm) » KRM123, posted by Dr. Bob on April 4, 2003, at 0:18:20
As for positive experiences with starting and staying on Effexor, I have heard and seen many people say it is the most effective med they've taken to help them deal with their depression. Many people have posted that it worked even when other popular meds didn't. Much of the research points to the fact that Effexor effects two to three chemicals in your body, which may be why it has the best track record of treating depression.
If you are just starting Effexor, just make sure you don't ever miss a dosage, take it at the same time each day, and see what works better for you (taking at night or in the morning, for us it was more tolerable at night). We saw results start in a couple of weeks, with probably a full effect after 6 weeks.
As I've said before, it is everyone's right to live a happy and meaningful life. And in the spirit of that, I won't add my positive message about Effexor without the bad. The withdrawal effects are horrible (second worst med to withdrawal next to Paxil as rated by some medical communities) and you will experience them the first day you forget your meds. Just be prepared and read everything (good, bad, otherwise) before you start your medication. Also, I'd recommend exploring any other meds that have less severe withdrawal effects and longer half-lifes (like Prozac or Welbutrin) with your doctor before you start something 'heavy' like Effexor.
Again, congrats on deciding to live a happy life and doing something to help get you there. And remember that we're all made up of chemical reactions anyway, you're just trying to find the right one's for you.
Posted by DeeDee46 on April 4, 2003, at 5:18:37
In reply to So anyway..., posted by Sean9 on April 4, 2003, at 4:47:13
Effeoxr XR is the first medicine that I also took that really helped me. It appears that most doctors start you on 37.5 mg. than up it as needed. If you can somehow relax and just try not to focus on it, you will be ok. It will either work or not work so do not worry about anything bad happening. I know what you are going through tho and it is scarey starting a new medicine. I had some minor wieght gain with increased in appetite when I got to 75mg. But I wieghed feeling "good" and let it go. I pick my battles with this depression. It was a miracle drug in my case to me. I am very thankful for it as it helped me feel whole again. Now, I am to the point where my doctor thinks I may not need it anymore and experimenting with differnt dosages and weaning a bit. I feel as though the weaning is similar to when you first go on,, just backwards. So, hang in there. Do the best that you can do to live a quality of life and try not to worry. I know that is hard.
I am here for you.
Take care.
DeeDee46
Posted by melley on April 4, 2003, at 6:19:35
In reply to Re: Effexor XR sucesses?, posted by KRM123 on April 3, 2003, at 22:32:57
> Yes- please keep the Effexor XR POSITIVE EXPERIENCES coming. I am starting tomorrow on 37.5mg. Kind of nervous/scared about it. I know I need to try it for myself before I make any judements. Any inspiration would be nice! Thanks
>
I hope you have a positive experience with effexor. I am on 225 mg a day. I have mostly positive feelings about it although have gained 20 lbs I can't seem to get rid of. I have heard if you are very careful about what you eat and exercising right from the start you can avoid that. I was on Paxil before several years ago and it made me very tired. Then I was on effexor for a year and went off for several years. To tell you the truth I didn't find the withdrawal that bad. I felt shaky and flu-like for a week and then it was over. But everyone reacts differently.As to remarks about not taking meds, my dr told me that if you take meds for a year and the go off and have a relapse (worse in my case) then you most likely need to be on it for the rest of your life to balance out the imbalance in your brain. I would give anything not to have depression and anxiety and to not have to take meds. But I also have to make a living and raise my children.
Good luck.
Posted by Napaba on April 4, 2003, at 9:22:14
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdrawal Highly Overrated luckyspec, posted by luckyspec on April 3, 2003, at 17:44:50
Luckyspec, If you don't personnally suffer from depression and anxiety, why don't you just monitor the site and see what those who do suffer from depression and anxiety have to say.
I've had a problem with depression as long as I can remember. Your childhood sounds good to me. If all I had to do was fight with my sister, be belittled and listen to my parents fight I probably wouldn't be on medication either. Your list is just the beginning of mine. I was raped, got pregnant, had a baby, put it up for adoption, but wasn't ever allowed to talk about any of it. This all happened 23 years ago and I still regret not keeping the baby, who just turned 23 March 23rd. I know where he is and I send him birthday cards, but I never hear from him.
