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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by cybercafe on August 1, 2002, at 2:10:46
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list, posted by jsarirose on July 31, 2002, at 23:55:52
>it. But it hasn't seemed to matter how much I've had. I haven't tried feta, but maybe I'll get brave and try it. I really miss greek salads!
okay jess -- just for you, i risked my life and tried some feta today... no problem here at 30 mg
Posted by cybercafe on August 1, 2002, at 2:12:13
In reply to Re: hey jess - i think you were right re: nifedepine, posted by jsarirose on August 1, 2002, at 0:34:34
> All I know is my personal experience and what I read online. I've never had a problem taking the Chlorpromazine, high blood pressure or not. And I've heard various negative reports about most of the alternatives. Aside from feeling a bit groggy for a day or two, it's always worked great for me. Worth a try, eh?
... what negative reports have you read about the rest? ...
... the main thing i learned here is that the nifedepine doesn't relieve the migraine -- and that seems like a downside :(
Posted by jsarirose on August 1, 2002, at 2:55:49
In reply to Re: hey jess - i think you were right re: nifedepine, posted by cybercafe on August 1, 2002, at 2:12:13
> > All I know is my personal experience and what I read online. I've never had a problem taking the Chlorpromazine, high blood pressure or not. And I've heard various negative reports about most of the alternatives. Aside from feeling a bit groggy for a day or two, it's always worked great for me. Worth a try, eh?
>
> ... what negative reports have you read about the rest? ...
>
> ... the main thing i learned here is that the nifedepine doesn't relieve the migraine -- and that seems like a downside :(Maybe I shouldn't have said that - it's mostly just word of mouth. It seems like some people have said what you just did, that it doesn't relieve headaches. And others were on emergency meds that still required a trip to the er. I haven't really heard anything positive about what other people use.
-Jessica
Posted by jsarirose on August 1, 2002, at 2:58:03
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list, posted by cybercafe on August 1, 2002, at 2:10:46
> >it. But it hasn't seemed to matter how much I've had. I haven't tried feta, but maybe I'll get brave and try it. I really miss greek salads!
>
> okay jess -- just for you, i risked my life and tried some feta today... no problem here at 30 mgOoh, thank you. Can't wait to buy or make a nice big greek salad tomorrow! Now how about trying some brie, muenster, gruyere, ... I miss my baked brie with garlic, my gruyere with crackers, and my grilled muenster cheese sandwich. ; )
Thanks,
Jessica
Posted by cybercafe on August 1, 2002, at 7:55:03
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list, posted by jsarirose on August 1, 2002, at 2:58:03
> Ooh, thank you. Can't wait to buy or make a nice big greek salad tomorrow! Now how about trying some brie, muenster, gruyere, ... I miss my baked brie with garlic, my gruyere with crackers, and my grilled muenster cheese sandwich. ; )
hey cheese girl... what kind of effect do you think having cheeses sit (in a restaurant kitchen; in your refrigerator) has on their tyramine level?
the one i tried was in a frozen dinner
Posted by LLL on August 1, 2002, at 9:15:40
In reply to Re: hey jess - i think you were right re: nifedepine, posted by jsarirose on August 1, 2002, at 2:55:49
I used it twice, once while working in the hospital and the other in addition to going to the ER. You're correct, it doesn't releive the migraine (although I expect that this isn't typical of a migraine but much worse) and thus the feeling that the nifedepine isn't working.
Although I have a new doc (2nd one in 2 weeks) she also refuses to prescribe this and it may be because of this potential for further harm.
Posted by jsarirose on August 1, 2002, at 11:37:52
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list, posted by cybercafe on August 1, 2002, at 7:55:03
>
> hey cheese girl... what kind of effect do you think having cheeses sit (in a restaurant kitchen; in your refrigerator) has on their tyramine level?
>
> the one i tried was in a frozen dinnerWell, I have to admit when I was lying in bed thinking about cheese (I obviously sleep alone) I started wondering whether a cheaper feta would be aged less than an expensive feta. I guess I hadn't even thought about restaurants. At least in grocery stores you can get a rough date and compare it to others. I'll probably still be very careful in restaurants - I tend to ask for any cheese on the side anyway. I guess I'll have to go to the co-op and make my own salad!
