![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 6 to 30 of 251. Go back in thread:
Posted by Ron on December 1, 1998, at 21:21:05
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc, posted by Nancy on December 1, 1998, at 14:06:58
Have you guys considered an organic food diet and hot spring bathing? Talk to an EI doc for pete's sake! All these drugs are bad news!!
Posted by Nancy on December 2, 1998, at 12:09:00
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc, posted by Ron on December 1, 1998, at 21:21:05
> Have you guys considered an organic food diet and hot spring bathing? Talk to an EI doc for pete's sake! All these drugs are bad news!!
!-) Hi, Ron. Wow. All of it sounds interesting. Could you tell me more? What do I need to do to be on an Organic Food Diet? I don't think there are hot springs, here, in Las Vegas. Is there somewhere in particular that you recommend for hot spring bathing? Also, what's an EI doc (Sorry, I'm having a lot of cognition and memory impairment). You mayu have hit on the answers to this very big problem of mine. I really thank you for this information. Please, tell more about all of it.
Nancy
Posted by MrZest on December 10, 1998, at 10:26:21
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc, posted by Nancy on December 1, 1998, at 14:06:58
> > I just spent three days crying hysterically, freaking out and coming really close to suicide. I just started on Depakote. This Depakote experience put the fear of God in me though. As soon s I was up to the recommeneded dosage, it was as if the walls came tumbling down and I saw my future, in which I am locked up because I can't function in this world.
> >I am terrified that I will never find the right medication. I don't even know what I "have."
> >Is this Doctor going to think I am an hysterical female?
> >SHould I keep taking the meedication or stop right away?
> >Does anyone know of vitamins or herbal remedies that help?
> Hi, Kate. It seems you're in the midst of a severe crisis. What you described as your reaction to Depakote is similar to my response to the same drug. During my experience on Depakote, I had no relief from mood swings. Also, my depression went very black and very deep. What helped me may not have the same reaction in you.
> So, I'm going to steer you in a direction where you should get the relief you need. First, do you see in the aforementioned first paragraph, the questions that you outlined? Write down all of these and any other questions and concerns that you have. Even if those thoughts, right now, seem silly or embarrassing. There are no unimportant questions. There are no concerns that are trivial.
> Second, call your psydocs office and leave a message that you are having a serious crisis. You believe that you may be having a serious reaction to your medication. Say that you must speak to your psydoc immediately! Even take an appointment that day if it's available.
> Finally, if your psydoc even hints that you are a hysterical female then, it may raise a question about his professional ability. Crying or out-of-control sobbing are potentially a result of this new medication. Also, if you were Hysteristic Personality it would have been evident long ago. If you have a tendency for lability (moody), this is a biochemical problem not a personality problem. If your psydoc is cryptic and secretive about your illness, that is, he is not open with you, then, again, this may raise a question about his professional abilities.
> Remember, you are not some broken piece of machinery. You are a human being with a serious illness. You deserve respect, disclosure, and compassion. Your questions and concerns should be dealt with direct and empathetic communication. Furthermore, empower yourself to search out for a professional who has the greatest ability to treat your medical condition.
> Mind Over Madness,
> Nancy
Well said.
Very well said.
Posted by Robbie on December 10, 1998, at 12:34:17
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc, posted by MrZest on December 10, 1998, at 10:26:21
> > > I just spent three days crying hysterically, freaking out and coming really close to suicide. I just started on Depakote. This Depakote experience put the fear of God in me though. As soon s I was up to the recommeneded dosage, it was as if the walls came tumbling down and I saw my future, in which I am locked up because I can't function in this world.
> > >I am terrified that I will never find the right medication. I don't even know what I "have."
> > >Is this Doctor going to think I am an hysterical female?
> > >SHould I keep taking the meedication or stop right away?
> > >Does anyone know of vitamins or herbal remedies that help?
> > Hi, Kate. It seems you're in the midst of a severe crisis. What you described as your reaction to Depakote is similar to my response to the same drug. During my experience on Depakote, I had no relief from mood swings. Also, my depression went very black and very deep. What helped me may not have the same reaction in you.
> > So, I'm going to steer you in a direction where you should get the relief you need. First, do you see in the aforementioned first paragraph, the questions that you outlined? Write down all of these and any other questions and concerns that you have. Even if those thoughts, right now, seem silly or embarrassing. There are no unimportant questions. There are no concerns that are trivial.
> > Second, call your psydocs office and leave a message that you are having a serious crisis. You believe that you may be having a serious reaction to your medication. Say that you must speak to your psydoc immediately! Even take an appointment that day if it's available.
> > Finally, if your psydoc even hints that you are a hysterical female then, it may raise a question about his professional ability. Crying or out-of-control sobbing are potentially a result of this new medication. Also, if you were Hysteristic Personality it would have been evident long ago. If you have a tendency for lability (moody), this is a biochemical problem not a personality problem. If your psydoc is cryptic and secretive about your illness, that is, he is not open with you, then, again, this may raise a question about his professional abilities.