When I first went to the doctor, I told him I just felt horrible there had to be something wrong with me. I cried all the time, was always tired, slept whenever I could, yelled at my children, was anxious about everything and depressed no matter what. I had thought about suicide, but decided I didn't want my EX raising my children. The final straw was when I thought about driving off a bridge with my kids.
After I started taking meds, my mother tried to make me feel that I was stupid for taking them, and had no reason to be depressed. My church told me I wasn't praying enough. Thank God my doctor was a christian and helped me to see things differently. The way I look at it, is God sent me to a doctor to get the medical help I needed.
I have no reason to be depressed. I have a great husband, three wonderful children, a job I love, a beautiful home in a peacefull community. I still cry and feel sorrow, but I don't cry because the grass needs to be cut, I'm late for church, etc. I still cry when I hear a sad song on the radio, or I hear about the soldiers who have given their lives in Iraq. When it's Christmas and birthdays I feel joy and I can laugh, where before I couldn't.
Every couple of years I decide I don't need to be on medication anymore and stop taking it. I can usually go a year without it and then I have to go back on it.
My family is most important to me. If my taking a pill each day makes their lives better then it's worth it.
I hope my story helps you better understand depression, it's not a choice.
I obviously do miss the point.
> I am only trying to learn about depression more deeply. This is why I am going to do research on history of depression to find out where the root of depression started.
>
> I have heard that depression is caused by the inability to deal with one's own problems. Perhaps this is true. If it is not so I know even less about depression.
>
> I leave you all to your state, and I trully can not help you. You are outside my circle of influence. I am only trying to help someone close to me with their depression. I am really very sorry if I have caused you any pain at all and will not try to influence you.
>
> I also know depression is not about happiness or sadness. The Tao is simply an example. Perhaps you can read some taoism. It really helped me once. As to my family..they are the ones that caused me to be more depressed. I was always yelled at by my mother, and my father didn't really care to help me with anything when I was younger. My parents constantly fought and I fought with my sister. I did have a great family right DeeDee? Am I lucky...?
> Things have changed since then. My parents divorced and I live with a roommate and out of my mothers house. She is depressed also, but misses yelling at me. Yet I love her and I want to help her. She does not take drugs, but she is different then you perhaps she doesn't have as many problems as you.
>
> I am also trying to help a friend of mine who is on Effexor. That is why I am here. Not to influence you. It was my mistake to even try. I simply want to deeply understand depression. But I believe that it will be impossible unless I am depressed as you. I can't make myself depressed. That is what I heard.
>
> Also the chemical imbalance is caused by having soo many problems that one can not deal with. I am dealing with mine, and can not begin to stop dealing with them, so I more likely will not be depressed ever as I want to be. I do get sad at times. It is normal. But I will never understand your depression as you do. I only wish to help those I care about, without them having to hurt their mind, body, and spirit.
>
> Really, I am sorry you have to go through life carrying such a burden. I can not help you. I have learned that much, that I can only help those who allow me to help. I allow myself to help myself.
>
> I am sick also, I do not know what it is, but I have something in my throat that has been there for 3 years or so. I guess it is psychosomatic. So I am dealing with it. But I will not take a drug that will make me lose my sex function or make me tired or hurt my bones. That is just speaking for myself. I am not just talking about Effexor. I do not need it. I could take something like Advil to stop some of the feeling in my throat. But I will find a way. I know that our emotions are stored in muscles and I know that there is some problem that I have not brought to the surface. I will.
>
> But I am not going to tell you what to do. Please do not listen to me. Only discover the true problems of your life, and begin to deal with one at a time. Until that happens you do need the drugs...unfortunately. I just wonder how people treated depression when there was no drug industry...That is a great question.
Posted by japonica on April 4, 2003, at 9:42:46
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdrawal Highly Overrated » Sean9, posted by luckyspec on April 3, 2003, at 1:45:28
I'll assume you will convey your beliefs about medication and its professed, but errant, ability to control illness to your doctor when you are diagnosed with high blood pressure, heart disease, cancer, diabetes, or any number of serious medical illnesses like depression.