-Jessica
Posted by Bobbiedobbs on August 1, 2002, at 21:49:37
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list, posted by jsarirose on August 1, 2002, at 2:58:03
I'd appreciate it if all of us experimenters predesignate an individual to post any of our death notices on this board so that no one walks the plank behind us. Seriously, it's great having such forbidden fruit's king's tasters. (How's that for mixing metaphors?)
My experience has been limited to parmesan low down the list of ingredients. I must say the Iowa study posted here was an eye-opener. My doctor's still in the "you can't eat chocolate/raspberries" MAOI stone age and is a bastard teetotaler.
Posted by jsarirose on August 1, 2002, at 22:52:53
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list, posted by Bobbiedobbs on August 1, 2002, at 21:49:37
> I'd appreciate it if all of us experimenters predesignate an individual to post any of our death notices on this board so that no one walks the plank behind us. Seriously, it's great having such forbidden fruit's king's tasters. (How's that for mixing metaphors?)
> My experience has been limited to parmesan low down the list of ingredients. I must say the Iowa study posted here was an eye-opener. My doctor's still in the "you can't eat chocolate/raspberries" MAOI stone age and is a bastard teetotaler.Well, aside from eating cheese, I like to drink! Some of my first questions were about various alcohols. Bottled hard cider - okay, bottled hard lemonade - okay, red & white wine - okay, Bourbon - okay, white liquors (gin, rum, vodka) - okay.
The most I've had is probably three manhattan (bourbon), 1/2 bottle of wine, and a couple ciders or lemonades. (Not all in one night.) In my opinion the warnings about alcohol are overrated (except home made with dangers of contamination).
-Jessica
Posted by cybercafe on August 2, 2002, at 2:20:15
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list, posted by Bobbiedobbs on August 1, 2002, at 21:49:37
>Iowa study posted here was an eye-opener. My doctor's still in the "you can't eat chocolate/raspberries" MAOI stone age and is a bastard teetotaler.
what happens if you show up in his office munching on some cheddar?
Posted by Bobbiedobbs on August 2, 2002, at 23:54:30
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list, posted by cybercafe on August 2, 2002, at 2:20:15
Maybe I'll show up in doc's office with a piece of gruyere in one hand, a pint of Bourbon in the other and some banana peels hanging out of my mouth. He (medicine prescriber) inherited the Maos from original doctor and has made no secret about his disapproval. I see someone else for therapy who has a more enlightened (knowledgeable) viewpoint. Jess, thanks for sharing your alcohol experience/threshholds. When I was taking Nardil I had alot more than that (on a given occasion), and nothing ever "happened". Not that I'd recommend that, but that was my experience. White wine is alot less "potent" than a decongestant!
--Phil
Posted by jsarirose on August 3, 2002, at 0:46:16
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list » cybercafe, posted by Bobbiedobbs on August 2, 2002, at 23:54:30
experience. White wine is alot less "potent" than a decongestant!
> --PhilSpeaking of decongestants, I had a cold a couple months ago and was absolutely miserable. Since I didn't want to miss much work I went to the pharmacy to see if there was anything I could take. Benedryl. That's it. Out of the millions of pills, liquids, gelcaps, etc. - the only one you can take on an MAOI is Benedryl. And only the pure Benedryl, not the cold one.
My recommendation: Don't get sick!
(Maybe if I drink more I can ward off a future bout...)
-Jessica
Posted by cybercafe on August 3, 2002, at 2:28:19
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list » cybercafe, posted by jsarirose on August 3, 2002, at 0:46:16
>take. Benedryl. That's it. Out of the millions of pills, liquids, gelcaps, etc. - the only one you can take on an MAOI is Benedryl. And only the pure Benedryl, not the cold one.
hmmmm... i never needed to take any medicine for sickness -- now depression, that is a lot tougher to bear... i mean isn't it wonderful to have something that works for depression? i wouldn't trade that for anything...