> > Remember, you are not some broken piece of machinery. You are a human being with a serious illness. You deserve respect, disclosure, and compassion. Your questions and concerns should be dealt with direct and empathetic communication. Furthermore, empower yourself to search out for a professional who has the greatest ability to treat your medical condition.
> > Mind Over Madness,
> > Nancy
>
> Well said.
> Very well said.I have bipolar illness and I am scared shitless after reading Paul's
comments on Klonopin. My doctor prescribed Lorazepam and
Klonopin for anxiety and occassional mood swings. I will never
take Klonopin again after reading Paul's story. My doctor is too
liberal sometimes with the medicines he gives me. The frightening thing is
only places like this can I find out what drugs really do. I was going to
take Klonopin every day because I didn't think anything about it.
Anybody know about taking Lorazepam daily.Robbie
Posted by MrZest on December 10, 1998, at 13:59:51
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc, posted by Robbie on December 10, 1998, at 12:34:17
> I have bipolar illness and I am scared shitless after reading Paul's
> comments on Klonopin. My doctor prescribed Lorazepam and
> Klonopin for anxiety and occassional mood swings. I will never
> take Klonopin again after reading Paul's story. My doctor is too
> liberal sometimes with the medicines he gives me. The frightening thing is
> only places like this can I find out what drugs really do. I was going to
> take Klonopin every day because I didn't think anything about it.
> Anybody know about taking Lorazepam daily.
> RobbieRobbie,
First of all, most doctors don't get thier degrees from the bottom of cracker jack boxes.
What I mean by that is that MOST doctors actually know what they are doing.
If I were you, I wouldn't be so ready to just throw away your doctor's reccomendations just because you have read one person's bad experience with the med. Especially when that one persons experience is supposedly so striking. Read the disclaimer at the top of the main page... Don't believe EVERYTHING you read.
I am not trying to cast dispersions on Pauls post, I believe what he says, I am simply saying that his account seems a bit, well, 'loud' is a good description. And whatever experience he has had will not neccesarily be anything like your own experience with the very same meds.
If you read all the posts here, you will find that no matter what med is discussed, there are many who have the same reactions to it, but there always seem to be at least one or a few who have different experiences with the same med.
If you are really uncertain about the regimen your doctor has prescribed, the best course of action is to get a second opinion from another doctor.
If your doctor is a competent professional, s/he will not have any problem with you seeking a second opinion.I am bi polar as well. What drove me to seek help in the first place was major depression. What kept me from asking for help in the first place for as long as I did was the fact that I always felt that no matter what anybody was saying, there was no way you could convince me that there was some sort of magic cure in some little pill.
I still believe that. BUT, (And believe me, I have a BIG but), I have seen improvement to the point that I am actually able to wake up without having suicide as the very first thought on my mind every morning. I have been in treatment for long enough now to realize that if it were not for the meds and the therapy BOTH together, I would not be were I am today. Either without the other would not have helped me in the way both together have.
While I can still say, pills are no magic cure, I also say, "I LOVE my happy pills." I would love to not have to take them, but I am not afraid to take them, and will for as long as it takes.
Posted by Nancy on December 13, 1998, at 15:53:10
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc, posted by MrZest on December 10, 1998, at 10:26:21
> > > I just spent three days crying hysterically, freaking out and coming really close to suicide. I just started on Depakote. This Depakote experience put the fear of God in me though. As soon s I was up to the recommeneded dosage, it was as if the walls came tumbling down and I saw my future, in which I am locked up because I can't function in this world.
> > >I am terrified that I will never find the right medication. I don't even know what I "have."
> > >Is this Doctor going to think I am an hysterical female?
> > >SHould I keep taking the meedication or stop right away?
> > >Does anyone know of vitamins or herbal remedies that help?
> > Hi, Kate. It seems you're in the midst of a severe crisis. What you described as your reaction to Depakote is similar to my response to the same drug. During my experience on Depakote, I had no relief from mood swings. Also, my depression went very black and very deep. What helped me may not have the same reaction in you.
> > So, I'm going to steer you in a direction where you should get the relief you need. First, do you see in the aforementioned first paragraph, the questions that you outlined? Write down all of these and any other questions and concerns that you have. Even if those thoughts, right now, seem silly or embarrassing. There are no unimportant questions. There are no concerns that are trivial.
> > Second, call your psydocs office and leave a message that you are having a serious crisis. You believe that you may be having a serious reaction to your medication. Say that you must speak to your psydoc immediately! Even take an appointment that day if it's available.
> > Finally, if your psydoc even hints that you are a hysterical female then, it may raise a question about his professional ability. Crying or out-of-control sobbing are potentially a result of this new medication. Also, if you were Hysteristic Personality it would have been evident long ago. If you have a tendency for lability (moody), this is a biochemical problem not a personality problem. If your psydoc is cryptic and secretive about your illness, that is, he is not open with you, then, again, this may raise a question about his professional abilities.