You are grievously uninformed. Please take the time to expand *your* mind and truly educate yourself about depression before you or someone you love needs your support.
Thanks
japonica
Posted by japonica on April 4, 2003, at 10:01:36
In reply to Effexor XR sucesses?, posted by Paco on April 3, 2003, at 21:56:29
I have had *great* success with Effexor XR. Had virtually no side effects when starting and continue to feel well. I have put on some weight after an initial loss but it's manageable. If that's the worst thing that happens in the course of my year it's been a pretty good one. I've been on it for 6 months and have slowly ramped up to 150 mgs. a day taken at mid-morning. This is where I plan to stay.
I took Prozac a while back. Had much success. I stopped then started again and the second time 'round it no longer worked. This is a commom occurence as I've come to understand. I tried Zoloft right before the Effexor and did not like it at all. It left me feeling very foggy and sluggish. Hope this helps.
Best to all. Thanks for the support you all provide.
japonica
Posted by DeeDee46 on April 4, 2003, at 10:20:18
In reply to Re: Effexor XR sucesses?, posted by japonica on April 4, 2003, at 10:01:36
You are going to be fine........ I can tell. Good Luck!!! I agree,,,,a weight gain is just a cross in the road.....
DeeDee46
Posted by KRM123 on April 4, 2003, at 11:28:03
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdrawal Highly Overrated luckyspec » luckyspec, posted by Napaba on April 4, 2003, at 9:22:14
Wow- I just wanted to tell you that I thought your post was amazing. Thank you for sharing- it brought a tear to my eye. I agree with everything you said. God Bless
Posted by KRM123 on April 4, 2003, at 11:46:20
In reply to Re: Effexor XR sucesses? » KRM123, posted by Paco on April 3, 2003, at 23:07:07
Thanks Paco
The Dr. says I have double depression- a condition in which a major depressive disorder is superimposed upon a dysthymic disorder.
I have tried Prozac and Zoloft in the past- prob for only gave them 2 months each before I discovered weight gain and not really making a difference.
At the beginning of March I tried Wellbutrin for 2 weeks and it messed me up bad- horrible experience...I think my dose was too high. From there I went straight to Lexapro- 3 weeks on that but I'm done with it cause it makes me so tired.
Now it's off to Effexor.
Posted by Napaba on April 4, 2003, at 13:34:46
In reply to Re: Effexor XR sucesses?Paco, posted by KRM123 on April 4, 2003, at 11:46:20
> Give Effexor a chance. I've tried Wellbutrin, Prozac, and Paxil. I gained weight on all three. I've been on Effexor for about 10 weeks and have lost 23 pounds. I didn't start losing until I was on it for 3 weeks.
Also think about why you eat. Do you eat because your depressed and/or anxious, if you do the medication should help once it lessons your depression and anxiety.
I've also been on a diet like Atkins. Low carb is the way to go. You get to eat more and are full.
Thanks Paco
>
> The Dr. says I have double depression- a condition in which a major depressive disorder is superimposed upon a dysthymic disorder.
>
> I have tried Prozac and Zoloft in the past- prob for only gave them 2 months each before I discovered weight gain and not really making a difference.
>
> At the beginning of March I tried Wellbutrin for 2 weeks and it messed me up bad- horrible experience...I think my dose was too high. From there I went straight to Lexapro- 3 weeks on that but I'm done with it cause it makes me so tired.
>
> Now it's off to Effexor.
>
Posted by DeeDee46 on April 4, 2003, at 13:41:47
In reply to Re: Effexor XR sucesses?Paco » KRM123, posted by Napaba on April 4, 2003, at 13:34:46
Yes.. give effexor a fair chance.. I wish I would of lost weight. I gained but I am also eating low carbs and more protein and it is working slowly. But that is ok.
I didnt eat more because of emotions. I was so hungry all the time and my psych told me that can happen with it. When I went down to 37.5mg, I noticed a big change in my appetite. So maybe in time, I can get my weight to where it is supposed to be. However, I would take weight over depression any day. If I feel good, at least I can go out and walk.