...btw i am thinking if you were having problems maybe you could take a benzo and sleep through it (not so much as to develop a dependence obviously)
Posted by Bobbiedobbs on August 3, 2002, at 3:37:59
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list » cybercafe, posted by cybercafe on August 3, 2002, at 2:28:19
Besides Benedryl, you can also take Chlorotimitron
Posted by LLL on August 3, 2002, at 9:35:32
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list » cybercafe, posted by jsarirose on August 3, 2002, at 0:46:16
Also - since I suffer from sever seasonal allergies which would then turn into bad colds/bronchitis/pneumonia I began allergy shots while on MAOI's. I also highly recommend you get a pneumonia shot as well as yearly flu shots. It's better to prevent than to treat and both boost your immunity, decreasing frequency of colds and other viruses. I was also able when sick to use Vanceril inhaler for bronchial spasms and severe coughing for the couple of times over the course of 5 yrs. that I had a bad chest cold.
I also weathered root canals and a very painful pinched nerve, all with approved medications for pain, with no consequence.
Posted by LLL on August 3, 2002, at 10:26:21
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list » cybercafe, posted by Bobbiedobbs on August 3, 2002, at 3:37:59
This is the 3rd time I've sent this post - it keeps disappearing! You can also use Zyrtec (prescription antihistamine), expectorant cough syrups, Halls cough and throat drops, saline nose sprays and I was even told Afrin, which I used in the past without incident. Vicks vapo-rub and a hot steamy bath or shower are also good. I always ask the same question regarding OTC drugs and prescriptions to 2 or 3 pharmacists to insure I'm getting correct information. Some will not take the time and like some less enlightened doctors will tell you that you can't take anything, others will be more realistic and helpful. However, since pharmacists are human and can make mistakes, I always check out what they tell me to be sure.
Posted by jsarirose on August 3, 2002, at 14:59:38
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list » cybercafe » Bobbiedobbs, posted by LLL on August 3, 2002, at 10:26:21
> This is the 3rd time I've sent this post - it keeps disappearing! You can also use Zyrtec (prescription antihistamine), expectorant cough syrups, Halls cough and throat drops, saline nose sprays and I was even told Afrin, which I used in the past without incident. Vicks vapo-rub and a hot steamy bath or shower are also good. I always ask the same question regarding OTC drugs and prescriptions to 2 or 3 pharmacists to insure I'm getting correct information. Some will not take the time and like some less enlightened doctors will tell you that you can't take anything, others will be more realistic and helpful. However, since pharmacists are human and can make mistakes, I always check out what they tell me to be sure.
Oh thanks! Some great suggestions. I did down quite a few cough drops as well. Forgot about some of the other tricks though.
-Jessica
Posted by jsarirose on August 3, 2002, at 15:05:54
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list » cybercafe, posted by LLL on August 3, 2002, at 9:35:32
> I also weathered root canals and a very painful pinched nerve, all with approved medications for pain, with no consequence.
Speaking of more severe problems, I started thinking about emergency hospitalizations. I know there is some extra risk involved in some of the anesthetics & meds they give in hospitals. Last time I was on vacation I made a little pocket size list of the drugs I take & told my family about it. Now I keep it in my wallet in hopes that if I'm admitted to a hospital and can't communicate, they will go through my wallet and find the note. Sometimes emergency procedures need to be done before a medical chart can be consulted.
Has anyone else taken such precautions? Just curious.
-Jessica
Posted by LLL on August 3, 2002, at 16:52:03
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list » cybercafe, posted by jsarirose on August 3, 2002, at 15:05:54
Jessica, I wear a medic-alert bracelet (spent more to buy one that looks like a watch band, two tone, silver and gold) and carry the card as well.
Don't exactly like wearing the bracelet but it might mean saving your life - all it takes is one shot of Demerol to do us in.
Posted by LLL on August 4, 2002, at 9:51:14
In reply to Re: MAOI diet short list » cybercafe, posted by LLL on August 3, 2002, at 16:52:03
This is off this subject but when do I get a good nights sleep again? I'm still only on one half pill a day (5 mgs) yet it takes an hour or more to fall asleep and I wake up several times to struggle again to go back to sleep. I remember before that it caused me to be a light sleeper and would awaken at night, but nothing like this! I don't remember, does this pass? what's been your experience?