> > Remember, you are not some broken piece of machinery. You are a human being with a serious illness. You deserve respect, disclosure, and compassion. Your questions and concerns should be dealt with direct and empathetic communication. Furthermore, empower yourself to search out for a professional who has the greatest ability to treat your medical condition.
> > Mind Over Madness,
> > Nancy
>
> Well said.
> Very well said.Thank you for saying so. That was very much appreciated. Sometimes this place is like talking to a wall. I'm so happy to see you speak up.
Posted by Kate on December 14, 1998, at 12:51:11
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc, posted by Nancy on December 13, 1998, at 15:53:10
> > > > I just spent three days crying hysterically, freaking out and coming really close to suicide. I just started on Depakote. This Depakote experience put the fear of God in me though. As soon s I was up to the recommeneded dosage, it was as if the walls came tumbling down and I saw my future, in which I am locked up because I can't function in this world.
> > > >I am terrified that I will never find the right medication. I don't even know what I "have."
> > > >Is this Doctor going to think I am an hysterical female?
> > > >SHould I keep taking the meedication or stop right away?
> > > >Does anyone know of vitamins or herbal remedies that help?
> > > Hi, Kate. It seems you're in the midst of a severe crisis. What you described as your reaction to Depakote is similar to my response to the same drug. During my experience on Depakote, I had no relief from mood swings. Also, my depression went very black and very deep. What helped me may not have the same reaction in you.
> > > So, I'm going to steer you in a direction where you should get the relief you need. First, do you see in the aforementioned first paragraph, the questions that you outlined? Write down all of these and any other questions and concerns that you have. Even if those thoughts, right now, seem silly or embarrassing. There are no unimportant questions. There are no concerns that are trivial.
> > > Second, call your psydocs office and leave a message that you are having a serious crisis. You believe that you may be having a serious reaction to your medication. Say that you must speak to your psydoc immediately! Even take an appointment that day if it's available.
> > > Finally, if your psydoc even hints that you are a hysterical female then, it may raise a question about his professional ability. Crying or out-of-control sobbing are potentially a result of this new medication. Also, if you were Hysteristic Personality it would have been evident long ago. If you have a tendency for lability (moody), this is a biochemical problem not a personality problem. If your psydoc is cryptic and secretive about your illness, that is, he is not open with you, then, again, this may raise a question about his professional abilities.
> > > Remember, you are not some broken piece of machinery. You are a human being with a serious illness. You deserve respect, disclosure, and compassion. Your questions and concerns should be dealt with direct and empathetic communication. Furthermore, empower yourself to search out for a professional who has the greatest ability to treat your medical condition.
> > > Mind Over Madness,
> > > Nancy
> >
> > Well said.
> > Very well said.
> Thank you for saying so. That was very much appreciated. Sometimes this place is like talking to a wall. I'm so happy to see you speak up.
Thank you Nancy and everyone. I called my doc and left him an hysterical message, told him I had not slept more than three hours in eight days, etc. He told me to get a blood level and that there was nothing he could do until he had one. Well, I couldn't get to the lab. I could not sleep the night before, and slept pass the time frame for the lab test (had to be 12 hours after last doasge of Depakote). Tried again this morning; couldn't do it. Couldn't even take a shower this weekend between sobbing fits. Now I am going to cancel my next appt. with the doc because I can't make it. I will wean myself off of Depakote and continue taking nortriptylene. I can't stop thinking about suicide, but have no one to talk to about it. I feel desperate and despondant. I know I'll never feel "happy", but I just need the edge taken off. Thanks for letting me get this off my chest. Kate
Posted by Klonogirl on December 29, 1998, at 0:57:10
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc, posted by MrZest on December 10, 1998, at 13:59:51
> > I have bipolar illness and I am scared shitless after reading Paul's
> > comments on Klonopin. My doctor prescribed Lorazepam and
> > Klonopin for anxiety and occassional mood swings. I will never
> > take Klonopin again after reading Paul's story. My doctor is too
> > liberal sometimes with the medicines he gives me. The frightening thing is
> > only places like this can I find out what drugs really do. I was going to
> > take Klonopin every day because I didn't think anything about it.
> > Anybody know about taking Lorazepam daily.
> > Robbie
> Robbie,
> First of all, most doctors don't get thier degrees from the bottom of cracker jack boxes.
> What I mean by that is that MOST doctors actually know what they are doing.
> If I were you, I wouldn't be so ready to just throw away your doctor's reccomendations just because you have read one person's bad experience with the med. Especially when that one persons experience is supposedly so striking. Read the disclaimer at the top of the main page... Don't believe EVERYTHING you read.
> I am not trying to cast dispersions on Pauls post, I believe what he says, I am simply saying that his account seems a bit, well, 'loud' is a good description. And whatever experience he has had will not neccesarily be anything like your own experience with the very same meds.
> If you read all the posts here, you will find that no matter what med is discussed, there are many who have the same reactions to it, but there always seem to be at least one or a few who have different experiences with the same med.