Hang in there
DeeDee46
Posted by melley on April 4, 2003, at 15:22:54
In reply to Re: Effexor XR sucesses?Paco » KRM123, posted by Napaba on April 4, 2003, at 13:34:46
Hi all,
I was thinking of asking my Dr. if I could switch to welbutrin. What has been people's experience with this drug?
Also, there was an excellent program on depression on the Dianne Rehm show on NPR this morning. You can listen to it by going to the NPR website and then to the Diane Rehm show.
Thanks
Posted by DeeDee46 on April 4, 2003, at 15:29:37
In reply to Welbutrin?, posted by melley on April 4, 2003, at 15:22:54
I tried it. I did ok as far as depression but my stomach could not handle it for some reason. I do have a really sensitive stomach though.
Posted by Napaba on April 4, 2003, at 15:54:18
In reply to Welbutrin?, posted by melley on April 4, 2003, at 15:22:54
> I had a hard time remembering to take it twice a day. So it didn't do much for me. Out of the 14 pills I should have taken a week I was probably taking five. But I have a friend who takes it with Effexor and says this is the best she's felt sence her life fell apart a couple of years a go.
>
> Hi all,
>
> I was thinking of asking my Dr. if I could switch to welbutrin. What has been people's experience with this drug?
>
> Also, there was an excellent program on depression on the Dianne Rehm show on NPR this morning. You can listen to it by going to the NPR website and then to the Diane Rehm show.
>
> Thanks
Posted by hageshe on April 4, 2003, at 17:30:18
In reply to Effexor Withdrawal Highly Overrated, posted by juanantoniod on February 8, 2003, at 22:11:31
Higly over rated huh? I doubt you have gone through it. I tappered down over a month and am virtually incapacitated. I don't dare drive a vehicle and I have had to take a leave of absense from work. I am having severe and constant "brain shivers" as I have found many others are complaining of. Specifically, these "shivers" if you will, are somehow connected to eye movement and eye focus and they include ear ringing and short, bursty, miniture black outs. I have had them for days now and it is getting much worse. I also broke into several nasty sweats, headaches, and cold spells.
For what it is worth, I have suffered once in the past from food poisoning that I nearly died from. Until I had these "brain shivers" I would say that the 5-day food poison episode was the worst I ever felt...not any more.
I am a 36 year old 6'6" 275lb Military vet and I am no hypochondriac sir. This stuff sucks and if it does not subdue soon I will most certainly contact a lawyer. Why? Because there is obviously many people suffering from this crap and it is going completely ignored by the manufacturer. This is completely unacceptable.
Posted by hageshe on April 4, 2003, at 17:44:34
In reply to Re: any sexual side effects? » Elaine, posted by Tina P on February 3, 2003, at 12:30:07
> Hey, Elaine, I'm in the same boat as you are with the lack of desire. I just switched from Paxil to Effexor XL and I'm waiting to feel some changes. Did you find yourself a bit emotional during that transition period? Any weight issues?
Hi, I'm a 36yr male. Have been on Effexor XR for 3+ years. It is ruining my life. It was wrecked my sexual functions (no drive, no ejaculation, no orgasm...once in a while I can ejaculate but it is comes out whenever...no control). And the bad part is that I don't really care about the sexual part. The other problems:
-Can't focus eyes (this is a documented problem)
-Can't get energized (seriously risking my employment)
- can't think/concentrate (my IQ is 165...and I am a internationally rated chess player; well I was before Effexor)
- high blood pressure (another documented problem) I was once ready to try out for the US Olympic bike team...rode 400 miles per day. My blood pressure was as good as it gets.
- weight gain (how about 100lbs? sound fun? I was 185lb...now 285.)
- No "zest" for life...didn't think of killing myself anymore after starting Effexor...but found I had no desire to get up in the morning anymore.There's more mind you.
Oh, and now that I have been working to get the heck off this terrible drug I am having withdrawal like nothing I could have ever imagined and the carppy maker of the drug acts like there is no problem whatsoever with withdrawl. OH MY GOD! I can't believe that a person is actually having to take apart capsules to remove individual balls on or two at a time over the period of several months AND THEY STILL HAVE WITHDRAWAL!
Posted by Lou Pilder on April 4, 2003, at 18:16:05
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdrawal Highly Overrated, posted by hageshe on April 4, 2003, at 17:30:18
hageshe,
You wrote,[...will contact a lawyer...].