Lisa
Posted by cybercafe on August 4, 2002, at 20:52:18
In reply to Re: MAOI diet - For jsarirose » LLL, posted by LLL on August 4, 2002, at 9:51:14
> This is off this subject but when do I get a good nights sleep again? I'm still only on one half pill a day (5 mgs) yet it takes an hour or more to fall asleep and I wake up several times to struggle again to go back to sleep. I remember before that it caused me to be a light sleeper and would awaken at night, but nothing like this! I don't remember, does this pass? what's been your experience?
well now that i am out partying all the time i find i can exhaust myself enough to sleep 7 or 8 hours straight, ....but i never did find insomnia to be that bothersome... of course i'm not working so i suppose i have it easy... but i would just wake up and take some gabapentin at first.. and after a while clued in and took some gabapentin before bed (and now have no problems) ... i know there are other sleeping meds as well (trazodone, benzos, etc) ... much easier to deal with than hypersomnia and anergia! ... a welcome change.... insomnia brings a smile to my face :)
anyways... i'm sure jess can give you a better response... but i thought i would chip in in case you were anxious for a reply
Posted by jsarirose on August 4, 2002, at 21:26:25
In reply to Re: MAOI diet - For jsarirose » LLL, posted by LLL on August 4, 2002, at 9:51:14
I don't remember, does this pass? what's been your experience?
> LisaHow strange - I know I responded to this but it doesn't show up, maybe I forgot to hit the second confirm button.
I seem to have a higher tolerance than you as to side effects, but having trouble sleeping is definitely one of the Parnate side effects. Make sure you are taking your dose when you wake up in the morning. You may also want to try Trazodone or Klonopin. Neither is very addictive (not at all in my opinion if used for their given purpose), but technically Klonopin can be. I think it's only for those that take it recreationally (nuts). I prefer Trazodone. Common dose is 25mg - 150mg depending on the sleeplessness of the drug you're trying to counteract. I would recommend starting at 25mg at most. It may take a day or two to get used to it as well. If even 25mg seems too much you could shave a little off. Since you're taking a small amount of Parnate you probably don't need much. I don't recall if the sleeplessness fades much the longer you're on Parnate. Right now it's not as strong for me but I think that's because I'm taking other meds that make me tired. They all kind of balance each other out and I just take about 25mg of Trazodone.
Make sure your doctor doesn't try to give you Ambien or Sonata. They are real sleeping pills and are addictive. If taken every night you'll need more and more. They're really for occasional insomnia, in fact most insurance companies won't even cover a 30 day prescription. I never understand when psychiatrists prescribe these for insomnia from an antidepressant.
There may be more drugs than Trazodone and Klonopin, but those are the two I'm familiar with.
Good luck!
-Jessica
Posted by LLL on August 4, 2002, at 21:55:28
In reply to Re: MAOI diet » LLL, posted by jsarirose on August 4, 2002, at 21:26:25
Thanks to you both!
Posted by Bobbiedobbs on August 4, 2002, at 23:56:24
In reply to Re: MAOI diet » jsarirose, posted by LLL on August 4, 2002, at 21:55:28
Re the sleeplessness. I'm taking Parnate and it also keeps me from getting (and staying) asleep.At 20-30 mg. it only has a mild effect but at 40 and up it is pronounced. The best remedy, short of one of the drugs mentioned, is to space it so that you don't take any after dinner. I think the effect may recede slightly in time. If you think Parnate if bad in this regard, you should try Nardil. I think I averaged about 4-5 hours a night the years I was on it. Phil.
Posted by LLL on August 5, 2002, at 8:46:17
In reply to Re: MAOI diet, posted by Bobbiedobbs on August 4, 2002, at 23:56:24
>Re the sleeplessness. I'm taking Parnate and it also keeps me from getting (and staying) asleep.At 20-30 mg. it only has a mild effect but at 40 and up it is pronounced. The best remedy, short of one of the drugs mentioned, is to space it so that you don't take any after dinner. I think the effect may recede slightly in time. If you think Parnate if bad in this regard, you should try Nardil. I think I averaged about 4-5 hours a night the years I was on it. Phil
So, IF I can work my way back up to the dose I used to take of 50 (of which I took 30 in am and 20 in the afternoon) I will now have to take only 10 mg at a time, like every 2hours between the hours of 7:00 am and 5:00 pm? or do you take more than one pill at a time - I've heard from others that taking more than 10 mg at a time causes them problems. At the rate I'm going this time with only 5 mgs and moving up slowly, I imagine I'll be one to have problems with taking multiple pills at one time.
Also, I had the opposit effect, I found Nardil more sedating and had the best naps during the day. Now, not only do I not sleep well at night, I'm WIDE AWAKE all day - and again only on 5 mgs!
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