> If you are really uncertain about the regimen your doctor has prescribed, the best course of action is to get a second opinion from another doctor.
> If your doctor is a competent professional, s/he will not have any problem with you seeking a second opinion.
> I am bi polar as well. What drove me to seek help in the first place was major depression. What kept me from asking for help in the first place for as long as I did was the fact that I always felt that no matter what anybody was saying, there was no way you could convince me that there was some sort of magic cure in some little pill.
> I still believe that. BUT, (And believe me, I have a BIG but), I have seen improvement to the point that I am actually able to wake up without having suicide as the very first thought on my mind every morning. I have been in treatment for long enough now to realize that if it were not for the meds and the therapy BOTH together, I would not be were I am today. Either without the other would not have helped me in the way both together have.
> While I can still say, pills are no magic cure, I also say, "I LOVE my happy pills." I would love to not have to take them, but I am not afraid to take them, and will for as long as it takes.
Well for my two cents I will have to say that Klonopin is a MAJOR step in the drug taking flight. I would give it alot of thought. I just have been going through the weaning process..it is not fun! I was on it for over four years. When I wanted to "try' to get off.....my shrink was less than supportive. He is a big honcho at a major hospital. Well, I am almost ther. I am ....ME..again. I can laugh and be pleasant once more.....wow huh? I still have shakey days. Today was one of them. If you must go on this drug make it short term and explore All of your options. Please...rememeber your Diet and heavens NO caffeine for us.EVER! KG
Posted by Klonoman on December 29, 1998, at 17:30:57
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc, posted by Klonogirl on December 29, 1998, at 0:57:10
Jeez, it's amazing how much Klonopin's getting trashed here. I've suffered from severe insomnia for decades and Klonopin (1mg @ nite) has saved my life. No side effects, just living a normal, adjusted, highly productive life and feeling rested during the day. I swear by the stuff; nothing else worked after trying what seemed like half the PDR before I lit on Klonopin. Sorry it's been so bad for everyone else.
Posted by Klonogirl on December 29, 1998, at 21:07:06
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc, posted by Klonoman on December 29, 1998, at 17:30:57
> Jeez, it's amazing how much Klonopin's getting trashed here. I've suffered from severe insomnia for decades and Klonopin (1mg @ nite) has saved my life. No side effects, just living a normal, adjusted, highly productive life and feeling rested during the day. I swear by the stuff; nothing else worked after trying what seemed like half the PDR before I lit on Klonopin. Sorry it's been so bad for everyone else.
Just curious how long you have been taking this. Has the headaches occured if you have forgotten it? Do you feel sick ? I am curious......as I am down to one per day and my body wants its old 15mg per day!
Posted by Klonoman on December 30, 1998, at 9:19:17
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc, posted by Klonogirl on December 29, 1998, at 21:07:06
In reply to your query...
I've been taking Klonopin for about 4.5 years now. I've stayed with 1mg/day in the evening before bed. When I do not take it, sometime's there's no effect, but generally my characteristic insomnia kicks in (waking at about 4:00 or 5:00 am ready to conquer the world, regardless of the time I go to sleep). I have never had headaches or any contraindications. It's short half-life never leaves me groggy in the morning. If anything, perhaps Klonopin is a case where we should use caution over making sweeping generalizations of its impact on the population who takes it (which seems to be the theme of this thread). Granted, I'm taking a significantly lower amount than you, so we may be comparing apples to oranges.
Posted by saint james on December 30, 1998, at 23:34:20
In reply to mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc...., posted by paul on November 26, 1998, at 8:21:48
> YOU HAVE TO BE OUT OF YOUR FUCKING MIND TO TAKE ANTI-EPILEPTIC MEDICINES FOR MOOD DISORDERS
James here....
I think it is pointless to condem a med due to 1 persons bad effects. As I understand it generally
when the traditional AD's fail to control uni/bi polar depression secondary meds like the anti-seizure meds are tried. They seem to work well in those with med resistant depressions. Yes they have side effects...but depression is worse. Ever live with a bipolar rapid cycler ? I have. Lots of fun for both he and I...not to mention constantly having to watch for a rapid down turn and a suiside attempt (to many to count) Traditional meds were of no help...some made the cycling worse. Thank god for the right anti seizure med. Finally I was able to let sharp objects into my life again !james
Posted by Klonogirl on December 31, 1998, at 22:32:01
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc...., posted by saint james on December 30, 1998, at 23:34:20
> > YOU HAVE TO BE OUT OF YOUR FUCKING MIND TO TAKE ANTI-EPILEPTIC MEDICINES FOR MOOD DISORDERS
> James here....
> I think it is pointless to condem a med due to 1 persons bad effects. As I understand it generally
> when the traditional AD's fail to control uni/bi polar depression secondary meds like the anti-seizure meds are tried. They seem to work well in those with med resistant depressions. Yes they have side effects...but depression is worse. Ever live with a bipolar rapid cycler ? I have. Lots of fun for both he and I...not to mention constantly having to watch for a rapid down turn and a suiside attempt (to many to count) Traditional meds were of no help...some made the cycling worse. Thank god for the right anti seizure med. Finally I was able to let sharp objects into my life again !