Below is a link about a law suit , I believe, involves effexor in some way.
http://society.guardian.co.uk/mentalhealth/story/0,8150,547606,00.html
Best regards,
Lou
Posted by hageshe on April 4, 2003, at 18:17:15
In reply to Re: withdrawal » Maisy, posted by Lynnads on February 4, 2003, at 10:17:23
PLEASE tell me if your symptoms have subdued/continued. I am literally going out of my mind trying to get off this drug!!!!!!!!
r_man70 @ yahoo.com
Posted by PuraVida on April 4, 2003, at 18:36:07
In reply to Re: any sexual side effects?, posted by hageshe on April 4, 2003, at 17:44:34
Hagashe and others,
I have had a lot of similar problems with motivation, which I am sure in turn have affected my weight and general health. BUT I started having these problems pre-effexor, but they have been more noticeable now, because the depression has lifted. I am researching the possibility that I may have adult ADD, of which these motivation/cognition problems are a part of. I'm wondering if the depression was caused by the ADD, and now that the depression is pretty muych gone, it has unmasked the ADD. Just a thought. There is a good diagnostic at www.mindfixers.com.
PV
> -Can't get energized (seriously risking my employment)
> - can't think/concentrate (my IQ is 165...and I am a internationally rated chess player; well I was before Effexor)
> - No "zest" for life...didn't think of killing myself anymore after starting Effexor...but found I had no desire to get up in the morning anymore.
Posted by hageshe on April 4, 2003, at 19:03:55
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdrawal Highly Overrated luckyspec, posted by luckyspec on April 3, 2003, at 17:44:50
Yeah, I have had several of those observations and thoughts too....but they are only trivial intellectual meanderings and not serious treatment for a serious problem. Consider this one: If they didn't treat Depression before the drug industry existed, they also didn't treat cancer and baterial infections. What happened? People died. What happens when a brilliant mind is overcome with Depression? Perhaps the missed opportunity to reach full potential (if not with certainty).
Although being an intellectual myself and also suffering from despression, I also have opportunities to contemplate where the root of the problem resides. I think there is truth to some of the things you say (for instance, people most certainly do need to deal with thier problems, and yes, sadness is a very desireable part of life).
What bothers me most is this thought: There is no money in finding a cure; only treatment. I mean, drug companies won't make money from curing. Doing this would remove the recurring revenue from those ever-so-convenient daily dosages. And a weekly or monthly or yearly treatment doesn't fit well enough with the insurance industry's system: the $20 deductable for a 30-day supply.
So, having such brilliant minds all working together to find a treatment and avoid a cure....what a sad thing. The drug companies must be very proud of themselves. I wonder if they came across the cure and set it aside in favor of a treatment? I think so.
And worse, if the cure is something they can't patent (such as Grapefruit Seed Extract....St. Johns Wart....others) they have no interest in sharing the good news. If they did they could sit back and watch their revenue dry up.
Has anyone every read "The Yeast Connection"? A very interesting theory of yeast as a root cause for depression...which I think has real potential. In fact, I am going to try it. After all, what causes the famous "chemical imbalance in the brain" that is making the drug companies so rich? Perhaps the lack of a simple enzyme produced by a process somewhere in the digestive system? Well, if that sounds crazy, consider that the deadly poisons like cyanide stop the bodily enzymes that allow the brain to extract oxygen from the blood. Did you know food like Almonds have cyanide in them? Hmmm, not that I am saying everyone with depression needs to stop eating Almonds....hardly. Just that common folk like us don't have the luxury of finding root causes for systemic illnesses; the best we can expect is to kep trying these daily dose treatments.
More food for thought: Once upon a time the US Govt. invested in research institutes that looked for cures. When was the last cure for anything developed? I can't think of it happening in my lifetime....just more daily dose treatments. I wonder if thr drug companies have lobbied Congress to put a stop to the "cures" so they can enjoy the spoils of the daily dose system?
Posted by luckyspec on April 4, 2003, at 19:29:28
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdrawal Highly Overrated » luckyspec, posted by japonica on April 4, 2003, at 9:42:46
Well...actually, about cancer,
I hear there are therapies...