> jamesI am on this medication for Panic Disorder...
Panic comes in clusters and can stop and go away for a month a year or forever..my big problem is that my Doc would not help me get off of it.
In reply to Klonoman.....yes it is apples to oranges.The 1mg is a drop in the bucket compared to 15mg a day plus zoloft. I am a totally different person without it. Hey....I will be the first to admit that tomorrow I may have to buy back into this drug. Hoever I will try others first before I go with Klonopin @15mg a day.....KG
Posted by Klonoman on January 1, 1999, at 10:14:37
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc...., posted by Klonogirl on December 31, 1998, at 22:32:01
Kologirl,
Just curious, to what extent have you tried psychotherpy for your panic disorder? Efficacy of combined meds and psychotherapy for depression and anxiety disorders is significant. You imply that you are seeing only someone for the meds. Some psychiatrists only prescribe meds and, unless you know that therapy can also help, you may be missing out.
Klonoman
Posted by shelley on January 2, 1999, at 20:44:13
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc, posted by Kate on November 30, 1998, at 18:33:31
> > i have bipolar disorder, with a strong possibility of psychotic/pschyzophrenic disorders. I have been on Paxil for many months now, with minimal side effects, i cant speak for the benzos, sense my doctor is a little unorthodox and wont perscribe them... He prefers a new drug that is neither a mood stabilizer nor anti convulsant, its called Revia. My point is, dont be afraid of all drugs and shrinks, some are better than others and as much as it sux to learn the hard way that Klonopin or other Anti convulsants arent the way to go, dont be discouraged to try new treatments, Ive been up to 30mg a day of paxil for some time now, and havent had so much as a head ache since the first 3 days i was on it.
> > Matthew
> I just spent three days crying hysterically, freaking out and coming really close to suicide. I just started on Depakote. I have taken klonopin before, for insomnia, and it never did anything other than knock me out. This Depakote experience put the fear of God in me though. As soon s I was up to the recommeneded dosage, it was as if the walls came tumbling down and I saw my future, in which I am locked up because I can't function in this world. I am terrified that I will never find the right medication. I was on nortriptylelene - sp- for years and it suddenly stopped working. Now I don't even know what I "have." If I'm being given Depakote, does that mean I am bipolar? Is this Doctor going to think I am an hysterical female? SHould I keep taking the meedication or stop right away? Does anyone know of vitamins or herbal remedies that help?I had a very similar experience with Depakote. It was as if I could not speak at all. As I slowly tapered off of Depakote I began to speak again and the sound of my own voice surprised me. On the other hand, in relation to this thread, klonopin is the only drug I "trust" right now. It keeps the edges smooth, and keeps me from getting to far out either direction, ie. the suicidal thoughts are kept at bay and I don't get too hyped up. Not much helps me sleep, and all SSRI type ADs only make my insomnia worse. At least I am not panicking about it. ;) I have yet to find and am not sure I will find a med that will "fix" me, but, also I expect I have the past 4 years of psychotherapy with an outstanding therapist to thank for helping tme to accept some of this "fate". P.S. Never be afraid of being a "hysterical female". The docs can not help us if we don't let them know just how bad it is, and many of these drug reactions can be very dangerous. They need to know!!!!
Posted by diane on January 3, 1999, at 6:12:56
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc, posted by Ron on December 1, 1998, at 21:21:05
TO KATE:
Your postings really hit a chord for me - had a heinous manic/psychotic/every-disorder-in-the-book episode last month. Something I never thought could happen to ME. Another thing that really 'jumped off the page' at me is that not a single person responded IMMEDIATELY to your last posting!! You sound (and I'm sure you ARE) in a living hell right now. Are these people that damn self centered? Anyway, I sure hope you're doing better. I've made alot of progress since my "episode" but don't know if I'll ever be able to easily talk or even think about it without pain. I never thought something like that manic/psychotic/whatever-bizareness could happen to someone like me. But I CAN tell you one thing and I hope you give it some very serious thought. The one thing I learned with all certainty is that when you're feeling that bad, you MUST throw the burden to someone else....I'm sure there are times you feel there's no one who cares enough to go thru that kind of B.S. with you, but trust me, there is. So think of the one person you trust more than anyone else (friend, family, whoever!) and tell them you need their help BIG TIME. Let THEM come over and physically dress you and drive you to your dr's office, if that's what it takes. I went thru 48 hours of hell and could have avoided at least half of those 48 had I realized sooner it was out of my hands and called a friend right away.Anyway, I'm no expert, but I really know how you feel and I care! I'll be thinking of you til I hear how you are - and try to remember,when you feel that shitty, things can only get better, right? And miraculously, they do. Please write soon - dlfail@aol.com
from a friend who cares -
diane
> Have you guys considered an organic food diet and hot spring bathing? Talk to an EI doc for pete's sake! All these drugs are bad news!!
Posted by diane on January 3, 1999, at 6:19:16
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc, posted by Ron on December 1, 1998, at 21:21:05
Hi kate,
diane again. forgot to mention i'll be at a temporary email address for the next week or so. if you send to the dlfail address, it'll be awhile b/4 i recv it. if you have time, send an email to SCW50@aol.com.
thanks!!
diane> Have you guys considered an organic food diet and hot spring bathing? Talk to an EI doc for pete's sake! All these drugs are bad news!!
Posted by Elizabeth on January 7, 1999, at 15:12:10
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc...., posted by saint james on December 30, 1998, at 23:34:20
I just started Neurontin 200 mg 2x/300 mg at bedtime. I also take Zoloft 150 mg. I don't notice anything in particular.
However, I do feel calm and less jittery. I have been diagnosed with bipolarII. I also notice that my craving for alcohol has been
eliminated. I used to feel I needed something, anything, to cut the high strung moods that were almost constant. I was leary of going
on a mood stabilizer because of weight gain. I just started a new excercise regime. I'll post in a month to let you know how it's going. Thanks. Elizabeth
Posted by Melissa on January 19, 1999, at 0:27:49
In reply to Re: msg for Kate - please write on your progress!, posted by diane on January 3, 1999, at 6:12:56
This string of messages scares me. I have been on 1 mg of Klonopin for 8 years and am unable to get off it. Even minute reductions (say to .87 mg) bring such dark feelings that Ihave to go back to 1 mg. I had been on it before and went into a treatment center (for other psychological issues -- sexual abuse memories etc.) and the center took me off cold turkey. I had a rough first two weeks there but never attributed it to Klonopin withdrawal. Went back on several months later when my marriage broke up. That was 8 years ago and I have not been able to get off of it yet. Started Celaxa an antidepressant under a doctor's care as a prelude to getting off this. It was a disaster. (See my post under Celaxa thread). I am angry that people didn't know how addictive this stuff was. I was told 10 years ago by a responsible psychiatrist that it was non-addictive unlike valium which Ihad been on previously. THat proved not to be true. I don't want to live in a world where I am obsessed with my feelings and mmy medications. I am just expressing myself here, not particularly looking for advice. I have other things I want to do with my life than live in a closed world of mental concerns.
Posted by alan on January 20, 1999, at 0:51:54
In reply to Re: Klonopin, posted by Melissa on January 19, 1999, at 0:27:49
> This string of messages scares me. I have been on 1 mg of Klonopin for 8 years and am unable to get off it. Even minute reductions (say to .87 mg) bring such dark feelings that Ihave to go back to 1 mg. I had been on it before and went into a treatment center (for other psychological issues -- sexual abuse memories etc.) and the center took me off cold turkey. I had a rough first two weeks there but never attributed it to Klonopin withdrawal. Went back on several months later when my marriage broke up. That was 8 years ago and I have not been able to get off of it yet. Started Celaxa an antidepressant under a doctor's care as a prelude to getting off this. It was a disaster. (See my post under Celaxa thread). I am angry that people didn't know how addictive this stuff was. I was told 10 years ago by a responsible psychiatrist that it was non-addictive unlike valium which Ihad been on previously. THat proved not to be true. I don't want to live in a world where I am obsessed with my feelings and mmy medications. I am just expressing myself here, not particularly looking for advice. I have other things I want to do with my life than live in a closed world of mental concerns.
1. If you stay at 1 mg./day for the rest of your life, so what? Don't sweat it all that much.
2. One of my old tricks. Take the tab and give it a tiny scratch on sandpaper; after a wek, two such tiny scratces; then three, etc.. Eventually this will take some dexterity, but I bet it might help. Best of luck.
Posted by Klonogirl on June 2, 1999, at 17:03:45
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc, posted by Klonogirl on December 29, 1998, at 0:57:10
> > > I have bipolar illness and I am scared shitless after reading Paul's
> > > comments on Klonopin. My doctor prescribed Lorazepam and
> > > Klonopin for anxiety and occassional mood swings. I will never
> > > take Klonopin again after reading Paul's story. My doctor is too
> > > liberal sometimes with the medicines he gives me. The frightening thing is
> > > only places like this can I find out what drugs really do. I was going to
> > > take Klonopin every day because I didn't think anything about it.
> > > Anybody know about taking Lorazepam daily.
> > > Robbie
> > Robbie,
> > First of all, most doctors don't get thier degrees from the bottom of cracker jack boxes.
> > What I mean by that is that MOST doctors actually know what they are doing.
> > If I were you, I wouldn't be so ready to just throw away your doctor's reccomendations just because you have read one person's bad experience with the med. Especially when that one persons experience is supposedly so striking. Read the disclaimer at the top of the main page... Don't believe EVERYTHING you read.