But what do I know.I hear there are ways of treating Cancer that do not destroy the immune system...Yes actually did you know that radiation destroys your immune systems ability to fight disease? It destroys you, radiation does.
Interestingly enough all of the cancer patients I have read about and heard about, after their so called radiation therapy gets rid of their tumor, the tumor would reapear. But ofcourse it is prescribed by a doctor, the radiation is. I am not saying I have all the answers. I just know of a couple. I do not know this personally; as in first hand. But I read that cancer can be treated.
But I am learning. I can not talk. I dare not talk until I see it for myself first hand. I can only point into the direction.So do the research for yourself-
American Odessey- Book edited by Mary Higgins Boyd. If you are interested about an 'uncurable' disease...
Ofcourse, it is not my knowledge so do not place me in the middle of it. I am only a messenger, even though I've been shot, I am.Also-
http://www4.dr-rath-foundation.org/has some interesting information...seems promising-who knows- I am only doing research
Thank you
Posted by Dr. Bob on April 4, 2003, at 19:34:59
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdrawal Highly Overrated » luckyspec, posted by japonica on April 4, 2003, at 9:42:46
> I'll assume you will convey your beliefs about medication and its professed, but errant, ability to control illness to your doctor when you are diagnosed with high blood pressure, heart disease, cancer, diabetes, or any number of serious medical illnesses like depression.
>
> You are grievously uninformed. Please take the time to expand *your* mind and truly educate yourself about depression before you or someone you love needs your support.Please be sensitive to the feelings of others and don't be sarcastic or
post anything that could lead them to feel accused or put down, thanks.Bob
Posted by Dr. Bob on April 4, 2003, at 19:38:39
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdrawal Highly Overrated » japonica, posted by luckyspec on April 4, 2003, at 19:29:28
> Has anyone every read "The Yeast Connection"?
> American Odessey- Book edited by Mary Higgins Boyd.
I'd just like to plug the double double quotes feature at this site:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#amazon
The first time anyone refers to a book without using this option, I post this to try to make sure he or she at least knows about it. It's just an option, though, and doesn't *have* to be used. If people *choose* not to use it, I'd be interested why not, but I'd like that redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20020918/msgs/7717.html
Thanks!
Bob
Posted by luckyspec on April 4, 2003, at 19:59:37
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdrawal Highly Overrated luckyspec, posted by hageshe on April 4, 2003, at 19:03:55
Quite an interesting thought process have you.
I know much of what you speak. Understand that I am not asking you to stop taking a 'necessary evil'. I know that it is necessary. Otherwise you would not need it, would you?
I am asking you to open your minds. To learn about other potential methods of treatment. Other ways of dealing with problems. Deal with them yes.
I am learning that in the industrialized countries the spread of cancer and such disease is higher then in non industrialized countries. But I could be wrong in that.. I understand that you heard drug companies lobbied or you think they might, or could in order to prevent an actual cure. Correct you are in that.
If you have watched Problem Solvers ...it is a news channel program. I think channel 4. They have done an entire hour on the Pharmeceutical Industry. One interesting fact they have pointed out was that a company has 10 years of patent rights on a drug which no other company can sell for that duration. You would think that after 10 years the generic brands can start to sell drugs, and you would be fooling yourself because something else happens.
What usually happens after 10 years; the drug gets changed a tiny bit..instead of it being normal, now it is time released or has a different use ie. Asperin is now a 'Daily Therapy' for heart patients(it is used to thin blood). This allows the company to extend the patent by another 10 years. Sad but true. This is but one practice that the Pharmaceutical industry has perfected.
You are right, there is little you can do as an individual. Or is there. That is another paradox. One man has changed the world I recall...One man has changed the country also...It takes but one.
I am just asking you to open your mind and see the truth instead of hiding behind false hope, that one day you will be ok. That day is today. I believe in all of you, that you can do well.
But I am no one.
Posted by luckyspec on April 4, 2003, at 20:01:44
In reply to Re: please be civil » japonica, posted by Dr. Bob on April 4, 2003, at 19:34:59
Sometimes I'm wondering if Dr. Bob is a list of generic replies...
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