> > I am not trying to cast dispersions on Pauls post, I believe what he says, I am simply saying that his account seems a bit, well, 'loud' is a good description. And whatever experience he has had will not neccesarily be anything like your own experience with the very same meds.
> > If you read all the posts here, you will find that no matter what med is discussed, there are many who have the same reactions to it, but there always seem to be at least one or a few who have different experiences with the same med.
> > If you are really uncertain about the regimen your doctor has prescribed, the best course of action is to get a second opinion from another doctor.
> > If your doctor is a competent professional, s/he will not have any problem with you seeking a second opinion.
> > I am bi polar as well. What drove me to seek help in the first place was major depression. What kept me from asking for help in the first place for as long as I did was the fact that I always felt that no matter what anybody was saying, there was no way you could convince me that there was some sort of magic cure in some little pill.
> > I still believe that. BUT, (And believe me, I have a BIG but), I have seen improvement to the point that I am actually able to wake up without having suicide as the very first thought on my mind every morning. I have been in treatment for long enough now to realize that if it were not for the meds and the therapy BOTH together, I would not be were I am today. Either without the other would not have helped me in the way both together have.
> > While I can still say, pills are no magic cure, I also say, "I LOVE my happy pills." I would love to not have to take them, but I am not afraid to take them, and will for as long as it takes.
>
> Well for my two cents I will have to say that Klonopin is a MAJOR step in the drug taking flight. I would give it alot of thought. I just have been going through the weaning process..it is not fun! I was on it for over four years. When I wanted to "try' to get off.....my shrink was less than supportive. He is a big honcho at a major hospital. Well, I am almost ther. I am ....ME..again. I can laugh and be pleasant once more.....wow huh? I still have shakey days. Today was one of them. If you must go on this drug make it short term and explore All of your options. Please...rememeber your Diet and heavens NO caffeine for us.EVER! KG
HEY.......
I AM FREE OF THIS DRUG,,,,,IT TOOK ALMOST 8 MONTHS TO GIVE IT UP.....BUT I AM FREE, WOOWWWW!!!!
I CAN NOT BELIEVE HOW MUCH BETTER I FEEL. I HAVE HAD BOUTS OF SLEEP PROBLEMS BUT I TAKE 1/2 TABLET OF AMBIEN TO HELP WITH THIS. IT OCCURS INFREQUENTLY. I ADMIT I AM MORE CAUTIOUS WITHOUT IT....BUT I THINK THIS WOULD BE A PERSONS NORMAL REACTION TO ANY CIRCUMSTANCES...SUCH AS A BAD PLANE FLIGHT WITH MASSIVE TURBULENCE! good luck everyone.....you can get off this garbage drug if you want to .......just do it ,,,,,,,,,,, s l o w l y KG
Posted by michele on June 2, 1999, at 18:47:41
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc...., posted by jackie coughenour on June 2, 1999, at 6:39:59
> > YOU HAVE TO BE OUT OF YOUR FUCKING MIND TO TAKE ANTI-EPILEPTIC MEDICINES FOR MOOD DISORDERS(KLONOPIN,DEPAKOTE,NEURONTIN ETC...) A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO I WAS PRESCRIBED KLONOPIN BY A SHRINK (MAY HE AND HIS FAMILY BURN IN HELL)FOR ANXIETY AND ALSO PAXIL WHICH I DIDNT TAKE VERY LONG, WELL AFTER ABOUT 3 MONTHS I FELT LIKE I DIDNT NEED THE KLONOPIN EITHER SO I STOPPED TAKING IT. WELL NOW I AM A DOCTOR MADE EPILEPTIC AND HAVE TO TAKE MEDICINE FOR SEIZURES THE REST OF MY LIFE.I NEVER HAD SEIZUREE AT ALL NOW I HAVE GRAN-MAL ( THE KIND THAT MAKE YOU BLACK OUT SHAKE RATTLE & ROLLBITE YOUR TONGUE AND MAYBE EVEN SHIT YOUR PANTS) I WOULD RATHER BE FUCKING CRAZY THAN GO THRU THIS SHIT. AND YOU KNOW WHAT I STILL HAVE DEPRESSION AND ANXIETY.NOW THAT I LOOK BACK I COULD OF EASILY LIVED WITH THE WAY I FELT BEFORE I WENT TO THAT PIECE OF SHIT DOCTOR. SO A WORD OF ADVICE DONT LOOK TO LIFES PROBLEMS TO BE RELIEVED BY A PILL( I BET NONE OF YOUR DOCTORS HAVE WARNED YOU ABOUT THESE TYPES OF MEDS)
wow, i am horribly shocked to have heard your story paul! i have been on klonopin for close to 10 yrs now. i am bipolar with anxiety disorder and after years of xanax and ativan, dr. recommonded klonopin to me. i have had it every which way, with depakote, and a slew of other anti-depressants....so far, im doin ok on it. i am currently on 2mg. at bed w/ 30 mg. remeron. and i have been up to 10 mg. klonopin per day when things were REAL bad. some days i do not take it at all. i did get off all meds about a year ago, thinking i may want to get pregnant, but was only off of klonopin about 6 weeks. i had terrible panic attacks and dr. put me back on....i am wondering if i were to ever go back off it..(which i am considering) would my body revert back to panic attacks, or would i have severe withdrawal...
Posted by Ellis on June 2, 1999, at 22:36:19
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc...., posted by michele on June 2, 1999, at 18:47:41
> > > YOU HAVE TO BE OUT OF YOUR FUCKING MIND TO TAKE ANTI-EPILEPTIC MEDICINES FOR MOOD DISORDERS(KLONOPIN,DEPAKOTE,NEURONTIN ETC...) A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO I WAS PRESCRIBED KLONOPIN BY A SHRINK (MAY HE AND HIS FAMILY BURN IN HELL)FOR ANXIETY AND ALSO PAXIL WHICH I DIDNT TAKE VERY LONG, WELL AFTER ABOUT 3 MONTHS I FELT LIKE I DIDNT NEED THE KLONOPIN EITHER SO I STOPPED TAKING IT. WELL NOW I AM A DOCTOR MADE EPILEPTIC AND HAVE TO TAKE MEDICINE FOR SEIZURES THE REST OF MY LIFE.I NEVER HAD SEIZUREE AT ALL NOW I HAVE GRAN-MAL ( THE KIND THAT MAKE YOU BLACK OUT SHAKE RATTLE & ROLLBITE YOUR TONGUE AND MAYBE EVEN SHIT YOUR PANTS) I WOULD RATHER BE FUCKING CRAZY THAN GO THRU THIS SHIT. AND YOU KNOW WHAT I STILL HAVE DEPRESSION AND ANXIETY.NOW THAT I LOOK BACK I COULD OF EASILY LIVED WITH THE WAY I FELT BEFORE I WENT TO THAT PIECE OF SHIT DOCTOR. SO A WORD OF ADVICE DONT LOOK TO LIFES PROBLEMS TO BE RELIEVED BY A PILL( I BET NONE OF YOUR DOCTORS HAVE WARNED YOU ABOUT THESE TYPES OF MEDS)
>
>
> wow, i am horribly shocked to have heard your story paul! i have been on klonopin for close to 10 yrs now. i am bipolar with anxiety disorder and after years of xanax and ativan, dr. recommonded klonopin to me. i have had it every which way, with depakote, and a slew of other anti-depressants....so far, im doin ok on it. i am currently on 2mg. at bed w/ 30 mg. remeron. and i have been up to 10 mg. klonopin per day when things were REAL bad. some days i do not take it at all. i did get off all meds about a year ago, thinking i may want to get pregnant, but was only off of klonopin about 6 weeks. i had terrible panic attacks and dr. put me back on....i am wondering if i were to ever go back off it..(which i am considering) would my body revert back to panic attacks, or would i have severe withdrawal...
Is there anyone who has had to get off of a drug for pregnancy? I want to get pregnant within the next 3 years but am afraid to get off of the depakote and neurontin. I don't think I could handle 9 months of depression and/or suicidal thoughts. What would my chemical imbalances do to the baby as well?
Posted by Ellis on June 2, 1999, at 22:40:25
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc...., posted by Elizabeth on January 7, 1999, at 15:12:10
Elizabeth,
How have you fared on the neurontin? I just started it two weeks ago and would like to hear from someone who has been on it for awhile...
> I just started Neurontin 200 mg 2x/300 mg at bedtime. I also take Zoloft 150 mg. I don't notice anything in particular.
> However, I do feel calm and less jittery. I have been diagnosed with bipolarII. I also notice that my craving for alcohol has been
> eliminated. I used to feel I needed something, anything, to cut the high strung moods that were almost constant. I was leary of going
> on a mood stabilizer because of weight gain. I just started a new excercise regime. I'll post in a month to let you know how it's going. Thanks. Elizabeth
Posted by Ellen Brodie on June 13, 1999, at 6:45:00
In reply to Re: mood disorders/klonopin,depakote,neurontin etc...., posted by Ellis on June 2, 1999, at 22:36:19
> > > In reading all the reaction to all the drugs it's hard to know what works for who. I am starting to believe this drug shit is for the birds. I have been diagnosed with bipolar. I have been on 150 mg of Topomax, and 25 mg of klonopin. I have recently started on Neurontin because my anxiety is so bad. I want to get off the damn Klonopin. I am thinking it;s the topamax that has increased the anxiety. Try convincing my doc of that. Although I have lowered my dosage of the topamax to 100mg to see if the anxiety lessons.
I think that med is for the bird. I have lost a lot of weight on that drug which of course they have given me shit about. So it is a no win situation. What have others experienced with neurontin in terms of anxiety and how much and when do you take it. I am just starting on 300mg at bedtime so I am sure that I won't see a change right away. Any info would be appreciated. Thanks Ellen
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